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> I don’t want [my car] to be connected [...] to the internet Really? No remote access, security notifications, navigation facilities? No watching TV while c

by ajross 4y ago

> I don’t want [my car] to be connected [...] to the internet Really? No remote access, security notifications, navigation facilities? No watching TV while charging? No OTA updates that obviate the need to take it to the dealership for routine fixes? No open source location analytic API? I mean, I'm sure there's some bad stuff that happens too. But this is very much throwing out the baby with the bathwater. I won't tell you what you, personally, want in a vehicle. But the market as a whole absolutely wants their cars on the internet.

BanazirGalbasi 4y ago
Why would I want remote access to my car? Why should my car need security notifications? And if I'm charging, I can use that as an opportunity to get out of the car, or catch up on notifications I've ignored for the last several hours. Every routine fix that I've seen on a car has been something mechanical, which either I can do myself (e.g. oil and bulb changes) or I have to take into a shop anyway. The only semi-valid reason for connectivity here is navigation, but even then I'm already paying for a connection for my phone so I'll use that instead. I don't even want a big screen on the dashboard anyway, which means having navigation software built-in would be a worse experience than using what I already have.
- HDThoreaun 4y ago
  Remote start is extremely popular in cold or very hot climates so that the car feels nice when you get in.
iainmerrick 4y ago
Most of that you get better with your phone; the rest, I don't have, don't feel the lack, and wouldn't think to look for in a new car.
bentcorner 4y ago
Security notifications is probably the only thing on that list that actually requires internet (or some kind of connectivity). Even remote start doesn't need to be internet connected. Everything else can be solved using your phone/tablet. And yes, it undoubtedly would be a nicer experience to have navigation done entirely on the in-car display. But IMO in-car displays and interfaces are universally terrible.
aidenn0 4y ago
> Really? No remote access, security notifications, navigation facilities? No watching TV while charging? No OTA updates that obviate the need to take it to the dealership for routine fixes? No open source location analytic API? I've never owned a car that does any of these. I'm very happy with my car. I do not see the benefits of them outweighing the downsides.
wcarron 4y ago
IT. IS. A. CAR! It takes you from Point A to Point B! Nobody needs to watch TV in their car! Nobody needs subscription services for heated seats or 0.2s off your 0-60mph time! Nobody needs cameras replacing their sideview mirrors! Get rid off all this bullshit in vehicles. 6-speed manual, adjustable seats, a GPS/nav screen and radio/aux, and a damn cupholder is all anyone needs from a car. Everything else is just a bunch of accessorial crap that usually detracts from the form factor of a functional car.
- bluGill 4y ago
  I don't even want the GPS: my phone already has maps that are better than what is in the car: they update in real time for current traffic.
  - wcarron 4y ago
    Sure, even that's a luxury, but cars already have a display for audio, and it makes sense to have an in-built nav system (would be great if you could simply select the mapping/nav software from a list like a: goog, b: apple, c: OSM, and have it only do directions). This reduces the need for a 2nd, handheld or mounted device which has the potential for increased distraction. Navigation is a core function of travel, which is the primary purpose of a vehicle.
    - ShroudedNight 4y ago
      Why do you need direct access to your phone? Just dock the phone and have the screen work like Samsung's Dex.
      - wcarron 4y ago
        You... don't? That was my point. A dock works fine, too, I guess.
    - bluGill 4y ago
      A bluetooth standard for navigation (turn left in 500 meters on adams street.) functions would be nice. The only thing I find my car nav does well is put that turn indication next to the speedometer so if I don't hear/understand the directions I can see it at a glance. Of course my only car with nav is 11 years old, maybe there are other features of more modern systems worth having. I doubt it, but I have to allow for the possibility. The real key here is the car is 11 years old - if you only buy new cars you may fail to realize how bad features such as nav age. When my car was new 3g cell networks were the fast service (4g existed but it was in the early roll out phase), and thus what I would expect my car to have: now 3g is gone - so even if my car had a NAV subscription it couldn't get OTA updates.
eep_social 4y ago
No, you’re understanding correctly. None of that is desirable. The baby is dead and should be disposed of.
piaste 4y ago
I may not mind too much having essentially an Android phone embedded in the dashboard (although I'll try to jailbreak it as much as I can, and cripple it if I can't). However, I REQUIRE an air gap between the Internet and any electronics that are involved in piloting the metal box that is currently transporting my squishy flesh at 130 km/h. So no, no self-driving Tesla for me. (As an aside, what kind of person gets excited over "open source location analytic API[s]"? Do you actively enjoy being tracked by your corporate overlords?)
alexb_ 4y ago
Nope, absolutely fucking none of that. The "baby" in here is not a baby, it is a gigantic pile of dogshit that seconds as a tracking device. I'm more than happy to get rid of all of it.
alpaca128 4y ago
> remote access, security notifications Or just don't put so much software in it that you need security updates for remote access in the first place, how about that? > navigation facilities? No watching TV while charging? Why would I pay to have the same features as my phone/tablet/laptop but with the added disadvantage of not having access outside the car?
- umeshunni 4y ago
  > remote access, security notifications > Or just don't put so much software in it that you need security updates for remote access in the first place, how about that? They're talking about being able to get notifications about the security of your car (e.g you left the trunk open, someone is opening the door etc). I'm guess you don't have a modern car, but having a security system for your car is super useful, especially if you live in left-leaning crime-friendly place like SF. > navigation facilities? No watching TV while charging? > Why would I pay to have the same features as my phone/tablet/laptop but with the added disadvantage of not having access outside the car? Because you can access it on a 15-30" screen rather than a 6" phone screen
  - ShroudedNight 4y ago
    > Because you can access it on a 15-30" screen rather than a 6" phone screen Displayport over usb-c would also solve this problem.
perryizgr8 4y ago
> No remote access What would that be useful for? If I am away from my car, I absolutely don't need to "access" it. It is not a home server or something like that. > security notifications What are those? Notify me that my car is being broken into? Maybe it is good-to-have, but far from crucial. > navigation facilities No thanks, I have a phone for that. I can connect it to my car's screen if needed. > No watching TV while charging? No, it just takes a couple of minutes to fill up. You should try one of these new-fangled internal combustion engine cars. They are amazing! > No OTA updates that obviate the need to take it to the dealership for routine fixes? What routine fixes? My car has never needed a software bugfix in the decade I have owned it. > No open source location analytic API? Huh??! Is this a satirical post I've fallen bait to?

