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Battery prices are a racket. I was shocked when I saw the price of coin cells at a local store: a two pack of coin cell batteries cost 7€. So instead of the coi

Battery prices are a racket. I was shocked when I saw the price of coin cells at a local store: a two pack of coin cell batteries cost 7€. So instead of the coin cells, I bought an electric candle for 1€, took out the coin cell, and threw away the electric candle.

spicyjpeg 4y ago
Unfortunately, with the current trend of cheap electronics switching away from standard batteries and towards custom-sized, permanently soldered-in lithium cells (sometimes without the ability to recharge them - why this is still legal is beyond me [1]), you won't be able to keep doing that for long. On the flip side, a lithium cell salvaged from such a device is going to be a lot more useful than a single-use coin cell if you can solder. There are readily available modules that will take any of these batteries and provide a charging port and an output with overcurrent and undervoltage protection, ready to be wired into anything capable of running on 3.7V [2]. [1] https://youtube.com/watch?v=N65DpT2nqEI https://youtube.com/watch?v=N65DpT2nqEI https://youtube.com/watch?v=PsJMj7FtroY https://youtube.com/watch?v=PsJMj7FtroY [2] https://youtube.com/watch?v=M88e1r8nvYk https://youtube.com/watch?v=M88e1r8nvYk
- throwaway5959 4y ago
  That dates all the way back to at least the Dreamcast. When I work on them I desolder the old battery and solder in a socket. Makes replacing the battery a lot easier.
ChuckNorris89 4y ago
True, but the thing is, the battery in that 1 euro candle was most likely not a name brand one with a long life, like a Varta, Panasonic, Duracell or Energizer, but a no-name one that won't last very long.
- newaccount74 4y ago
  That's what they said at the store when I complained about the pricing, but I doubt it. It's a lithium coin cell, I doubt there's huge variance like this. I searched the internet a bit for capacity measurements of cheap coin cells, and the only thing I found is [1], which shows that the discharge curve of a cheap coin cell was almost exactly the same as the one from the data sheet of a name brand cell. Also, a comment on the page [2] says that name brand cells cost 25c when buying 100s, so a price of 7€ for 2 seems to be enough of a margin to call it a racket. [1]: https://electronics.stackexchange.com/a/219906 https://electronics.stackexchange.com/a/219906 [2]: https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/219847/testing-chinese-cr2032-li-ion-battery-capacity#comment471802_219847 https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/219847/testi...
  - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
    >It's a lithium coin cell, I doubt there's huge variance like this. Anecdotally, from my own experience, the differences are real and huge. The no-name CR 2032 cell I bought from the discount store lasted 3-6 months in my room thermometer, while the name brand one closer to 2 years. >seems to be enough of a margin to call it a racket I'm not trying to justify the racket pricing, I'm just saying the differences between those no-name Chinese batteries you can find in 1 euro LED candles and good cells from a reputable brand is real and palpable.
    - newaccount74 3y ago
      OK, so that's one anecdote saying there's a difference, and one anecdote saying they are the same. Would be sweet if someone bought a couple of different CR2032 cells and tested them.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- rlpb 4y ago
  I'm not convinced the branded ones last any longer. Typically they don't even quote their capacity.
tzs 4y ago
If you are willing to have to change cells 3 to 5 times as often you might consider rechargeable coin cells. There are for example rechargeable 2032 cells that go for around $15-20 for 4 with a charger. The catch is that their capacities are from about 45 mAh to 75 mAh depending on brand. A non-rechargeable 2032 is around 225 mAh. Once you have the rechargeable cells and the charger they are essentially free for the rest of their lifetime. In the European country with the highest electricity prices the cost to charge a 45 mAh cell 5 times or a 75 mAh cell 3 times would be under 1/2000th of a Euro. With the price of individual non-rechargeable cells being around the same price as rechargeable cells plus charger it is almost a no-brainer if you are OK with having to change cells more frequently in your devices. BTW, the math is similar for AA and AAA batteries, except there the rechargeable batteries themselves cost 3 or 4 times as much as non-rechargeable batteries. So with these if you are only using a handful of batteries a year you might never break even switching to rechargeables. Like the rechargeable coin cells rechargeable AA and AAAs are essentially free to operate once you have them. Recharging a 2000 mAh NiMH AA like a Panasonic Eneloop would take less than 1/800th of a Euro in the most expensive European country. Lifetimes of the Eneloops seem pretty good. I've got some 1st generation AA and AAAs that are at least 15 years old (I don't remember exactly when I bought them, but I know I bought them at Circuit City which went out of business in 2008) and some 4th generation AAs that I bought in 2014. Pretty much all my AA and AAA battery use since 2008 has been on these. The 1st gen AAs now mostly have capacities in the 1800-1900 mAh range, which is slightly under spec (spec is min 1900 mAh, typical 2000 mAh). The 1st gen AAAs are currently in the 790-840 mAh range (spec is min 750 mAh, typical 800 mAh). The 4th gen AAs are mostly in the 1900-2000 mAh range (spec is min 1900 mAh, typical 2000 mAh). Of the 24 1st gen AAs I bought, 2 have died. Of the 16 1st gen AAAs I bought, 3 have died. Of the 16 4th gen AAs I bought the 15 I know of are still fine.

