7 ms·

Probably an advantage many places would have over somewhere like the US which is quite fragmented and struggles to consistently coordinate in solving broad prob

by prawn 3y ago

Probably an advantage many places would have over somewhere like the US which is quite fragmented and struggles to consistently coordinate in solving broad problems. I always remember just 2-3 years ago, driving onto a toll road in the eastern USA and there was an attendant at the booth. You paid them in notes/coins, and the attendant got the coins in their hand, leant out of their box and deposited them in a payment slot to raise the boom gate. I'm sure there was some rationale, but it was pretty bizarre.

jcranmer 3y ago
That's not really a coordination problem, that's just a toll road that's not yet moved to all-electronic tolling. Of course, toll roads in the US do provide a coordination problem, and that's in the existence of noncompatible electronic toll systems. You have essentially three islands of interoperability in the US: the Northeast and Midwest are all using E-ZPass, the Southeast has some interoperability, and Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas all have a compatible system, with several other states having systems interoperable with no one else. There actually was a law passed in 2012 that required all the toll systems to be compatible by 2016, but obviously, we're 7 years past that deadline and all that happened was Minnesota, North Carolina, and Florida joined E-ZPass as well (and Georgia is coming soon™ for a few years now).
- prawn 3y ago
  Yes, bit of a mixture. Sorry, I should've mentioned that (from memory) it was because they didn't have banknote readers or credit card payment and the US is still using dollar bills. So unless you had a bucket of very low denomination coins, you had to pay a physical person to then convert to coins and reach around to deposit them. I once used a toll bridge in the Eastern US that had no indication of payment options (outside of a pass like the one you mentioned), no lane to escape once it was clear you had no alternatives, and then no method of paying the toll online after the fact. The only option I had was to wait to be issued a charge via the rental agency ($30+) and pay that once back in Australia.
  - ghaff 3y ago
    It almost doesn't matter in the US at this point as I basically don't use cash any longer but I mostly dislike $1/$2-ish coin denominations. It's a big enough amount that I can't basically ignore their existence but I can't stick them in a wallet. Like the penny silliness--or really the fact that the US basically collectively decided that the currency denominations in widespread use in 1950 would be fine forever--it's essentially a self-correcting situation in that a lot of people don't use cash any longer.
- inferiorhuman 3y ago
  That law provided neither penalties nor funding for improving ETC compatibility, so it's no wonder most states haven't bothered. California, for instance, already has statewide interop – and has for decades. In fact you can use your transponder for parking at SFO. I believe the various toll agencies out here have been issuing "6C" compatible transponders since 2019 with the goal of completely phasing out the old "Title 21" transponders by 2024. ISO/IEC 18000-63 (6C) is being used by Washington, Colorado, Utah, Kentucky, Indiana, Georgia, North Carolina, and Louisiana. For someone doing a lot of interstate driving NationalPass already offers transponders that are compatible with a bunch of different systems (E-ZPass, TxTag, Title 21, and EZ-TAG), supposedly also including 6C so there's that.

by prawn 3y ago

jcranmer 3y ago

That's not really a coordination problem, that's just a toll road that's not yet moved to all-electronic tolling. Of course, toll roads in the US do provide a coordination problem, and that's in the existence of noncompatible electronic toll systems. You have essentially three islands of interoperability in the US: the Northeast and Midwest are all using E-ZPass, the Southeast has some interoperability, and Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas all have a compatible system, with several other states having systems interoperable with no one else. There actually was a law passed in 2012 that required all the toll systems to be compatible by 2016, but obviously, we're 7 years past that deadline and all that happened was Minnesota, North Carolina, and Florida joined E-ZPass as well (and Georgia is coming soon™ for a few years now).

prawn 3y ago
Yes, bit of a mixture. Sorry, I should've mentioned that (from memory) it was because they didn't have banknote readers or credit card payment and the US is still using dollar bills. So unless you had a bucket of very low denomination coins, you had to pay a physical person to then convert to coins and reach around to deposit them. I once used a toll bridge in the Eastern US that had no indication of payment options (outside of a pass like the one you mentioned), no lane to escape once it was clear you had no alternatives, and then no method of paying the toll online after the fact. The only option I had was to wait to be issued a charge via the rental agency ($30+) and pay that once back in Australia.
- ghaff 3y ago
  It almost doesn't matter in the US at this point as I basically don't use cash any longer but I mostly dislike $1/$2-ish coin denominations. It's a big enough amount that I can't basically ignore their existence but I can't stick them in a wallet. Like the penny silliness--or really the fact that the US basically collectively decided that the currency denominations in widespread use in 1950 would be fine forever--it's essentially a self-correcting situation in that a lot of people don't use cash any longer.
inferiorhuman 3y ago
That law provided neither penalties nor funding for improving ETC compatibility, so it's no wonder most states haven't bothered. California, for instance, already has statewide interop – and has for decades. In fact you can use your transponder for parking at SFO. I believe the various toll agencies out here have been issuing "6C" compatible transponders since 2019 with the goal of completely phasing out the old "Title 21" transponders by 2024. ISO/IEC 18000-63 (6C) is being used by Washington, Colorado, Utah, Kentucky, Indiana, Georgia, North Carolina, and Louisiana. For someone doing a lot of interstate driving NationalPass already offers transponders that are compatible with a bunch of different systems (E-ZPass, TxTag, Title 21, and EZ-TAG), supposedly also including 6C so there's that.