by ajross 4y ago

BanazirGalbasi 4y ago

Why would I want remote access to my car? Why should my car need security notifications? And if I'm charging, I can use that as an opportunity to get out of the car, or catch up on notifications I've ignored for the last several hours. Every routine fix that I've seen on a car has been something mechanical, which either I can do myself (e.g. oil and bulb changes) or I have to take into a shop anyway. The only semi-valid reason for connectivity here is navigation, but even then I'm already paying for a connection for my phone so I'll use that instead. I don't even want a big screen on the dashboard anyway, which means having navigation software built-in would be a worse experience than using what I already have.

HDThoreaun 4y ago
Remote start is extremely popular in cold or very hot climates so that the car feels nice when you get in.

iainmerrick 4y ago

Most of that you get better with your phone; the rest, I don't have, don't feel the lack, and wouldn't think to look for in a new car.

bentcorner 4y ago

Security notifications is probably the only thing on that list that actually requires internet (or some kind of connectivity). Even remote start doesn't need to be internet connected. Everything else can be solved using your phone/tablet. And yes, it undoubtedly would be a nicer experience to have navigation done entirely on the in-car display. But IMO in-car displays and interfaces are universally terrible.

aidenn0 4y ago

> Really? No remote access, security notifications, navigation facilities? No watching TV while charging? No OTA updates that obviate the need to take it to the dealership for routine fixes? No open source location analytic API? I've never owned a car that does any of these. I'm very happy with my car. I do not see the benefits of them outweighing the downsides.

wcarron 4y ago

IT. IS. A. CAR! It takes you from Point A to Point B! Nobody needs to watch TV in their car! Nobody needs subscription services for heated seats or 0.2s off your 0-60mph time! Nobody needs cameras replacing their sideview mirrors! Get rid off all this bullshit in vehicles. 6-speed manual, adjustable seats, a GPS/nav screen and radio/aux, and a damn cupholder is all anyone needs from a car. Everything else is just a bunch of accessorial crap that usually detracts from the form factor of a functional car.

