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Maybe this is a bit of a tangent but... shouldn't the world as a whole not be thinking about how to consume less in stead of obsessing with how to do the clean

Maybe this is a bit of a tangent but... shouldn't the world as a whole not be thinking about how to consume less in stead of obsessing with how to do the clean energy transition, without changing our habits a bit? If you think about it, there is still plenty of room for optimizing our energy consumption. The trend seems to be, replace the gasoline car not with a more fuel efficient one but rather with a car weighing almost double because it has to drag along a huge battery. Then replace all copper wires with double the section (copper mining, plastic production, tearing open perfect roads, ...) Some ideas, not very far fetched I would say, combine a few of these will get us a long way: Car pooling. Electric bicycles. Insulate your house better? Taking turns with neighbours to do grocery shopping or bringing kids to school. Try to repair stuff in stead of bying new. Drying clothes with renewable wind energy. (a hanging rack)

danans 4y ago
> Car pooling. > Electric bicycles > Insulate your house better? > Taking turns with neighbours to do grocery shopping or bringing kids to school. > Try to repair stuff in stead of bying new. > Drying clothes with renewable wind energy. (a hanging rack) People do these things anyways with the right incentives, just to save time and money. But we still need to get off of fossil fuels for transportation and electricity generation if we want to avoid the worst climate change scenarios. The reality is that people really value convenience, and we have to find sustainable ways of delivering that. That might mean a great electric bus system, EVs, community thrift exchanges, etc
- nuancebydefault 4y ago
  I agree, but it needs to be a combination of change of infrastructure and people's habits. After all it is just culture and culture evolves,so let it evolve in the right direction. 200 amps to every household seems not to be the right direction.
  - danans 4y ago
    As behind-the-meter demand management technology advances, and behind the meter storage becomes more affordable, we will be able to increasingly support high power use cases without needing 200A service drops at all. This is where we will end up: sipping power through a straw and storing it for short bursts of high-power usage.
- lotsoweiners 4y ago
  > Car pooling. I work from home and hate riding/coordinating with others so I’ll alway just go on my own. > Electric bicycles I only ride bicycles for exercise or as an activity but never to go somewhere. I’m no longer 12. > Insulate your house better? If the government wants to use my tax dollars for this instead of SNAP/TANF then I’m all for them paying for it but it’s not going to be me paying. > Taking turns with neighbours to do grocery shopping or bringing kids to school. See point #1 > Try to repair stuff in stead of bying new. I do this where possible because I’m cheap but I doubt it is any kind of significant savings of energy. > Drying clothes with renewable wind energy. (a hanging rack) Now I’ve got clean clothes covered in dust and pollen. Thanks.
  - nuancebydefault 4y ago
    I understand your points. I'm sure those are valid for you. I'm thinking more about the whole picture. You say you work from home, that's already big influence. My point in this discussion thread is, i saw 200 Amps at 240 V per household being mentioned, i want to show this should not be the norm or trend. Imo this way of thinking is not leading to an efficient system. If you have an electric car, you probably don't need to charge it most of the times at the highest current. And when you do, you won't turn on all electric devices with high amperage. The other examples are just examples, not everyone needs to apply them all. I advocate for the culture shift, the more-is-not-better mentality. This needs to go hand in hand with cleaner technologies and government policies.

danans 4y ago

> Car pooling. > Electric bicycles > Insulate your house better? > Taking turns with neighbours to do grocery shopping or bringing kids to school. > Try to repair stuff in stead of bying new. > Drying clothes with renewable wind energy. (a hanging rack) People do these things anyways with the right incentives, just to save time and money. But we still need to get off of fossil fuels for transportation and electricity generation if we want to avoid the worst climate change scenarios. The reality is that people really value convenience, and we have to find sustainable ways of delivering that. That might mean a great electric bus system, EVs, community thrift exchanges, etc

nuancebydefault 4y ago
I agree, but it needs to be a combination of change of infrastructure and people's habits. After all it is just culture and culture evolves,so let it evolve in the right direction. 200 amps to every household seems not to be the right direction.
- danans 4y ago
  As behind-the-meter demand management technology advances, and behind the meter storage becomes more affordable, we will be able to increasingly support high power use cases without needing 200A service drops at all. This is where we will end up: sipping power through a straw and storing it for short bursts of high-power usage.
lotsoweiners 4y ago
> Car pooling. I work from home and hate riding/coordinating with others so I’ll alway just go on my own. > Electric bicycles I only ride bicycles for exercise or as an activity but never to go somewhere. I’m no longer 12. > Insulate your house better? If the government wants to use my tax dollars for this instead of SNAP/TANF then I’m all for them paying for it but it’s not going to be me paying. > Taking turns with neighbours to do grocery shopping or bringing kids to school. See point #1 > Try to repair stuff in stead of bying new. I do this where possible because I’m cheap but I doubt it is any kind of significant savings of energy. > Drying clothes with renewable wind energy. (a hanging rack) Now I’ve got clean clothes covered in dust and pollen. Thanks.
- nuancebydefault 4y ago
  I understand your points. I'm sure those are valid for you. I'm thinking more about the whole picture. You say you work from home, that's already big influence. My point in this discussion thread is, i saw 200 Amps at 240 V per household being mentioned, i want to show this should not be the norm or trend. Imo this way of thinking is not leading to an efficient system. If you have an electric car, you probably don't need to charge it most of the times at the highest current. And when you do, you won't turn on all electric devices with high amperage. The other examples are just examples, not everyone needs to apply them all. I advocate for the culture shift, the more-is-not-better mentality. This needs to go hand in hand with cleaner technologies and government policies.