spicyjpeg 4y ago

Unfortunately, with the current trend of cheap electronics switching away from standard batteries and towards custom-sized, permanently soldered-in lithium cells (sometimes without the ability to recharge them - why this is still legal is beyond me [1]), you won't be able to keep doing that for long. On the flip side, a lithium cell salvaged from such a device is going to be a lot more useful than a single-use coin cell if you can solder. There are readily available modules that will take any of these batteries and provide a charging port and an output with overcurrent and undervoltage protection, ready to be wired into anything capable of running on 3.7V [2]. [1] https://youtube.com/watch?v=N65DpT2nqEI https://youtube.com/watch?v=N65DpT2nqEI https://youtube.com/watch?v=PsJMj7FtroY https://youtube.com/watch?v=PsJMj7FtroY [2] https://youtube.com/watch?v=M88e1r8nvYk https://youtube.com/watch?v=M88e1r8nvYk

throwaway5959 4y ago
That dates all the way back to at least the Dreamcast. When I work on them I desolder the old battery and solder in a socket. Makes replacing the battery a lot easier.

ChuckNorris89 4y ago

True, but the thing is, the battery in that 1 euro candle was most likely not a name brand one with a long life, like a Varta, Panasonic, Duracell or Energizer, but a no-name one that won't last very long.

newaccount74 4y ago
That's what they said at the store when I complained about the pricing, but I doubt it. It's a lithium coin cell, I doubt there's huge variance like this. I searched the internet a bit for capacity measurements of cheap coin cells, and the only thing I found is [1], which shows that the discharge curve of a cheap coin cell was almost exactly the same as the one from the data sheet of a name brand cell. Also, a comment on the page [2] says that name brand cells cost 25c when buying 100s, so a price of 7€ for 2 seems to be enough of a margin to call it a racket. [1]: https://electronics.stackexchange.com/a/219906 https://electronics.stackexchange.com/a/219906 [2]: https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/219847/testing-chinese-cr2032-li-ion-battery-capacity#comment471802_219847 https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/219847/testi...
- ChuckNorris89 4y ago
  >It's a lithium coin cell, I doubt there's huge variance like this. Anecdotally, from my own experience, the differences are real and huge. The no-name CR 2032 cell I bought from the discount store lasted 3-6 months in my room thermometer, while the name brand one closer to 2 years. >seems to be enough of a margin to call it a racket I'm not trying to justify the racket pricing, I'm just saying the differences between those no-name Chinese batteries you can find in 1 euro LED candles and good cells from a reputable brand is real and palpable.
  - newaccount74 3y ago
    OK, so that's one anecdote saying there's a difference, and one anecdote saying they are the same. Would be sweet if someone bought a couple of different CR2032 cells and tested them.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
rlpb 4y ago
I'm not convinced the branded ones last any longer. Typically they don't even quote their capacity.

tzs 4y ago

If you are willing to have to change cells 3 to 5 times as often you might consider rechargeable coin cells. There are for example rechargeable 2032 cells that go for around $15-20 for 4 with a charger. The catch is that their capacities are from about 45 mAh to 75 mAh depending on brand. A non-rechargeable 2032 is around 225 mAh. Once you have the rechargeable cells and the charger they are essentially free for the rest of their lifetime. In the European country with the highest electricity prices the cost to charge a 45 mAh cell 5 times or a 75 mAh cell 3 times would be under 1/2000th of a Euro. With the price of individual non-rechargeable cells being around the same price as rechargeable cells plus charger it is almost a no-brainer if you are OK with having to change cells more frequently in your devices. BTW, the math is similar for AA and AAA batteries, except there the rechargeable batteries themselves cost 3 or 4 times as much as non-rechargeable batteries. So with these if you are only using a handful of batteries a year you might never break even switching to rechargeables. Like the rechargeable coin cells rechargeable AA and AAAs are essentially free to operate once you have them. Recharging a 2000 mAh NiMH AA like a Panasonic Eneloop would take less than 1/800th of a Euro in the most expensive European country. Lifetimes of the Eneloops seem pretty good. I've got some 1st generation AA and AAAs that are at least 15 years old (I don't remember exactly when I bought them, but I know I bought them at Circuit City which went out of business in 2008) and some 4th generation AAs that I bought in 2014. Pretty much all my AA and AAA battery use since 2008 has been on these. The 1st gen AAs now mostly have capacities in the 1800-1900 mAh range, which is slightly under spec (spec is min 1900 mAh, typical 2000 mAh). The 1st gen AAAs are currently in the 790-840 mAh range (spec is min 750 mAh, typical 800 mAh). The 4th gen AAs are mostly in the 1900-2000 mAh range (spec is min 1900 mAh, typical 2000 mAh). Of the 24 1st gen AAs I bought, 2 have died. Of the 16 1st gen AAAs I bought, 3 have died. Of the 16 4th gen AAs I bought the 15 I know of are still fine.