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This is wild. Chess feels old-school and boring to me. Don't understand how it's competing with modern sources of entertainment.

• hammyhavoc 4y ago
  Because chess offers more variety in strategy than "rush A", "rush B", "they're going squeaky", "rotate". It's particularly fun in-person, and shockingly, the generation coming up likes to look at screens less and less, and apparently isn't keen on smartphones.
  • Encrust6221 4y ago
    The article makes it pretty. lear that the vast majority are using laptops and phones.
    • hammyhavoc 4y ago
      In their sample.
  • brobinson 4y ago
    CS at a high level is like chess where you can't see your opponent's pieces most of the time. At low levels, it's basically what you described. Check out a pro game on Twitch some time. Every time I watch pros play, I learn a new lineup for util, angle to hold, runboost spot, etc.
    • hammyhavoc 4y ago
      A family member used to be a professional CSGO player and another family member played Quake at tourneys back in the day. Your point is moot because only 1% of people play at a high-level, thus chess is at least more interesting than what 99% of CSGO players will experience in terms of strategy. Their ability to react and aim in real-time isn't a consideration either, nor is their access to a pretty decent computer and internet connection to be able to compete effectively.
      • brobinson 4y ago
        In that case, your original point is also moot because chess at low levels doesn't have any strategy besides gimmicks (scholar's mate, fool's mate) and then moving randomly and hanging pieces. Around 800 ELO, people start looking for pins, skewers, forks, etc. Around 1200 ELO, you hit a wall and have to start grinding openings for a year, and then you'll hit the final wall at 1700 ELO where you can't advance unless you played from childhood. You don't need to be Global Elite in CS to have a team that attempts site takes/retakes/rotations and tries to use util effectively. You'll never have GE reactions/aim, but you'll also never be an IM/FM in chess no matter how much you grind. CS is still fun even as a silver/low gold nova pleb because the midgame has effectively unlimited variety (just like chess), and 10 independent players as opposed to 2 leads to much more diverse gameplay. CS also has the advantage of there not being draws (aside from in Valve's matchmaking), something which plagues chess all the way to the super grandmaster level.
  • tester756 4y ago
    LoL is more complex than chess.
    • hammyhavoc 4y ago
      I never mentioned LoL. "Squeaky" is CSGO.
• Spark_Ed 4y ago
  Faster variants are more accessible due to the UX quality given by chess.com and lichess. Blitz and bullet are like a competitive puzzle esport. Pair that with the competitive gaming industry and its more recent failures. A lot of people were hungry for something different, rather than a cheap reskin of the last thing that did the best numbers.
• olkingcole 4y ago
  I think the main reason, besides chess being fundamentally a great and timeless game, is streaming. Popular streamers picked it up and many top level players also started streaming online chess, which can be very entertaining. Often they are playing fast, exciting time controls like 1 or 2 minutes. Chess.com and others brought flavorful tournament coverage and hosted events with guests from outside the chess world. Chess.com and lichess have great apps and strong competitive communities. Basically, it's all there. Chess is born anew for the 21st century.
  • altcognito 4y ago
    This is the answer, my kids are all Into it and they really Love Gotham chess (I think that’s what it is called and Hikaru as well) I’m sure there are others but I’m already out of my element.
  • visarga 4y ago
    > Chess is born anew for the 21st century. Where are the doomers who said chess was over after being solved by AI?
    • szopa 4y ago
      Those were simply people with not enough imagination. Eg. AlphaGo beating Lee Sedol brought a true renaissance in Go, with papers showing that now humans play objectively better than they did before AI. While we have comfortably superhuman AIs, they are still far from godlike. The doomers were confused about where the ceiling was (and in Go it is much further than we thought).
    • WJW 4y ago
      They're over with the people who said weight lifting was over after cranes were invented, or that athletics competitions would be obsoleted by cars.
• GaggiX 4y ago
  I guess more complex forms of entertainment have diminishing returns.
• Fricken 4y ago
  Modern sources of entertainment are dressed up in a lot of fluff. Blow all that fluff away and you're left with nothing that is any better than games and stories that have been with us since forever. The kids these days are drowning in novelties of the sort that were scarce to me as a child. It stands to reason they wouldn't be as easily impressed or fooled by such things.
  • watwut 4y ago
    None of however does not lead to liking chess. The game is massively about memorization and drill, with some patina of superior aura on it. At least on lower levels. Like you trying to make everything else sound inferior, plus fluff. It is not true, once you scratch reputation out of chess, you get mundane drills and memorization of situations.