bluGill 4y ago
I don't even want the GPS: my phone already has maps that are better than what is in the car: they update in real time for current traffic.
- wcarron 4y ago
  Sure, even that's a luxury, but cars already have a display for audio, and it makes sense to have an in-built nav system (would be great if you could simply select the mapping/nav software from a list like a: goog, b: apple, c: OSM, and have it only do directions). This reduces the need for a 2nd, handheld or mounted device which has the potential for increased distraction. Navigation is a core function of travel, which is the primary purpose of a vehicle.
  - ShroudedNight 4y ago
    Why do you need direct access to your phone? Just dock the phone and have the screen work like Samsung's Dex.
    - wcarron 4y ago
      You... don't? That was my point. A dock works fine, too, I guess.
  - bluGill 4y ago
    A bluetooth standard for navigation (turn left in 500 meters on adams street.) functions would be nice. The only thing I find my car nav does well is put that turn indication next to the speedometer so if I don't hear/understand the directions I can see it at a glance. Of course my only car with nav is 11 years old, maybe there are other features of more modern systems worth having. I doubt it, but I have to allow for the possibility. The real key here is the car is 11 years old - if you only buy new cars you may fail to realize how bad features such as nav age. When my car was new 3g cell networks were the fast service (4g existed but it was in the early roll out phase), and thus what I would expect my car to have: now 3g is gone - so even if my car had a NAV subscription it couldn't get OTA updates.

eep_social 4y ago

No, you’re understanding correctly. None of that is desirable. The baby is dead and should be disposed of.

piaste 4y ago

I may not mind too much having essentially an Android phone embedded in the dashboard (although I'll try to jailbreak it as much as I can, and cripple it if I can't). However, I REQUIRE an air gap between the Internet and any electronics that are involved in piloting the metal box that is currently transporting my squishy flesh at 130 km/h. So no, no self-driving Tesla for me. (As an aside, what kind of person gets excited over "open source location analytic API[s]"? Do you actively enjoy being tracked by your corporate overlords?)

alexb_ 4y ago

Nope, absolutely fucking none of that. The "baby" in here is not a baby, it is a gigantic pile of dogshit that seconds as a tracking device. I'm more than happy to get rid of all of it.

alpaca128 4y ago

> remote access, security notifications Or just don't put so much software in it that you need security updates for remote access in the first place, how about that? > navigation facilities? No watching TV while charging? Why would I pay to have the same features as my phone/tablet/laptop but with the added disadvantage of not having access outside the car?

umeshunni 4y ago
> remote access, security notifications > Or just don't put so much software in it that you need security updates for remote access in the first place, how about that? They're talking about being able to get notifications about the security of your car (e.g you left the trunk open, someone is opening the door etc). I'm guess you don't have a modern car, but having a security system for your car is super useful, especially if you live in left-leaning crime-friendly place like SF. > navigation facilities? No watching TV while charging? > Why would I pay to have the same features as my phone/tablet/laptop but with the added disadvantage of not having access outside the car? Because you can access it on a 15-30" screen rather than a 6" phone screen
- ShroudedNight 4y ago
  > Because you can access it on a 15-30" screen rather than a 6" phone screen Displayport over usb-c would also solve this problem.

perryizgr8 4y ago

> No remote access What would that be useful for? If I am away from my car, I absolutely don't need to "access" it. It is not a home server or something like that. > security notifications What are those? Notify me that my car is being broken into? Maybe it is good-to-have, but far from crucial. > navigation facilities No thanks, I have a phone for that. I can connect it to my car's screen if needed. > No watching TV while charging? No, it just takes a couple of minutes to fill up. You should try one of these new-fangled internal combustion engine cars. They are amazing! > No OTA updates that obviate the need to take it to the dealership for routine fixes? What routine fixes? My car has never needed a software bugfix in the decade I have owned it. > No open source location analytic API? Huh??! Is this a satirical post I've fallen bait to?