4 ms·

Crystal won't take off because it's an "amateur" language, to have a good and properly supported language you need a lot of poeple and money, which Crystal has

by Thaxll 3y ago

Crystal won't take off because it's an "amateur" language, to have a good and properly supported language you need a lot of poeple and money, which Crystal has not. I would not rely my business on a language where there is just one full time dev working on it and relying on donations.

rco8786 3y ago
This reads a bit like a tautology..."Crystal has not taken off because Crystal has not taken off".
- Thaxll 3y ago
  Crystal has been going on for years and there is still no major support, it won't change, basically if you're a new lanague you have a couple of years after that you just missed the train.
  - nindalf 3y ago
    Not historically true. Python didn't take off for years after the initial release in 1991. Even in the mid 2000s people were evangelising Python like it was a new thing (https://xkcd.com/353/ https://xkcd.com/353/) Or take Rust, which has gained adoption more recently. It took a while to get going after the 1.0 release in 2015. If you look at daily downloads of Rust crates (https://lib.rs/stats https://lib.rs/stats) as a proxy for adoption: - 2015 to 2017 - not many downloads - 2018 - first signs of real growth, reaches 1M per day. - 2018 to 2021 - 10x growth, 10M per day - 2021 to 2024 - 10x growth (projected) So new languages shouldn't lose hope if they don't see adoption immediately. It's possible that they might be adopted later. But for language authors, it's the hope that kills you. You continue working on it even if maybe you shouldn't.
    - viraptor 3y ago
      Another one: nix started in 2003 but hasn't really entered the common usage/popularity until the last 4 (or so) years as far as I can tell.
    - ModernMech 3y ago
      Define "shouldn't". Working on a language is a gift in itself.
      - nindalf 3y ago
        Sure, let me define "shouldn't". For those authors who hope to see their language become mainstream and achieve widespread adoption, they may want to cut their losses. If they're working on it for intrinsic reward they should continue, by all means.
- avg_dev 3y ago
  I'm not sure that I agree with the poster you are replying to, that Crystal won't take off, but I'm pretty sure that the statement "Crystal has not taken off because Crystal has not taken off" is kind of useful/valid/worthwhile. I believe that this is how network effects work. I also am pretty sure I read about someone here on HN who used Crystal to build the code for their profitable cookie baking/selling business (the baked goods). I can't recall the details exactly. Edit: Here it is: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23433847 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23433847
- dragonwriter 3y ago
  No, its quite possible for a language to have strong backing before it takes off (C#, JavaScript, Go, Swift, Dart, Rust all did, to varying extents, from day one) and those tend to also be the langauges that take off quickly. Other languages struggle until they attract either a sufficient mass of distributed backing or the one key backer that gives it the level of support and visibility that supports the adoption curve taking off, and most never reach that point.
stakhanov 3y ago
> because it's an "amateur" language Python was an amateur language until it was not.
- pritambarhate 3y ago
  Yes and Python (released in 1991) took a lot more time to become popular compared to Java (released in 1995) which was corporate backed. Python still seems to have funding issues. For example, JS (backed by multiple big corporations) performance has improved a lot compared to Python. The main Python implementation doesn't have a proper JIT as far as I know. So it shows the difference between amateur languages and corporate backed languages.
  - hgs3 3y ago
    > Yes and Python (released in 1991) took a lot more time to become popular compared to Java (released in 1995) which was corporate backed. Being corporate backed is the real answer. Languages that became popular through grassroots support are the exception, not the rule.
- capableweb 3y ago
  Even Rust started as a "amateur" language until it was picked up by Rust. Nothing is saying that Crystal won't be picked up just like Rust was, by some company.
  - Iwan-Zotow 3y ago
    > Even Rust started as a "amateur" language until it was picked up by Rust ?!?
    - mega-tux 3y ago
      Mozilla maybe?
      - capableweb 3y ago

by Thaxll 3y ago

rco8786 3y ago

This reads a bit like a tautology..."Crystal has not taken off because Crystal has not taken off".

Thaxll 3y ago
Crystal has been going on for years and there is still no major support, it won't change, basically if you're a new lanague you have a couple of years after that you just missed the train.
- nindalf 3y ago
  Not historically true. Python didn't take off for years after the initial release in 1991. Even in the mid 2000s people were evangelising Python like it was a new thing (https://xkcd.com/353/ https://xkcd.com/353/) Or take Rust, which has gained adoption more recently. It took a while to get going after the 1.0 release in 2015. If you look at daily downloads of Rust crates (https://lib.rs/stats https://lib.rs/stats) as a proxy for adoption: - 2015 to 2017 - not many downloads - 2018 - first signs of real growth, reaches 1M per day. - 2018 to 2021 - 10x growth, 10M per day - 2021 to 2024 - 10x growth (projected) So new languages shouldn't lose hope if they don't see adoption immediately. It's possible that they might be adopted later. But for language authors, it's the hope that kills you. You continue working on it even if maybe you shouldn't.
  - viraptor 3y ago
    Another one: nix started in 2003 but hasn't really entered the common usage/popularity until the last 4 (or so) years as far as I can tell.
  - ModernMech 3y ago
    Define "shouldn't". Working on a language is a gift in itself.
    - nindalf 3y ago
      Sure, let me define "shouldn't". For those authors who hope to see their language become mainstream and achieve widespread adoption, they may want to cut their losses. If they're working on it for intrinsic reward they should continue, by all means.
avg_dev 3y ago
I'm not sure that I agree with the poster you are replying to, that Crystal won't take off, but I'm pretty sure that the statement "Crystal has not taken off because Crystal has not taken off" is kind of useful/valid/worthwhile. I believe that this is how network effects work. I also am pretty sure I read about someone here on HN who used Crystal to build the code for their profitable cookie baking/selling business (the baked goods). I can't recall the details exactly. Edit: Here it is: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23433847 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23433847
dragonwriter 3y ago
No, its quite possible for a language to have strong backing before it takes off (C#, JavaScript, Go, Swift, Dart, Rust all did, to varying extents, from day one) and those tend to also be the langauges that take off quickly. Other languages struggle until they attract either a sufficient mass of distributed backing or the one key backer that gives it the level of support and visibility that supports the adoption curve taking off, and most never reach that point.

stakhanov 3y ago

> because it's an "amateur" language Python was an amateur language until it was not.

pritambarhate 3y ago
Yes and Python (released in 1991) took a lot more time to become popular compared to Java (released in 1995) which was corporate backed. Python still seems to have funding issues. For example, JS (backed by multiple big corporations) performance has improved a lot compared to Python. The main Python implementation doesn't have a proper JIT as far as I know. So it shows the difference between amateur languages and corporate backed languages.
- hgs3 3y ago
  > Yes and Python (released in 1991) took a lot more time to become popular compared to Java (released in 1995) which was corporate backed. Being corporate backed is the real answer. Languages that became popular through grassroots support are the exception, not the rule.
capableweb 3y ago
Even Rust started as a "amateur" language until it was picked up by Rust. Nothing is saying that Crystal won't be picked up just like Rust was, by some company.
- Iwan-Zotow 3y ago
  > Even Rust started as a "amateur" language until it was picked up by Rust ?!?
  - mega-tux 3y ago
    Mozilla maybe?
    - capableweb 3y ago