    • karmakurtisaani 4y ago
      Nah, not really. The beauty of chess is that you can almost equally enjoy it at any skill level. The challenge is almost always the same of calculating and evaluating the position to the best of your abilities. If you find yourself trying to memorize positions, you're either preparing to win the world championship or doing it completely wrong.
    • deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    • Fricken 4y ago
      At a high level all games depend on a great deal of practice to excel. Chess is not distinct in that sense.
• sidibe 4y ago
  I've never been interested in chess because it seemed to be way too much work to be good enough to have fun. Things have gotten much easier now, you can get endless stream of free puzzles that are as fun as any puzzle game and adapt to your skill level... I'm still not that interested in actually playing but it's really the ultimate single player game for phones, always slightly challenging and takes as little or as much time as you want.
  • osener 4y ago
    Which app is best for this single player variety of chess? Focusing on bite sized puzzles etc.
    • dmurray 4y ago
      Chesstempo has the best content, at least at a middle or higher standard. Chess.com and lichess have more modern UI/UX but haven't perfected the automatic puzzle generation process that Chesstempo seems to have got right many years ago.
• crabkin 4y ago
  nothing beats simplicity when it meets possibility
• yarg 4y ago
  I kinda agree with Bobby on that front: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P349BdHUxlc&t=0s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P349BdHUxlc&t=0s There's too much that's simply memorisation over skills, deep lines leading you down well traversed paths. Creativity and ingenuity suffer. The only real option* if you want interesting games is to make intentionally bad moves so that theory falls apart, and that's only an option against weaker players. You can play with the more restricted time controls - but that only mixes things up by forcing mistakes, not by introducing well considered novel moves. * There's always Fischer random. https://thechessworld.com/articles/openings/5-chess-openings-you-should-never-play/ https://thechessworld.com/articles/openings/5-chess-openings... There's probably a limit as to how bad a move you want to make: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnes_Opening https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnes_Opening You're probably better of going with dubious openings, rather than actively bad: https://lichess.org/study/FzX9K6ff https://lichess.org/study/FzX9K6ff.
  • deleted 4y ago
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  • Out_of_Characte 4y ago
    Ofcourse making bad moves will hurt your chances of winning, but Hikaru was able to speedrun to 3000 points on chess.com with the bongcloud opening. So if that is achievable then I have no excuses losing because I chose a bad opening.
  • eterm 4y ago
    > There's too much that's simply memorisation over skills, deep lines leading you down well traversed paths. And yet, game 2 of the world championship there was a novelty on move 4.
  • chongli 4y ago
    There's too much that's simply memorisation over skills, deep lines leading you down well traversed paths. Creativity and ingenuity suffer. The only real option if you want interesting games is to make intentionally bad moves so that theory falls apart, and that's only an option against weaker players. Did you watch the world championship this year? It did not at all fit your narrative. The games were very exciting. The players were out of prep early and often. There were a lot of chances being taken, blunders, and mistakes. All this from 2800-level players. I think people may soon realize that computers can be used for more than just preparing deep lines on well-trodden ground. They can also be used to find the shortest path off the beaten track and into a jungle of a midgame where you and your opponent can just play some chess. I love it!
• babl-yc 4y ago
  Speaking as someone who has gotten addicted to online chess in the past couple years, I think it's a combination of factors: - Short time format makes for intense, fast paced games - Starting a game only takes a few taps, and you can be done in a few minutes - ELO ratings give you a number to obsess over improving, and online matching puts you against even opponents - Instant post-game analysis - Large amount of Twitch/Youtube content make it more fun to learn and follow the community
  • eitally 4y ago
    My 14yo son 100% agree with your assessment (and I third it!). :)
• bawolff 4y ago
  I mean, i've never understood how people could be entertained hitting a ball with a stick. Different humans like different things.
• opportune 4y ago
  Watch blitz or bullet chess played online and you might understand. These are actual easier played online than in person because it automates pressing the clock and you can set (potentially conditional) pre moves. It’s basically a fast-paced videogame: https://youtu.be/PNQDJdjgkdU https://youtu.be/PNQDJdjgkdU Sometimes I play bullet games for hours straight because it’s very easy to just play one more 2 minute game.
• zpeti 4y ago
  It’s kind of exactly why I like it. There’s a reason people have been playing it and it evolved over 1000-1500 years. The complexity and variety is extremely entertaining. It’s really nice having that sort of depth vs a video game with a set path and story that you follow, or slicing random fruits with your finger. And the accessibility has obviously gotten insanely good as has been pointed out before in the thread.