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Most people don’t care and definitely don’t pay nearly as close attention as should be required to have the right to vote, let alone those who are payed massive

Most people don’t care and definitely don’t pay nearly as close attention as should be required to have the right to vote, let alone those who are payed massive amounts of money to manipulate corrupted politicians. Corruption is now or at the very least is well on its way to becoming systemic.

javajosh 3y ago
I wish HN would add a new reply button, "It's hopeless and people don't care and its only going to get worse" because it would save a great deal of time for everyone involved.
- creativenolo 3y ago
  Maybe instead of reply people should just submit and comply?
- moffkalast 3y ago
  Well the ubiquity of it doesn't make it any less true.
  - javajosh 3y ago
    It's never been less true. Humans have never been more capable of coherent action, and this fact has not been lost on the sociopathic no-upper-limit-to-greed manipulator types who've done well in this nascient internet with its aging, nostalgic noobs. The modern zeitgeist is dominated by the heat from a thousand battles happening in the info-sphere, fought by PR mercenaries and state-sponsored labs duking it out. They must win their battle because that is what they are paid to do, and saying the word "externality" is a good way to get fired. But. If we can act coherently on one way, we can do so in another, and I take great hope in that fact.
    - hatethissite42 3y ago
      [flagged]
    - pauby 3y ago
      This sounds like a great intro to a book. I'm hooked.
    - brokenmachine 3y ago
      I mean, the top 1% richest is somehow able to pocket nearly twice as much wealth as the other 99% of population of the world. Money is power, at least until people are fairly represented... So I'm not so optimistic. https://www.oxfam.org/en/press-releases/richest-1-bag-nearly-twice-much-wealth-rest-world-put-together-over-past-two-years https://www.oxfam.org/en/press-releases/richest-1-bag-nearly...
cde-v 3y ago
Wow, so negative. All NYers need to do is peacefully protest with some really original and funny signs/chants and they’ll solve the corruption.
mrandish 3y ago
> Corruption is now or at the very least is well on its way to becoming systemic. It's now clear we have a critical vulnerability in our political operating system. IMHO, the simplest solution is single-term limits. Obviously, there are upside and downside trade-offs to such a policy. However, I think the upsides might be worth the downsides, especially since the system is so clearly being gamed by well-funded adversaries to the public interest. Based on the sky-rocketing increases in net worth after becoming a long-term career politician, the incentives are simply overwhelming. It's now attracting people with poor, or at least conflicted, motivations to the career. Another under-appreciated upside would be limiting the influence of entrenched, 'permanent' political parties, as seen in the now-eternal two-party duopoly we have in the U.S. No matter which 'side' you may be on (if any), we'd all be better served by a system more able to evolve and adapt to meet changing conditions.
- atkailash 3y ago
  [dead]
- smeej 3y ago
  In New Hampshire, state reps and senators are paid only $200 per two-year term.[0] There are also more reps (total, not per capita) than in any other state. Reps end up representing <4,000 people on average--a number someone can actually represent. And they have to consider every proposal. You know what the most common decision is? "ITL," or "inexpedient to legislate." In most cases, no, there really shouldn't be a law. Is it the best system out there? Probably not, but it certainly solves some of the commonest problems. [0] https://www.vnews.com/Upper-Valley-state-legislators-push-for-higher-compensation-49418365 https://www.vnews.com/Upper-Valley-state-legislators-push-fo...
  - fn-mote 3y ago
    Requiring politicians to be (essentially) volunteers does NOT insulate the system from corruption. It also seems likely to guarantee well-off people will become members, but perhaps that's not a change from what you see elsewhere in the country.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
kanbara 3y ago
should be required? voting should not require any test to exercise said right, as is expected in a normal democratic society

javajosh 3y ago

I wish HN would add a new reply button, "It's hopeless and people don't care and its only going to get worse" because it would save a great deal of time for everyone involved.

creativenolo 3y ago
Maybe instead of reply people should just submit and comply?
moffkalast 3y ago
Well the ubiquity of it doesn't make it any less true.
- javajosh 3y ago
  It's never been less true. Humans have never been more capable of coherent action, and this fact has not been lost on the sociopathic no-upper-limit-to-greed manipulator types who've done well in this nascient internet with its aging, nostalgic noobs. The modern zeitgeist is dominated by the heat from a thousand battles happening in the info-sphere, fought by PR mercenaries and state-sponsored labs duking it out. They must win their battle because that is what they are paid to do, and saying the word "externality" is a good way to get fired. But. If we can act coherently on one way, we can do so in another, and I take great hope in that fact.
  - hatethissite42 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - pauby 3y ago
    This sounds like a great intro to a book. I'm hooked.
  - brokenmachine 3y ago
    I mean, the top 1% richest is somehow able to pocket nearly twice as much wealth as the other 99% of population of the world. Money is power, at least until people are fairly represented... So I'm not so optimistic. https://www.oxfam.org/en/press-releases/richest-1-bag-nearly-twice-much-wealth-rest-world-put-together-over-past-two-years https://www.oxfam.org/en/press-releases/richest-1-bag-nearly...

cde-v 3y ago

Wow, so negative. All NYers need to do is peacefully protest with some really original and funny signs/chants and they’ll solve the corruption.

mrandish 3y ago

> Corruption is now or at the very least is well on its way to becoming systemic. It's now clear we have a critical vulnerability in our political operating system. IMHO, the simplest solution is single-term limits. Obviously, there are upside and downside trade-offs to such a policy. However, I think the upsides might be worth the downsides, especially since the system is so clearly being gamed by well-funded adversaries to the public interest. Based on the sky-rocketing increases in net worth after becoming a long-term career politician, the incentives are simply overwhelming. It's now attracting people with poor, or at least conflicted, motivations to the career. Another under-appreciated upside would be limiting the influence of entrenched, 'permanent' political parties, as seen in the now-eternal two-party duopoly we have in the U.S. No matter which 'side' you may be on (if any), we'd all be better served by a system more able to evolve and adapt to meet changing conditions.

atkailash 3y ago
[dead]
smeej 3y ago
In New Hampshire, state reps and senators are paid only $200 per two-year term.[0] There are also more reps (total, not per capita) than in any other state. Reps end up representing <4,000 people on average--a number someone can actually represent. And they have to consider every proposal. You know what the most common decision is? "ITL," or "inexpedient to legislate." In most cases, no, there really shouldn't be a law. Is it the best system out there? Probably not, but it certainly solves some of the commonest problems. [0] https://www.vnews.com/Upper-Valley-state-legislators-push-for-higher-compensation-49418365 https://www.vnews.com/Upper-Valley-state-legislators-push-fo...
- fn-mote 3y ago
  Requiring politicians to be (essentially) volunteers does NOT insulate the system from corruption. It also seems likely to guarantee well-off people will become members, but perhaps that's not a change from what you see elsewhere in the country.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

kanbara 3y ago

should be required? voting should not require any test to exercise said right, as is expected in a normal democratic society