4 ms·

Can this device really be of any use ? I mean, is it just a beautiful gadget to play with antique tech that is not used anymore ? Or can you really have fun a

Can this device really be of any use ? I mean, is it just a beautiful gadget to play with antique tech that is not used anymore ? Or can you really have fun and make it work on stuff you have at home or around you ? Does it work with "real" 2000's stuff ?

mordae 4y ago
What do you mean? Besides from Bluetooth and USB: - 433MHz is very much alive (various RF-controller lights, gate openers and such) AND can be used to remotely control another Flipper. - Both 3.56 MHz and 125kHz are alive in door locks and RFID tags. - IR is still alive with most TVs. So yeah, it's missing 2.4 GHz ISM stuff. But given hardware they packed in, it's a rather good multi-tool.
logifail 4y ago
> I mean, is it just a beautiful gadget to play with antique tech that is not used anymore ? Antique? Three separate providers have handed me access cards which turned out to be MIFARE Classic 1K in the last month.
- justsomehnguy 4y ago
  The reports of the technology progress are greatly exaggerated.
  - tiberious726 4y ago
    Cards that aren't vulnerable to this attack are 10x-20x more expensive. I think it's great that a tool like this is being deployed widely into the hands of children (way better than chameleons/proxmark being in the hands of people who know what they are doing and everyone else thinking you're are a paranoid madman for knowing they exist), however it probably means that hotels are going to start charging you for not giving back your room key again before too long...
- tiberious726 4y ago
  The only access card system I've personally encountered that my flipper can't copy is the one I deployed myself (modern HID iClass/Seos), specifically with attacks like this in mind, and the vendors still tried to encourage me to pick stuff that would have been vulnerable (this was ~7 years ago).
slau 4y ago
I easily cloned access cards to the building of a club I'm a member of, as the company managing the security access went the way of the dodo. Granted, it's not a long term solution, but it's a stop-gap measure that allows us to use the facilities until the landlord replaces the system/company. Would I have been able to do that with my professional equipment at my office? Of course, but doing it in the field with a cute dolphin winking at me is nice. I was able to show that one of my client's building access control is less secure than their lunch system, and for the NFC work I'm doing with some clients, it allows me to have a single device in my pocket with the 30 or so keys in use on the project instead of having 30 dongles in my backpack.
INTPenis 4y ago
I was equally skeptical. I actually had two from the kickstarter and sold them at a con last year. Mostly because I didn't think I'd have the time or skill to really use them fully, but also because I live in Scandinavia and it seems like most of our security systems have evolved past simple radio and RFID. Unless you actually swipe someone's RFID tag it has very little practical security use here. But in other European countries I'm sure they still rely a lot on radio for gates and parking access.
- slau 4y ago
  Scandinavia here. Banks, pharma, industry, commercial buildings still use NFC for building access control. 25% of those use things modern enough to be easily cloned by the F0 (e.g.: not FireDES). My underground parking sends a wireless signal to open the door after I've typed in my keycode.
  - INTPenis 4y ago
    Yeah but NFC is the same as RFID, you have to get close to swipe it. Now the wireless signal to your garage door, that's a surprise to me. I don't even drive tho. I guess it might be fairly common when they want to save space by not burying cables from a keypad reader that is outside the garage.
lloydatkinson 4y ago
[flagged]
steveBK123 4y ago
its a pretty cool device I cloned my work & apartment ID cards (RFID & NFC). I read my cats microchip to confirm she actually had one & what the ID was. It can do all sorts of other wireless stuff I haven't tried out yet. But for most, yeah, it's a neat toy. But that doesn't make it much different than Arduino or Rasping.
- csdvrx 4y ago
  How do you read the cat microchip with the flipper?
  - sbierwagen 4y ago
    Pet chips are RFID chips in a glass envelope https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_(animal) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_(animal)
hakube 4y ago
How is NFC and Bluetooth antique? Even infrared is still used nowadays on remotes for ACs, Televisions, etc.
dbsmith83 4y ago
You can add one of these to increase the capabilities: https://www.tindie.com/products/eried/mayhem-for-flipper-zero-wificamerasdnrfcc1101/ https://www.tindie.com/products/eried/mayhem-for-flipper-zer... and you can also swap out the firmware as well: https://github.com/DarkFlippers/unleashed-firmware https://github.com/DarkFlippers/unleashed-firmware

mordae 4y ago

What do you mean? Besides from Bluetooth and USB: - 433MHz is very much alive (various RF-controller lights, gate openers and such) AND can be used to remotely control another Flipper. - Both 3.56 MHz and 125kHz are alive in door locks and RFID tags. - IR is still alive with most TVs. So yeah, it's missing 2.4 GHz ISM stuff. But given hardware they packed in, it's a rather good multi-tool.

