4 ms·

Incredible how much is a Bay Area is a superfund.

atgreen 3y ago
Yes, they went from poisoning the earth to poisoning our brains. There was a golden era in the middle that I will always remember fondly.
hanniabu 3y ago
Not-so-fun fact: When superfund sites are cleaned up, there's no monitoring of what is done with the waste. I wouldn't be surprised if the soil removed is then just sold to construction projects than need fill.
- aurizon 3y ago
  Often soil is washed with solvents to remove the Dense Non Aqueous Polar Liquids (DNAPL). These are chloro/fluoro - carbon liquids that settle down to the bottom of the water table and flow downhill over many years - deep in the ground, and finally emerge as a DNAPL 'spring' on a river bank. Many of the super fund sites are these. Here is the rabbit hole for them https://www.google.com/search?q=DNAPL+super+fund&rlz=1C1CHBF_enCA924CA924&oq=DNAPL+super+fund&aqs=chrome..69i57.10034j0j15&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.com/search?q=DNAPL+super+fund&rlz=1C1CHBF...
- idiotsecant 3y ago
  https://www.epa.gov/superfund/superfund-waste-management https://www.epa.gov/superfund/superfund-waste-management there are a lot of regulations around what monitoring and remediation is required for superfund waste material.
- greenie_beans 3y ago
  they probably ship it on a train to poor states like Alabama (kinda like this: https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/04/18/603718526/the-poop-trains-reign-of-terror-in-small-town-alabama-has-ended https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/04/18/603718526...). Alabama doesn't give a fuck about the environment even though we have the most ecological diverse state in the country.
ck2 3y ago
Probably ever major city for the past century. Heck I am in a small city and we have one. Privatize the profits, socialize the costs (like toxic cleanup). It's literally the American way.
- passerby1 3y ago
  > Privatize the profits, socialize the costs (like toxic cleanup). Any business would love to do the same, if possible. Because that's the businesss: increase the profits. Should it then be considered a "natural" way? And where should we draw a line (if any) on what's ok?
- robertlagrant 3y ago
  > Privatize the profits, socialize the costs (like toxic cleanup). Of course you privatise the profits. Profits come after public taxes.
  - nervousvarun 3y ago
    You mention taxes, that's part of the issue here. In America we aren't particularly good market capitalists and bail out corporations (see 2008) when they fail and then generally never have any sort of similar process for when they succeed (see Big Energy companies right now). So we're all for market capitalism when things are going well...but not when they're going poorly. The concept that seems to be missing/underused is "windfall tax". Google tells me we tried it in 1980 under Carter and apparently did a horrendous job of it but the concept seems sound enough.
    - robertlagrant 3y ago
      I'm not sure I understand. I'm saying one of the first things we do is take tax. So we always get taxes, but businesses don't always get profits. And by definition those profits are private, because the government has already taken money out. Profits are what's left after doing things useful enough people voluntarily pay for them, paying others for their share in achieving that, and then the government taking the amount of money it decides it wants to take. How could the leftovers not be private?
asdfman123 3y ago
You should see Houston

Yes, they went from poisoning the earth to poisoning our brains. There was a golden era in the middle that I will always remember fondly.

hanniabu 3y ago

Not-so-fun fact: When superfund sites are cleaned up, there's no monitoring of what is done with the waste. I wouldn't be surprised if the soil removed is then just sold to construction projects than need fill.

aurizon 3y ago
Often soil is washed with solvents to remove the Dense Non Aqueous Polar Liquids (DNAPL). These are chloro/fluoro - carbon liquids that settle down to the bottom of the water table and flow downhill over many years - deep in the ground, and finally emerge as a DNAPL 'spring' on a river bank. Many of the super fund sites are these. Here is the rabbit hole for them https://www.google.com/search?q=DNAPL+super+fund&rlz=1C1CHBF_enCA924CA924&oq=DNAPL+super+fund&aqs=chrome..69i57.10034j0j15&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.com/search?q=DNAPL+super+fund&rlz=1C1CHBF...
idiotsecant 3y ago
https://www.epa.gov/superfund/superfund-waste-management https://www.epa.gov/superfund/superfund-waste-management there are a lot of regulations around what monitoring and remediation is required for superfund waste material.
greenie_beans 3y ago
they probably ship it on a train to poor states like Alabama (kinda like this: https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/04/18/603718526/the-poop-trains-reign-of-terror-in-small-town-alabama-has-ended https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/04/18/603718526...). Alabama doesn't give a fuck about the environment even though we have the most ecological diverse state in the country.

ck2 3y ago

Probably ever major city for the past century. Heck I am in a small city and we have one. Privatize the profits, socialize the costs (like toxic cleanup). It's literally the American way.

passerby1 3y ago
> Privatize the profits, socialize the costs (like toxic cleanup). Any business would love to do the same, if possible. Because that's the businesss: increase the profits. Should it then be considered a "natural" way? And where should we draw a line (if any) on what's ok?
robertlagrant 3y ago
> Privatize the profits, socialize the costs (like toxic cleanup). Of course you privatise the profits. Profits come after public taxes.
- nervousvarun 3y ago
  You mention taxes, that's part of the issue here. In America we aren't particularly good market capitalists and bail out corporations (see 2008) when they fail and then generally never have any sort of similar process for when they succeed (see Big Energy companies right now). So we're all for market capitalism when things are going well...but not when they're going poorly. The concept that seems to be missing/underused is "windfall tax". Google tells me we tried it in 1980 under Carter and apparently did a horrendous job of it but the concept seems sound enough.
  - robertlagrant 3y ago
    I'm not sure I understand. I'm saying one of the first things we do is take tax. So we always get taxes, but businesses don't always get profits. And by definition those profits are private, because the government has already taken money out. Profits are what's left after doing things useful enough people voluntarily pay for them, paying others for their share in achieving that, and then the government taking the amount of money it decides it wants to take. How could the leftovers not be private?

asdfman123 3y ago

You should see Houston