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Hah! I had this idea in the car the other day ("like ratemyprofessor, but for landlords") -- the big issue I got hung up on is authenticity. How does this tool

Hah! I had this idea in the car the other day ("like ratemyprofessor, but for landlords") -- the big issue I got hung up on is authenticity. How does this tool ensure that reviewers are actually tenants, and not landlords trying to boost their rating?

missedthecue 3y ago
upload proof of address with your name on it when creating the account, like a bank statement or electricity bill. The only way for the landlord to cheat it is to set up fake accounts with companies and get statements sent to them. Probably possible but a lot of work for 1 review
- the_pwner224 3y ago
  These days those are mostly electronic, it's not hard to edit the text in a PDF to make it show a different address. Not something an average person can easily do, but trivial for a motivated attacker to pull off with a bit of money or the right friends. Also, if it has your name on it then it's no longer anonymous.
- neurobama 3y ago
  Photoshop seems like a straightforward way around this method of verification. It works for the DMV here in the States, but perhaps only because lying in that context carries legal penalties.
- s1mon 3y ago
  And how would the service verify the statements? Why would it take a fake account? It's not that hard to get a sample statement and modify it to seem real. If you could get confirmation from a bank or utility that might be enough to prevent forgeries, but what incentive would there be for them and why would they want to share private information?
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- bombcar 3y ago
  Any landlord will have utilities in his name at some point or another.
- wlesieutre 3y ago
  NextDoor mails a card with a confirmation code to your address
  - moneywoes 3y ago
    Weird they didn’t do it for me
    - wlesieutre 3y ago
      They have other options too https://help.nextdoor.com/s/article/How-to-verify-your-address?language=en_US https://help.nextdoor.com/s/article/How-to-verify-your-addre...
lolinder 3y ago
I worked for a while at a company that everyone hated, and there was an ongoing war on Glassdoor between the narcissistic CEO and the employees. Every new employee (and there were a lot of those because turnover was high) left negative reviews, and periodically the CEO would get on with a bunch of sockpuppet accounts and leave positive reviews. It was a small enough company that we knew they couldn't be real (they claimed roles that were all accounted for, and they'd all show up over a day or two with the same writing style), but Glassdoor has basically no verification and never responded to our reports. The only action their moderators ever took was to remove our reviews if we tried to call out the inauthentic ones.
- Vervious 3y ago
  This could be a cool domain for LinkedIn to move into —— allow reviews only from people who publicly list the company in their profile
  - aww_dang 3y ago
    Should be possible for 3rd parties if LinkedIn is still offering OAuth.
  - DANmode 3y ago
    I think someone tried that; the issue lies with reviewers that really "spill the tea" (fellow kids, am I using that right?); specifically that Glassdoor can be legally compelled to unmask the reviewer.
cogitoergofutuo 3y ago
> How does this tool ensure that reviewers are actually tenants, and not landlords trying to boost their rating? I have only ever felt the need to tell other people about my landlord when they were really terrible. I had a landlord that I liked once, but “getting to hang out with a cool dog sometimes” wouldn’t have compelled me to seek out and contribute to a review website. I would simply treat anything on the site that’s even slightly more effusive than “I have had little to no reason to interact with my landlord” as patent garbage.
- lolinder 3y ago
  This is how I pretty much treat all reviews these days. There is relatively little incentive to lie in a negative review (a competitor could try to trash on you, but I've yet to see that become a big problem and it would be potentially actionable), but there are lots of reasons why someone would want to manufacture positive reviews. So I typically just read through the negatives these days and see if there's a common theme.
- UberFly 3y ago
  Good points. These platforms, if they gain traction, get sullied quick and are anything but objective.
EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 3y ago
How about this scheme: a service that provides a hash of your {SSN, DOB, domain of a web site}, which allows anyone to cryptographically check that the domain is part of the hash, but not SSN or DOB, and which is required to create an account. This guarantees that any physical person can create one and only one account on that web site and also preserves anonymity.
askvictor 3y ago
Needs a critical mass of tenants. Any landlord with a significant portion of low ratings would be assumed that the positive ratings are fake.
kazinator 3y ago
Require the reviews to be videos of someone speaking, and require that they turn their head sideways several times during the video.

