5 ms·

Microsoft is shoving their software down people's throats with impunity. Just yesterday I had to install VS Code for a Homebridge integration, and out of nowher

Microsoft is shoving their software down people's throats with impunity. Just yesterday I had to install VS Code for a Homebridge integration, and out of nowhere they slapped a Bing search bar bang in the middle of the desktop.

meindnoch 3y ago
[flagged]
- chakintosh 3y ago
  I usually go overboard with uninstalling anything related to Microsoft on my Windows installs (bar the OS obviously), but this time, I didn't have a say, the plugin required that.
croes 3y ago
Why not VS Codium?
- lifty 3y ago
  Is there any usability difference between the two?
  - smcl 3y ago
    There was something about some extensions (for debugging?) not working in Codium
  - npteljes 3y ago
    VS Codium and other forks don't (maybe can't) use the official VSCode extension market. Because a lot of goodness, like the ability to refactor and debug PHP, is coming from the extensions and the extension ecosystem, it can be a big deal.
    - zelphirkalt 3y ago
      However, one can still add that marketplace, if one wants to do so. So people could still have access to the same extensions (which might be a privacy and telemetry or spyware risk), but at least not have the in-built telemetry.
      - npteljes 3y ago
        That's good to know! I knew that MS forbids it, but it turns out that it's possible to still use the official Marketplace. Here's how: https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#howto-switch-marketplace https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#how...
      - easton 3y ago
        From a random VSCode SSH session I have open: > Found running server... > > * > * Visual Studio Code Server > * > * By using the software, you agree to > * the Visual Studio Code Server License Terms (https://aka.ms/vscode-server-license https://aka.ms/vscode-server-license) and > * the Microsoft Privacy Statement (https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/privacystatement https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/privacystatement). > * > Many of the interesting extensions (Microsoft's language plugins, the remote extension pack, the .NET debugger) are licensed only for use with Visual Studio Code. Even if you hook into the VSCode marketplace, they could sue. They probably won't unless you're rehosting VSCode externally or something, but the risk is something most companies probably don't want to take when the software is free as in beer anyway for the "real" builds. (And if you're telemetry sensitive... just block the domains? I know, easier said than done, but you can do it.)
  - lozenge 3y ago
    Initially you just didn't get Settings Sync as it uses a Microsoft account and you had to use a different extensions gallery (but the MS one still lets you download extensions as a file to install into Codium). Nowadays you also lose Remote Development, Codespaces, Pylance, some C# features, and various other MS authored extensions.
- zelphirkalt 3y ago
  Not answering for the GP: There are so many people out there, who should know better, or even do know better. Yet, for whatever reason install VS Code instead of VS Codium. Even when you inform people about the existence of VS Codium, they still don't move and keep using VS Code. It is like they do not even care at all. That this is even allowed to happen in organizations is already an oversight. It should not even be allowed to install VS Code on organization machines or use it to ever view or work on the code of an organization. To me it looks very unprofessional. It is like a shiny toy has been dangled in front of their eyes and they reach for it, never willing to let go of it, even when they are being told that there is telemetry and non-reproducible builds and whatever other mistreatment of them as useds. Like children they stick to