4 ms·

Being a cop in Germany is much easier and less risky job than in US, because they have 50% more cops per capita while having something like 15% the crime rate o

by xyzzyz 3y ago

Being a cop in Germany is much easier and less risky job than in US, because they have 50% more cops per capita while having something like 15% the crime rate of US. This means that, as a very rough estimate, there is something like 16 times more crimes per cop in US than in Germany. This is made even worse by things like US criminal being much more insane and erratic than German ones (Germany has a more collectivist, order-oriented culture, and will institutionalize miscreants much faster and for much less serious offenses than US will), and case overload forcing US cops to focus on the worst cases and worst offenders first. For this reason, more people in Germany will put up with strict credential requirements and low pay than in US. To make police force more professional in the US, we first need to stop most crime, and for that, we need to hire a lot of police (to bring the crimes-per-cop ratio closer to low crime countries), and massively increase incarceration of repeat offenders, who are responsible for the bulk of the crime. It will be extremely hard to both hire more police and also to make standards higher: you’ll end up with highly professional cops who are too busy to help you unless you’re being actively murdered.

Retric 3y ago
It’s very difficult to compare numbers between countries like this because of different definitions. In the US are INS or FBI agents cops, what about secret service agents dealing with counterfeiters or protecting the president? How about detectives, dispatchers, part timers, managers etc. This is why you will see wildly different number of how many cops there are in the US generally it’s between 600k and 1 million but there’s many different counts. When comparing things to Germany simply don’t see a 1:1 fit for what’s a US law enforcement officer.
itqwertz 3y ago
There is an active political element in the U.S. that believes that “defunding” police is the answer. While they may have some valid arguments, they don’t see things from your perspective at all. We had city-burning protests for months for a career criminal high on illegal drugs committing crime. In a few days after, there were worldwide protests and political statements (GF portraits on the Berlin Wall?!?). Those that support this obvious push towards more chaos and police oversight have deep pockets and international reach. Real change in the US comes from tragedy and money.
- gloryjulio 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - itqwertz 3y ago
    Due process started with the liquor store rightly calling the police about receiving a counterfeit bill from an intoxicated individual and the police questioning the suspect. When your culture tells you to resist, and you do, you have given up due process.
    - nooron 3y ago
      the society you get by deciding that tired jocks with guns and a 2-4x of baseline rate of domestic violence and an unstoppable union should get to decide what due process is bad. law enforcers should have to follow the law. also I am willing to bet you don’t know much about due process because there is no way you’re an attorney but I’ll eat my shoe if you show me where you’re licensed to practice law.
    - gloryjulio 3y ago
      So u r saying he deserves to be dead? And by culture u mean u r a racist right? Btw do u know white ppl r killed too? Thanks for saying the quiet part loud, that's all we need to see ;).
      - hasseldahoff 3y ago
        [dead]
      - melagonster 3y ago
        I originally wanted to comment that crimes rate and racism police are different problems, but this reply display gp do not care haha.
    - catiopatio 3y ago
      > When your culture tells you to resist, and you do, you have given up due process. If not due process if it’s possible to “give up” due process.
slg 3y ago
Wild to suggest that the US's issue is not incarcerating enough people considering we are near the top of the global leaderboards on that front. Specifically in comparison to Germany, the incarceration rate is almost 8x higher in the US. You are also ignoring how the unprofessional nature of police contribute to the problem. Their behavior creates an adversarial relationship with the public. This has all sorts of negative repercussions. It helps escalate crime because cops are now more dangerous and less predictable, so people will go to greater lengths to avoid arrest or interaction with police. It also makes the cops' jobs more difficult as the community becomes less likely to cooperate in stopping or preventing crime. Hiring more cops can make matters worse because it can necessitate lowering the bar to find enough people to hire leading to even less professional behavior. It also creates more interactions between police and the community which as I mentioned, is often an adversarial interaction due to this unprofessional behavior. Simply hiring more cops and throwing more people in jail isn't going to fix things. That should be obvious because that is all we ever seem to attempt in the US and the situation isn't getting better.
- wombatpm 3y ago
  It was a popular counter culture bumber sticker back in the 60's: The Police are armed and dangerous. Not much has changed.
- ryan93 3y ago
  [flagged]
- xyzzyz 3y ago
  > Wild to suggest that the US's issue is not incarcerating enough people considering we are near the top of the global leaderboards on that front. Specifically in comparison to Germany, the incarceration rate is almost 8x higher in the US. Yes, we are not incarcerating enough people, as clearly evidenced by the fact that we have a lot of repeat criminals, who commit a lot more crime than Germans. > You are also ignoring how the unprofessional nature of police contribute to the problem. Their behavior creates an adversarial relationship with the public. (…) This is a problem, but it’s not what’s causing criminals to rob stores, carjack random people, or do drive by shootings. If we made US cops as professional as German cops, we’d still have huge crime problem. In fact, having grown up in Poland (which is very low crime society), my experience tells me that prosecuting and jailing criminals is significantly more important than professionalism of police force, as Polish cops are significantly less professional than American ones. > Simply hiring more cops and throwing more people in jail isn't going to fix things. That should be obvious because that is all we ever seem to attempt in the US and the situation isn't getting better. I strongly disagree. We did start mass incarceration around early-to-mid 1990, and it did, in fact, solve a lot of crime problems. As the percentage of population in prison steadily went up, the crime rate steadily went down. As we started reducing incarceration rates in early 2010s, the crime rate started going back up again, and this greatly accelerated starting from 2020, with the growth of anti-policing and anti-prosecution movements. Just to emphasize this: the incarceration rate is down a lot from its peak in ~2010 or so. It’s down by more than a third. We no longer just throw people in jail, we do quite the opposite in fact, and the situation is getting worse than when we just jailed criminals.

