4 ms·

It sounds like you're speaking from the assumption that a monopoly is inevitable in computing - the PC was so good, all other platforms had to fail. But all oth

by rvense 3y ago

It sounds like you're speaking from the assumption that a monopoly is inevitable in computing - the PC was so good, all other platforms had to fail. But all other platforms didn't fail. If Commodore had run their company properly and delivered viable products, marketed them properly, there are people would have bought them. It's an open question if that could have supported a viable niche business and for how long.

bombcar 3y ago
What would have saved the other platforms is what (I argue) saved the Mac - the Internet itself. Unfortunately it came a bit too late (widespread) for too many of the platforms, and Moore's Law finished everything else off.
ekianjo 3y ago
> monopoly is inevitable in computing it's not a monopoly, it's an open standard, which is the opposite of a monopoly.
- h0l0cube 3y ago
  Precisely. IBM PCs also had a software ecosystem and brand around delivering business value. Just like Mac did. They both survived because of this. Once those ecosystems are established, it's hard to supplant them.
- rvense 3y ago
  Conceded, that's the wrong word use for the PC hardware market. But Windows + Intel definitely had something approaching a "desktop computer platform" monopoly in the mid-late 90's. And it could have become much worse, had Jobs et al. not turned Apple into a functional business again, but I still think it's hard to say if there wasn't (isn't!) room for more than one alternative platform. Commodore were obviously lousy at setting a sane strategy and following through on it to make money, to the point where it almost looks like they could have failed without any competitors at all - so I don't think it's particularly easy to say what a moderately well-run Commodore, with actual new products up through the 1990's could have been able to do.
  - actionfromafar 3y ago
    One, to me, obvious path forward for such a fictional Commodore, would have been for them to "embrace and extend" the PC platform. It could have been able to run PC "business" software fine. It could also have been able to run "Amiga" games and gfx productivity software. Sort of like Voodoo had 3D monopoly for a hot minute.
    - antod 3y ago
      They did have something like that for the original A1000 intended to do just that. Sidecar I think it was called? Something with an x86 for running DOS apps.
      - icedchai 3y ago
        They also had "bridge boards" for the later models, which supported up to a 386SX: http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/a2386sx http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/a2386sx
      - h0l0cube 3y ago
        The other way around might have worked. If Amiga became a graphics card company they could have leveraged a market that was several orders of magnitude greater in size. Imagine a PC but with the sound and graphics of early Amigas, instead of CGA/EGA + PC speaker. Look again at the article in my earlier post[0], specifically the graph[1]. No way was Amiga going to supplant PC compatibles as a business necessity in most middle-class households. But as GP mentioned, graphics card companies are still ticking along today. [0] https://arstechnica.com/features/2005/12/total-share/6/ https://arstechnica.com/features/2005/12/total-share/6/ [1] https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/archive/articles/culture/total-share.media/graph4-1.jpg https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/archive/artic... > In 1985, Bill Gates wrote an amazing memo to Apple management. In the memo, he praised the Macintosh for its innovative design, but noted that it had failed to become a standard, like the IBM PC was becoming. He correctly deduced that it was the advent of inexpensive, 100%-compatible clone computers that was propelling the PC ahead, and that any defects in the design of the computer would eventually be remedied by the combined force of the many companies selling PCs and PC add-on products, such as new graphics cards

by rvense 3y ago

bombcar 3y ago

What would have saved the other platforms is what (I argue) saved the Mac - the Internet itself. Unfortunately it came a bit too late (widespread) for too many of the platforms, and Moore's Law finished everything else off.

ekianjo 3y ago

> monopoly is inevitable in computing it's not a monopoly, it's an open standard, which is the opposite of a monopoly.

h0l0cube 3y ago
Precisely. IBM PCs also had a software ecosystem and brand around delivering business value. Just like Mac did. They both survived because of this. Once those ecosystems are established, it's hard to supplant them.
rvense 3y ago
Conceded, that's the wrong word use for the PC hardware market. But Windows + Intel definitely had something approaching a "desktop computer platform" monopoly in the mid-late 90's. And it could have become much worse, had Jobs et al. not turned Apple into a functional business again, but I still think it's hard to say if there wasn't (isn't!) room for more than one alternative platform. Commodore were obviously lousy at setting a sane strategy and following through on it to make money, to the point where it almost looks like they could have failed without any competitors at all - so I don't think it's particularly easy to say what a moderately well-run Commodore, with actual new products up through the 1990's could have been able to do.
- actionfromafar 3y ago
  One, to me, obvious path forward for such a fictional Commodore, would have been for them to "embrace and extend" the PC platform. It could have been able to run PC "business" software fine. It could also have been able to run "Amiga" games and gfx productivity software. Sort of like Voodoo had 3D monopoly for a hot minute.
  - antod 3y ago
    They did have something like that for the original A1000 intended to do just that. Sidecar I think it was called? Something with an x86 for running DOS apps.
    - icedchai 3y ago
      They also had "bridge boards" for the later models, which supported up to a 386SX: http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/a2386sx http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/a2386sx
    - h0l0cube 3y ago
      The other way around might have worked. If Amiga became a graphics card company they could have leveraged a market that was several orders of magnitude greater in size. Imagine a PC but with the sound and graphics of early Amigas, instead of CGA/EGA + PC speaker. Look again at the article in my earlier post[0], specifically the graph[1]. No way was Amiga going to supplant PC compatibles as a business necessity in most middle-class households. But as GP mentioned, graphics card companies are still ticking along today. [0] https://arstechnica.com/features/2005/12/total-share/6/ https://arstechnica.com/features/2005/12/total-share/6/ [1] https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/archive/articles/culture/total-share.media/graph4-1.jpg https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/archive/artic... > In 1985, Bill Gates wrote an amazing memo to Apple management. In the memo, he praised the Macintosh for its innovative design, but noted that it had failed to become a standard, like the IBM PC was becoming. He correctly deduced that it was the advent of inexpensive, 100%-compatible clone computers that was propelling the PC ahead, and that any defects in the design of the computer would eventually be remedied by the combined force of the many companies selling PCs and PC add-on products, such as new graphics cards