their shiny toy, even if they could have the same features, same UI, just without built in telemetry. (And they can still install any extensions they want later, if they trust that extension or marketplace of extensions.) It is very similar to people installing Chrome instead of Ungoogled Chromium. I have personally experienced how uninformed people at a university went wide-eyed, thinking I was talking crazy stuff, when I told them that it should not be installed on university computers, since it is spyware. I wish I could get people to get off their behinds and improve the situation. But it is of course very difficult to always create awareness and people are so damn ignorant. Often I am not even suggesting, that they should switch to free software tools yet. They could literally have the same experience, but no, most of the time you cannot tell them anything and they continue to take us with them into dystopia of our own making as a society with collective uninformedness and ignorance.
  - aflag 3y ago
    Can you use all extensions available for vs code in vs codium? I thought the best ones, provided by ms, were vs code only.
    - sphars 3y ago
      Some extensions by Microsoft are proprietary (such as their C# debugger and C++ extension) and can only be used with VSCode. For other extensions, you may be able to use them. See the docs at https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#extensions-marketplace https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#ext...
tehbeard 3y ago
The bing search bar is from an Edge update via windows updates as I understand. Still unjustifiable, along with the mess they made of changing default apps/browsers in Win 11.
- chakintosh 3y ago
  Yep, that should be it, because among the dependencies there were a couple Windows updates.
can16358p 3y ago
I hate Microsoft though I highly doubt that the Bing search bar came from a Vscode installation. Are you sure it is the case?
- chakintosh 3y ago
  The dependences I was installing were for a plugin to control Xiaomi hygrometer through Homebridge to be able to use it in HomeKit. Among those packages there was VS Code (for some reason) some C++ redists, Python and some updates from Microsoft as well. But I can confirm the bar was official and from Microsoft. Upon uninstalling, those dependencies, the bar never appeared again.
- hnbad 3y ago
  "bar" is an overstatement if you like me were reading that as one of those early 2000s era browser toolbars. A recent Edge update added a fairly large and persistent Bing icon to the right end of the browser's menu bar. It uses a speech bubble design and is likely part of the push for AI chat powered Bing search. It's obnoxious that you can't hide it but it's more of an eyesore than an actual problem.
  - coffeeling 3y ago
    You can hide it. Settings->Sidebar->Discover
    - aaaronic 3y ago
      Finally! It was only hidable via a registry hack when it first came out.
    - hnbad 3y ago
      Oh thanks! Frankly the most annoying parts of it were that it made it harder to reach for the overflow menu (which was previously the right-most icon) and that it auto-opens the sidebar on hover delay (which then requires clicking to dismiss).
linuxdaemon 3y ago
I had been using Swiftkey on my iPhone and in the middle of typing something, my keys disappear and is replaced with, what is effectively, an ad to use "Microsoft Speech Recognition". Extremely annoying to be in the middle of typing something and having to say "no thanks" to extra MS crap they are trying to shove onto you. Previously, they also added a Bing AI button to the keyboard, but they did actually make a setting to disable that. Edit: Upon mentioning this to a coworker and digging into this a bit more, it may have been that I accidentally clicked the microphone to bring up that screen, and that it didn't target an ad. I'm not quite sure what happened though, so I'm leaving my comment as is :)

