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> Don't you want software upgrades? Yes, but that doesn't require I give up freedom or control. The number of years a vendor provides upgrades adds value to t

> Don't you want software upgrades? Yes, but that doesn't require I give up freedom or control. The number of years a vendor provides upgrades adds value to the product (i.e. long term commitment or not). The cost of a car is so ridiculous any more that expecting a lifetime of software updates is probably a rational demand from a consumer. > but a lot if for safety reasons Yes, so? I wrote software for vascular ultrasound devices in the 80s. Those could do really bad things to humans. Upgrades were provided for free and accounted for in the price of the product because... SAFETY IS NOT OPTIONAL and should never be relegated to a subscription where if you stop paying YOU ARE UNSAFE.

2rsf 3y ago
The current price reflects the expected software support, at some point it will be not economical and not feasible on the existing hardware. The best example is the interface- cellular 2G is not supported and 3G will go away one day. Vascular ultrasound devices are still supported because they were expensive, and support was probably paid on top of the initial price. The Mercedes HP subscription is not safety related, but it is true that at some point stopping updates will have some affects on safety, but don't forget that "legacy" cars locked you with its initial hardware and software, many times only later models upgraded safety feature based on experience.
- frumper 3y ago
  There is a difference between what we shipped is defective and that defect makes it unsafe and we could update it and bring new safety features. Defects are addressed in recalls, they are expensive, automakers plan for some amount of them, they should try to minimize that as much as possible, but recalls are screw ups, not bonus updates.
- indymike 3y ago
  > Vascular ultrasound devices are still supported because they were expensive, and support was probably paid on top of the initial price. I'm sure 80s and early 90s era vascular ultrasound devices are long obsolete, out of service and not supported. The point is cars are VERY expensive these day. It is ridiculous that a product that costs $35,000 has a $30/mo subscription for updates or features. This is majoring in the minors.

2rsf 3y ago

The current price reflects the expected software support, at some point it will be not economical and not feasible on the existing hardware. The best example is the interface- cellular 2G is not supported and 3G will go away one day. Vascular ultrasound devices are still supported because they were expensive, and support was probably paid on top of the initial price. The Mercedes HP subscription is not safety related, but it is true that at some point stopping updates will have some affects on safety, but don't forget that "legacy" cars locked you with its initial hardware and software, many times only later models upgraded safety feature based on experience.

frumper 3y ago
There is a difference between what we shipped is defective and that defect makes it unsafe and we could update it and bring new safety features. Defects are addressed in recalls, they are expensive, automakers plan for some amount of them, they should try to minimize that as much as possible, but recalls are screw ups, not bonus updates.
indymike 3y ago
> Vascular ultrasound devices are still supported because they were expensive, and support was probably paid on top of the initial price. I'm sure 80s and early 90s era vascular ultrasound devices are long obsolete, out of service and not supported. The point is cars are VERY expensive these day. It is ridiculous that a product that costs $35,000 has a $30/mo subscription for updates or features. This is majoring in the minors.