logifail 4y ago

> I mean, is it just a beautiful gadget to play with antique tech that is not used anymore ? Antique? Three separate providers have handed me access cards which turned out to be MIFARE Classic 1K in the last month.

justsomehnguy 4y ago
The reports of the technology progress are greatly exaggerated.
- tiberious726 4y ago
  Cards that aren't vulnerable to this attack are 10x-20x more expensive. I think it's great that a tool like this is being deployed widely into the hands of children (way better than chameleons/proxmark being in the hands of people who know what they are doing and everyone else thinking you're are a paranoid madman for knowing they exist), however it probably means that hotels are going to start charging you for not giving back your room key again before too long...
tiberious726 4y ago
The only access card system I've personally encountered that my flipper can't copy is the one I deployed myself (modern HID iClass/Seos), specifically with attacks like this in mind, and the vendors still tried to encourage me to pick stuff that would have been vulnerable (this was ~7 years ago).

slau 4y ago

I easily cloned access cards to the building of a club I'm a member of, as the company managing the security access went the way of the dodo. Granted, it's not a long term solution, but it's a stop-gap measure that allows us to use the facilities until the landlord replaces the system/company. Would I have been able to do that with my professional equipment at my office? Of course, but doing it in the field with a cute dolphin winking at me is nice. I was able to show that one of my client's building access control is less secure than their lunch system, and for the NFC work I'm doing with some clients, it allows me to have a single device in my pocket with the 30 or so keys in use on the project instead of having 30 dongles in my backpack.

INTPenis 4y ago

I was equally skeptical. I actually had two from the kickstarter and sold them at a con last year. Mostly because I didn't think I'd have the time or skill to really use them fully, but also because I live in Scandinavia and it seems like most of our security systems have evolved past simple radio and RFID. Unless you actually swipe someone's RFID tag it has very little practical security use here. But in other European countries I'm sure they still rely a lot on radio for gates and parking access.

slau 4y ago
Scandinavia here. Banks, pharma, industry, commercial buildings still use NFC for building access control. 25% of those use things modern enough to be easily cloned by the F0 (e.g.: not FireDES). My underground parking sends a wireless signal to open the door after I've typed in my keycode.
- INTPenis 4y ago
  Yeah but NFC is the same as RFID, you have to get close to swipe it. Now the wireless signal to your garage door, that's a surprise to me. I don't even drive tho. I guess it might be fairly common when they want to save space by not burying cables from a keypad reader that is outside the garage.

lloydatkinson 4y ago

[flagged]

steveBK123 4y ago

its a pretty cool device I cloned my work & apartment ID cards (RFID & NFC). I read my cats microchip to confirm she actually had one & what the ID was. It can do all sorts of other wireless stuff I haven't tried out yet. But for most, yeah, it's a neat toy. But that doesn't make it much different than Arduino or Rasping.

csdvrx 4y ago
How do you read the cat microchip with the flipper?
- sbierwagen 4y ago
  Pet chips are RFID chips in a glass envelope https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_(animal) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_(animal)

hakube 4y ago

How is NFC and Bluetooth antique? Even infrared is still used nowadays on remotes for ACs, Televisions, etc.

dbsmith83 4y ago

You can add one of these to increase the capabilities: https://www.tindie.com/products/eried/mayhem-for-flipper-zero-wificamerasdnrfcc1101/ https://www.tindie.com/products/eried/mayhem-for-flipper-zer... and you can also swap out the firmware as well: https://github.com/DarkFlippers/unleashed-firmware https://github.com/DarkFlippers/unleashed-firmware