meindnoch 3y ago

[flagged]

chakintosh 3y ago
I usually go overboard with uninstalling anything related to Microsoft on my Windows installs (bar the OS obviously), but this time, I didn't have a say, the plugin required that.

croes 3y ago

Why not VS Codium?

lifty 3y ago
Is there any usability difference between the two?
- smcl 3y ago
  There was something about some extensions (for debugging?) not working in Codium
- npteljes 3y ago
  VS Codium and other forks don't (maybe can't) use the official VSCode extension market. Because a lot of goodness, like the ability to refactor and debug PHP, is coming from the extensions and the extension ecosystem, it can be a big deal.
  - zelphirkalt 3y ago
    However, one can still add that marketplace, if one wants to do so. So people could still have access to the same extensions (which might be a privacy and telemetry or spyware risk), but at least not have the in-built telemetry.
    - npteljes 3y ago
      That's good to know! I knew that MS forbids it, but it turns out that it's possible to still use the official Marketplace. Here's how: https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#howto-switch-marketplace https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#how...
    - easton 3y ago
      From a random VSCode SSH session I have open: > Found running server... > > * > * Visual Studio Code Server > * > * By using the software, you agree to > * the Visual Studio Code Server License Terms (https://aka.ms/vscode-server-license https://aka.ms/vscode-server-license) and > * the Microsoft Privacy Statement (https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/privacystatement https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/privacystatement). > * > Many of the interesting extensions (Microsoft's language plugins, the remote extension pack, the .NET debugger) are licensed only for use with Visual Studio Code. Even if you hook into the VSCode marketplace, they could sue. They probably won't unless you're rehosting VSCode externally or something, but the risk is something most companies probably don't want to take when the software is free as in beer anyway for the "real" builds. (And if you're telemetry sensitive... just block the domains? I know, easier said than done, but you can do it.)
- lozenge 3y ago
  Initially you just didn't get Settings Sync as it uses a Microsoft account and you had to use a different extensions gallery (but the MS one still lets you download extensions as a file to install into Codium). Nowadays you also lose Remote Development, Codespaces, Pylance, some C# features, and various other MS authored extensions.
zelphirkalt 3y ago
Not answering for the GP: There are so many people out there, who should know better, or even do know better. Yet, for whatever reason install VS Code instead of VS Codium. Even when you inform people about the existence of VS Codium, they still don't move and keep using VS Code. It is like they do not even care at all. That this is even allowed to happen in organizations is already an oversight. It should not even be allowed to install VS Code on organization machines or use it to ever view or work on the code of an organization. To me it looks very unprofessional. It is like a shiny toy has been dangled in front of their eyes and they reach for it, never willing to let go of it, even when they are being told that there is telemetry and non-reproducible builds and whatever other mistreatment of them as useds. Like children they stick to their shiny toy, even if they could have the same features, same UI, just without built in telemetry. (And they can still install any extensions they want later, if they trust that extension or marketplace of extensions.) It is very similar to people installing Chrome instead of Ungoogled Chromium. I have personally experienced how uninformed people at a university went wide-eyed, thinking I was talking crazy stuff, when I told them that it should not be installed on university computers, since it is spyware. I wish I could get people to get off their behinds and improve the situation. But it is of course very difficult to always create awareness and people are so damn ignorant. Often I am not even suggesting, that they should switch to free software tools yet. They could literally have the same experience, but no, most of the time you cannot tell them anything and they continue to take us with them into dystopia of our own making as a society with collective uninformedness and ignorance.
- aflag 3y ago
  Can you use all extensions available for vs code in vs codium? I thought the best ones, provided by ms, were vs code only.
  - sphars 3y ago
    Some extensions by Microsoft are proprietary (such as their C# debugger and C++ extension) and can only be used with VSCode. For other extensions, you may be able to use them. See the docs at https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#extensions-marketplace https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#ext...

tehbeard 3y ago

The bing search bar is from an Edge update via windows updates as I understand. Still unjustifiable, along with the mess they made of changing default apps/browsers in Win 11.

chakintosh 3y ago
Yep, that should be it, because among the dependencies there were a couple Windows updates.

can16358p 3y ago

I hate Microsoft though I highly doubt that the Bing search bar came from a Vscode installation. Are you sure it is the case?

chakintosh 3y ago
The dependences I was installing were for a plugin to control Xiaomi hygrometer through Homebridge to be able to use it in HomeKit. Among those packages there was VS Code (for some reason) some C++ redists, Python and some updates from Microsoft as well. But I can confirm the bar was official and from Microsoft. Upon uninstalling, those dependencies, the bar never appeared again.
hnbad 3y ago
"bar" is an overstatement if you like me were reading that as one of those early 2000s era browser toolbars. A recent Edge update added a fairly large and persistent Bing icon to the right end of the browser's menu bar. It uses a speech bubble design and is likely part of the push for AI chat powered Bing search. It's obnoxious that you can't hide it but it's more of an eyesore than an actual problem.
- coffeeling 3y ago
  You can hide it. Settings->Sidebar->Discover
  - aaaronic 3y ago
    Finally! It was only hidable via a registry hack when it first came out.
  - hnbad 3y ago
    Oh thanks! Frankly the most annoying parts of it were that it made it harder to reach for the overflow menu (which was previously the right-most icon) and that it auto-opens the sidebar on hover delay (which then requires clicking to dismiss).

linuxdaemon 3y ago

I had been using Swiftkey on my iPhone and in the middle of typing something, my keys disappear and is replaced with, what is effectively, an ad to use "Microsoft Speech Recognition". Extremely annoying to be in the middle of typing something and having to say "no thanks" to extra MS crap they are trying to shove onto you. Previously, they also added a Bing AI button to the keyboard, but they did actually make a setting to disable that. Edit: Upon mentioning this to a coworker and digging into this a bit more, it may have been that I accidentally clicked the microphone to bring up that screen, and that it didn't target an ad. I'm not quite sure what happened though, so I'm leaving my comment as is :)