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> But I don't want to live in the US. I want to live here. And if you follow indices that measure quality of life, security, democracy, freedom etc. it is easy

> But I don't want to live in the US. I want to live here. And if you follow indices that measure quality of life, security, democracy, freedom etc. it is easy to see why If you go by the internet metrics that are vastly skewed to be anti capitalist, then sure. In reality, US is very much "make your own life". We have conservative areas, liberal areas, and everything in between. You can live in a busy city, or you can live very remotely. Objectively speaking, if you take your salary+benefits-taxes in US versus salary+benefits-taxes in EU, the only way EU wins is if you are still in early stages of career and start having kids.

bborud 4y ago
So Norway is anti-capitalist? Uh. Right.
- ActorNightly 4y ago
  I don't understand how you infer that from what I said.
  - bborud 4y ago
    I can see how you might think that. It is easy to think that adequate wealth is a goal in itself. Especially if you either do not have adequate wealth or you become caught up in securing that level of wealth even after you are there. Wealth gives you the things you really care about. Such as freedom and security which ultimately enables happiness and contentment. (Enables, not provides). It is easier to see from the flip side: if you lack freedom and security, what good is wealth? You're just a prisoner with a somewhat nicer cage. If you see wealth as a goal in itself, then it just means you probably haven't actually got a plan for why you are chasing wealth.
    - ActorNightly 3y ago
      Pretty sure US is the most "free" country by standard metrics. You can do a lot of stuff in US that you cannot do in other countries.
      - bborud 3y ago
        It doesn't matter what you are "pretty sure" about. There are organizations that try to quantify these things and produce concrete metrics, and it might surprise you to learn that they don't necessarily agree with your world view.
pipes 4y ago
I'm in the UK and that's my impression of the USA. How ever most people I talk to here seem to think that the USA is some gun ridden bible bashing hell hole. I remember trying to persuade some one that "no really the USA has separation of church and state", they basically didn't believe me and seemed to think the UK had a more secular set up (we have church of England and king is head of that church)
- laurencerowe 4y ago
  I'm a Brit and have lived in the US for 10 years now. While the US has the more secular constitution, culturally and politically religion is far more influential in the US than the UK. Since the late 1970s the Republican Party began courting white evangelicals and it is now heavily associated with their beliefs. Republican Supreme Court Justices have opened the way for Republican controlled states to ban abortion and I expect we will see pregnant women die in these states as they are unable to access appropriate healthcare much as they did in Ireland until relatively recently. The secular nature of the US constitution was designed to protect religious freedom while in the UK religion was subjugated to the interests of the state - the Church of England was setup so that the King could get a divorce after all!
rgavuliak 4y ago
I have spent a good deal of time in the US during my previous job. To some extent I agree that the US has a lot of opportunity (not just work, but food, culture etc.) and it was great being there. At the same time I can walk the streets of a bigger city in the EU without running into a homeless village and/or a homeless person harassing passer-bys if I make the wrong turn. And more importantly I can walk. I can take a tram to the city center and have a beer, not site in an Uber or my car for 1 hour in case I live in a nice gated community in the suburbs.

bborud 4y ago

So Norway is anti-capitalist? Uh. Right.

ActorNightly 4y ago
I don't understand how you infer that from what I said.
- bborud 4y ago
  I can see how you might think that. It is easy to think that adequate wealth is a goal in itself. Especially if you either do not have adequate wealth or you become caught up in securing that level of wealth even after you are there. Wealth gives you the things you really care about. Such as freedom and security which ultimately enables happiness and contentment. (Enables, not provides). It is easier to see from the flip side: if you lack freedom and security, what good is wealth? You're just a prisoner with a somewhat nicer cage. If you see wealth as a goal in itself, then it just means you probably haven't actually got a plan for why you are chasing wealth.
  - ActorNightly 3y ago
    Pretty sure US is the most "free" country by standard metrics. You can do a lot of stuff in US that you cannot do in other countries.
    - bborud 3y ago
      It doesn't matter what you are "pretty sure" about. There are organizations that try to quantify these things and produce concrete metrics, and it might surprise you to learn that they don't necessarily agree with your world view.

pipes 4y ago

I'm in the UK and that's my impression of the USA. How ever most people I talk to here seem to think that the USA is some gun ridden bible bashing hell hole. I remember trying to persuade some one that "no really the USA has separation of church and state", they basically didn't believe me and seemed to think the UK had a more secular set up (we have church of England and king is head of that church)

laurencerowe 4y ago
I'm a Brit and have lived in the US for 10 years now. While the US has the more secular constitution, culturally and politically religion is far more influential in the US than the UK. Since the late 1970s the Republican Party began courting white evangelicals and it is now heavily associated with their beliefs. Republican Supreme Court Justices have opened the way for Republican controlled states to ban abortion and I expect we will see pregnant women die in these states as they are unable to access appropriate healthcare much as they did in Ireland until relatively recently. The secular nature of the US constitution was designed to protect religious freedom while in the UK religion was subjugated to the interests of the state - the Church of England was setup so that the King could get a divorce after all!

rgavuliak 4y ago

I have spent a good deal of time in the US during my previous job. To some extent I agree that the US has a lot of opportunity (not just work, but food, culture etc.) and it was great being there. At the same time I can walk the streets of a bigger city in the EU without running into a homeless village and/or a homeless person harassing passer-bys if I make the wrong turn. And more importantly I can walk. I can take a tram to the city center and have a beer, not site in an Uber or my car for 1 hour in case I live in a nice gated community in the suburbs.