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Any controversial program is wrapped with “equity” to neutralize negative feedback. The reality is that the kids doing the work are overtasked. Right now, John

Any controversial program is wrapped with “equity” to neutralize negative feedback. The reality is that the kids doing the work are overtasked. Right now, Johnny 8th grader is playing school lacrosse, travel baseball or AAU basketball, etc. He gets home at 9pm. Torturing them with busywork doesn’t help anyone. The kids who aren’t performing aren’t doing homework either. If you’re 35-55 years old, you’re a child of the 80s and 90s. You’re the old people now, and our perspectives are as out of touch as our 1950s and 1960s parents were.

slothtrop 4y ago
Sounds like the obsession with perpetually-scheduled competitive sports could be just as easily identified as a problem. Intramurals are an option, and immigrant parents who place a larger premium on academic performance like to opt for that instead. That aside, a rec league is, what, 2 nights a week? No reason to believe that paired with homework would lead to burnout. Math and reading takes practice. That's what homework is. The top performing countries don't do any differently. It's interesting that there are people who worry about the quality of public education being under attack by Republicans, but embrace these non-evidence-based ideas for education reform that ultimately will only benefit the upper class.
- lazyasciiart 4y ago
  It's a huge problem, driven by silly college admissions practices. The top performing countries do not give a shit about your state lacrosse team medal when deciding who gets to enrol in a physics degree.
  - Spooky23 4y ago
    My cousins got into Harvard based on their expertise in squash. Period. The fact that they were really smart was just the table stakes.
- 908B64B197 4y ago
  > Math and reading takes practice. That's what homework is. The top performing countries don't do any differently. Is it actually proven that homework helps with anything? For elementary school at least. Reading perhaps. Math, when there's no parent at home capable of properly explaining it if the kid gets stuck, doesn't sound like a very productive use of time.
  - prepend 4y ago
    Yes, homework helps. Are you aware of any skill where practice isn’t necessary? There is research in this area [0] so feel free to check it out. Of course practicing math helps. Parents help too, but working on problems at home to find areas that need help and then working with the teacher helps as well. I don’t think you need hours and hours, but the goal of homework is to reinforce the lesson, practice, and show mastery of the material and areas to work on before the exam. [0] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3102/00346543076001001 https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3102/003465430760010...
    - 908B64B197 4y ago
      > I don’t think you need hours and hours, but the goal of homework is to reinforce the lesson, practice, and show mastery of the material and areas to work on before the exam. I was under the impression that, before a certain age it was basically a cargo-cult because the assigned work is generally repetitive, busywork or not graded at all.
      - lenkite 4y ago
        "generally repetitive, busywork " I still learn a lot as an adult using this antiquated, antideluvian method.
      - prepend 4y ago
        If you read the paper I referenced you can correct your impression. (Tldr there’s still a statistically significant improvement in elementary school, but it’s less so than in higher grades)
zdragnar 4y ago
WRT equity in racial outcomes, nothing you mentioned factors in. Sports isn't even close to the problem. Look up the rates of students performing at grade level in reading and math, and also at graduation rates, broken down by race. These are kids whose parents and community couldn't care less about education, and if they did, they couldn't learn anything because the classroom is filled with the chaos of those who don't. Of course, race is nothing more than a proxy for poverty here- teachers in very poor rural areas will tell you much the same- but nobody really wants to hear that either.
- Spooky23 4y ago
  Kids are over scheduled. In my world, that means sports and similar stuff. I grew up in a relatively poor rural area, and you’re right, poverty and ignorance drives the same outcomes. Either way, homework as I had it in the 80s was more about the parents commitment to their child’s discipline than the kids.
SoftTalker 4y ago
If Johnny 8th grader is playing school lacrosse, travel baseball or AAU basketball he is from at least a solidly middle class, likely upper middle class family, travel sports requires disposable income. The kid who is involved in extra-curriculars likely has a family who cares and is doing better than average in the classroom because if your grades are too low you get kicked off of the team.
craigbarry 4y ago
[dead]

slothtrop 4y ago

Sounds like the obsession with perpetually-scheduled competitive sports could be just as easily identified as a problem. Intramurals are an option, and immigrant parents who place a larger premium on academic performance like to opt for that instead. That aside, a rec league is, what, 2 nights a week? No reason to believe that paired with homework would lead to burnout. Math and reading takes practice. That's what homework is. The top performing countries don't do any differently. It's interesting that there are people who worry about the quality of public education being under attack by Republicans, but embrace these non-evidence-based ideas for education reform that ultimately will only benefit the upper class.

lazyasciiart 4y ago
It's a huge problem, driven by silly college admissions practices. The top performing countries do not give a shit about your state lacrosse team medal when deciding who gets to enrol in a physics degree.
- Spooky23 4y ago
  My cousins got into Harvard based on their expertise in squash. Period. The fact that they were really smart was just the table stakes.
908B64B197 4y ago
> Math and reading takes practice. That's what homework is. The top performing countries don't do any differently. Is it actually proven that homework helps with anything? For elementary school at least. Reading perhaps. Math, when there's no parent at home capable of properly explaining it if the kid gets stuck, doesn't sound like a very productive use of time.
- prepend 4y ago
  Yes, homework helps. Are you aware of any skill where practice isn’t necessary? There is research in this area [0] so feel free to check it out. Of course practicing math helps. Parents help too, but working on problems at home to find areas that need help and then working with the teacher helps as well. I don’t think you need hours and hours, but the goal of homework is to reinforce the lesson, practice, and show mastery of the material and areas to work on before the exam. [0] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3102/00346543076001001 https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3102/003465430760010...
  - 908B64B197 4y ago
    > I don’t think you need hours and hours, but the goal of homework is to reinforce the lesson, practice, and show mastery of the material and areas to work on before the exam. I was under the impression that, before a certain age it was basically a cargo-cult because the assigned work is generally repetitive, busywork or not graded at all.
    - lenkite 4y ago
      "generally repetitive, busywork " I still learn a lot as an adult using this antiquated, antideluvian method.
    - prepend 4y ago
      If you read the paper I referenced you can correct your impression. (Tldr there’s still a statistically significant improvement in elementary school, but it’s less so than in higher grades)

zdragnar 4y ago

WRT equity in racial outcomes, nothing you mentioned factors in. Sports isn't even close to the problem. Look up the rates of students performing at grade level in reading and math, and also at graduation rates, broken down by race. These are kids whose parents and community couldn't care less about education, and if they did, they couldn't learn anything because the classroom is filled with the chaos of those who don't. Of course, race is nothing more than a proxy for poverty here- teachers in very poor rural areas will tell you much the same- but nobody really wants to hear that either.

Spooky23 4y ago
Kids are over scheduled. In my world, that means sports and similar stuff. I grew up in a relatively poor rural area, and you’re right, poverty and ignorance drives the same outcomes. Either way, homework as I had it in the 80s was more about the parents commitment to their child’s discipline than the kids.

SoftTalker 4y ago

If Johnny 8th grader is playing school lacrosse, travel baseball or AAU basketball he is from at least a solidly middle class, likely upper middle class family, travel sports requires disposable income. The kid who is involved in extra-curriculars likely has a family who cares and is doing better than average in the classroom because if your grades are too low you get kicked off of the team.

craigbarry 4y ago

[dead]