by xyzzyz 3y ago

Retric 3y ago

It’s very difficult to compare numbers between countries like this because of different definitions. In the US are INS or FBI agents cops, what about secret service agents dealing with counterfeiters or protecting the president? How about detectives, dispatchers, part timers, managers etc. This is why you will see wildly different number of how many cops there are in the US generally it’s between 600k and 1 million but there’s many different counts. When comparing things to Germany simply don’t see a 1:1 fit for what’s a US law enforcement officer.

itqwertz 3y ago

There is an active political element in the U.S. that believes that “defunding” police is the answer. While they may have some valid arguments, they don’t see things from your perspective at all. We had city-burning protests for months for a career criminal high on illegal drugs committing crime. In a few days after, there were worldwide protests and political statements (GF portraits on the Berlin Wall?!?). Those that support this obvious push towards more chaos and police oversight have deep pockets and international reach. Real change in the US comes from tragedy and money.

gloryjulio 3y ago
[flagged]
- itqwertz 3y ago
  Due process started with the liquor store rightly calling the police about receiving a counterfeit bill from an intoxicated individual and the police questioning the suspect. When your culture tells you to resist, and you do, you have given up due process.
  - nooron 3y ago
    the society you get by deciding that tired jocks with guns and a 2-4x of baseline rate of domestic violence and an unstoppable union should get to decide what due process is bad. law enforcers should have to follow the law. also I am willing to bet you don’t know much about due process because there is no way you’re an attorney but I’ll eat my shoe if you show me where you’re licensed to practice law.
  - gloryjulio 3y ago
    So u r saying he deserves to be dead? And by culture u mean u r a racist right? Btw do u know white ppl r killed too? Thanks for saying the quiet part loud, that's all we need to see ;).
    - hasseldahoff 3y ago
      [dead]
    - melagonster 3y ago
      I originally wanted to comment that crimes rate and racism police are different problems, but this reply display gp do not care haha.
  - catiopatio 3y ago
    > When your culture tells you to resist, and you do, you have given up due process. If not due process if it’s possible to “give up” due process.

slg 3y ago

Wild to suggest that the US's issue is not incarcerating enough people considering we are near the top of the global leaderboards on that front. Specifically in comparison to Germany, the incarceration rate is almost 8x higher in the US. You are also ignoring how the unprofessional nature of police contribute to the problem. Their behavior creates an adversarial relationship with the public. This has all sorts of negative repercussions. It helps escalate crime because cops are now more dangerous and less predictable, so people will go to greater lengths to avoid arrest or interaction with police. It also makes the cops' jobs more difficult as the community becomes less likely to cooperate in stopping or preventing crime. Hiring more cops can make matters worse because it can necessitate lowering the bar to find enough people to hire leading to even less professional behavior. It also creates more interactions between police and the community which as I mentioned, is often an adversarial interaction due to this unprofessional behavior. Simply hiring more cops and throwing more people in jail isn't going to fix things. That should be obvious because that is all we ever seem to attempt in the US and the situation isn't getting better.

wombatpm 3y ago
It was a popular counter culture bumber sticker back in the 60's: The Police are armed and dangerous. Not much has changed.
ryan93 3y ago
[flagged]
xyzzyz 3y ago
> Wild to suggest that the US's issue is not incarcerating enough people considering we are near the top of the global leaderboards on that front. Specifically in comparison to Germany, the incarceration rate is almost 8x higher in the US. Yes, we are not incarcerating enough people, as clearly evidenced by the fact that we have a lot of repeat criminals, who commit a lot more crime than Germans. > You are also ignoring how the unprofessional nature of police contribute to the problem. Their behavior creates an adversarial relationship with the public. (…) This is a problem, but it’s not what’s causing criminals to rob stores, carjack random people, or do drive by shootings. If we made US cops as professional as German cops, we’d still have huge crime problem. In fact, having grown up in Poland (which is very low crime society), my experience tells me that prosecuting and jailing criminals is significantly more important than professionalism of police force, as Polish cops are significantly less professional than American ones. > Simply hiring more cops and throwing more people in jail isn't going to fix things. That should be obvious because that is all we ever seem to attempt in the US and the situation isn't getting better. I strongly disagree. We did start mass incarceration around early-to-mid 1990, and it did, in fact, solve a lot of crime problems. As the percentage of population in prison steadily went up, the crime rate steadily went down. As we started reducing incarceration rates in early 2010s, the crime rate started going back up again, and this greatly accelerated starting from 2020, with the growth of anti-policing and anti-prosecution movements. Just to emphasize this: the incarceration rate is down a lot from its peak in ~2010 or so. It’s down by more than a third. We no longer just throw people in jail, we do quite the opposite in fact, and the situation is getting worse than when we just jailed criminals.