missedthecue 3y ago

upload proof of address with your name on it when creating the account, like a bank statement or electricity bill. The only way for the landlord to cheat it is to set up fake accounts with companies and get statements sent to them. Probably possible but a lot of work for 1 review

the_pwner224 3y ago
These days those are mostly electronic, it's not hard to edit the text in a PDF to make it show a different address. Not something an average person can easily do, but trivial for a motivated attacker to pull off with a bit of money or the right friends. Also, if it has your name on it then it's no longer anonymous.
neurobama 3y ago
Photoshop seems like a straightforward way around this method of verification. It works for the DMV here in the States, but perhaps only because lying in that context carries legal penalties.
s1mon 3y ago
And how would the service verify the statements? Why would it take a fake account? It's not that hard to get a sample statement and modify it to seem real. If you could get confirmation from a bank or utility that might be enough to prevent forgeries, but what incentive would there be for them and why would they want to share private information?
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
bombcar 3y ago
Any landlord will have utilities in his name at some point or another.
wlesieutre 3y ago
NextDoor mails a card with a confirmation code to your address
- moneywoes 3y ago
  Weird they didn’t do it for me
  - wlesieutre 3y ago
    They have other options too https://help.nextdoor.com/s/article/How-to-verify-your-address?language=en_US https://help.nextdoor.com/s/article/How-to-verify-your-addre...

lolinder 3y ago

I worked for a while at a company that everyone hated, and there was an ongoing war on Glassdoor between the narcissistic CEO and the employees. Every new employee (and there were a lot of those because turnover was high) left negative reviews, and periodically the CEO would get on with a bunch of sockpuppet accounts and leave positive reviews. It was a small enough company that we knew they couldn't be real (they claimed roles that were all accounted for, and they'd all show up over a day or two with the same writing style), but Glassdoor has basically no verification and never responded to our reports. The only action their moderators ever took was to remove our reviews if we tried to call out the inauthentic ones.

Vervious 3y ago
This could be a cool domain for LinkedIn to move into —— allow reviews only from people who publicly list the company in their profile
- aww_dang 3y ago
  Should be possible for 3rd parties if LinkedIn is still offering OAuth.
- DANmode 3y ago
  I think someone tried that; the issue lies with reviewers that really "spill the tea" (fellow kids, am I using that right?); specifically that Glassdoor can be legally compelled to unmask the reviewer.

cogitoergofutuo 3y ago

> How does this tool ensure that reviewers are actually tenants, and not landlords trying to boost their rating? I have only ever felt the need to tell other people about my landlord when they were really terrible. I had a landlord that I liked once, but “getting to hang out with a cool dog sometimes” wouldn’t have compelled me to seek out and contribute to a review website. I would simply treat anything on the site that’s even slightly more effusive than “I have had little to no reason to interact with my landlord” as patent garbage.

lolinder 3y ago
This is how I pretty much treat all reviews these days. There is relatively little incentive to lie in a negative review (a competitor could try to trash on you, but I've yet to see that become a big problem and it would be potentially actionable), but there are lots of reasons why someone would want to manufacture positive reviews. So I typically just read through the negatives these days and see if there's a common theme.
UberFly 3y ago
Good points. These platforms, if they gain traction, get sullied quick and are anything but objective.

EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 3y ago

How about this scheme: a service that provides a hash of your {SSN, DOB, domain of a web site}, which allows anyone to cryptographically check that the domain is part of the hash, but not SSN or DOB, and which is required to create an account. This guarantees that any physical person can create one and only one account on that web site and also preserves anonymity.

askvictor 3y ago

Needs a critical mass of tenants. Any landlord with a significant portion of low ratings would be assumed that the positive ratings are fake.

kazinator 3y ago

Require the reviews to be videos of someone speaking, and require that they turn their head sideways several times during the video.