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I was expecting to see some data on how Amazon has driven up prices. There was none. Not even a single chart! This is an exceptionally poorly written article: a

I was expecting to see some data on how Amazon has driven up prices. There was none. Not even a single chart! This is an exceptionally poorly written article: acrobatic, liberal arts-esque logic and theoretical this-and-that and neologisms abound.

2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
Amazon blocks sellers from offering lower prices elsewhere. Evidence (pdf warning): https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/attachments/press-docs/2023-04-05_Notice%20and%20Redacted%20Complaint.pdf https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/attachments/press-docs/2023-...
- SubiculumCode 4y ago
  Seems like monopoly abuse 101 to me.
seattle_spring 4y ago
> liberal arts-esque logic Can you expand on specifically what you meant here?
- next_xibalba 4y ago
  Sure. (One of my degrees is in liberal arts, so I speak from personal experience here.) Many of the fields in liberal arts pump out ideas. Think of it as theoretical physics (less all the math) without any ability/attempt to prove the ideas via rigorous evidence or experimentation. Often ideas are heavily dressed up with pseudo-technical language in an attempt to legitimize them. See also the works of: Foucault, Jung, Derrida, Freud, etc. Now, in some cases, this is no big deal. For example, producing a work of art (novel, painting, etc.) does should not have any requirements of proof, evidence, falsifiability, etc. But in other cases, where the creation of new knowledge is claimed, a lot of this stuff should be thrown on the junk heap. It does nothing to improve the plight of humanity.
  - jgeada 4y ago
    Haven't you also just described Economics? (I frequently describe economics as soothsayers for the rich, telling them what they want to hear, but dressed up in technicallese and mathematics to make it appear as hard science, when it is far from it)
    - next_xibalba 4y ago
      Econ is definitely closer to psychology and sociology than it is to physics or chemistry on the "not science <--> science" spectrum. Econ is at least more quantitative and relies heavily on data (as compared to philosophy, <X> studies, etc). But obv experimentation is more difficult.
      - polka_haunts_us 4y ago
        Anecdotally, when I was taking Advanced Econometrics as an undergrad, the class was being audited by a professor in the Economics department that, in their education through PhD, had never actually learned any quantitative anaylsis. So there are definitely people out there that are getting by on the fact they can make their ideas sound good convincing enough to pass a journal's review board and a tenure committee. So yes, very much a social science.
abeppu 4y ago
What should this data actually be and how would one get it? You can't really do a fair experiment with random assignment where some companies use Amazon and some don't and we see how their prices change over time. Because of the "Most Favored Nation" issue, you can't meaningfully compare prices of products between Amazon and other platforms. Monopolies and anti-competitive practices remove meaningful choices, which naturally blocks or hinders anyone from studying the outcomes of those removed choices.
- next_xibalba 4y ago
  > Because of the "Most Favored Nation" issue, you can't meaningfully compare prices of products between Amazon and other platforms. Sure you can. Amazon lists millions of SKUs. A huge proportion of those are sold elsewhere, often by sellers who do not also sell on Amazon. But more fundamentally, if data can't be had, how does the author know this is actually happening? Either it is an unfalsifiable claim or its not, and there should be data. The bottom line is, the author makes an extraordinary claim and thus the onus is on them to provide commensurate evidence.

2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago

Amazon blocks sellers from offering lower prices elsewhere. Evidence (pdf warning): https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/attachments/press-docs/2023-04-05_Notice%20and%20Redacted%20Complaint.pdf https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/attachments/press-docs/2023-...

SubiculumCode 4y ago
Seems like monopoly abuse 101 to me.

seattle_spring 4y ago

> liberal arts-esque logic Can you expand on specifically what you meant here?

next_xibalba 4y ago
Sure. (One of my degrees is in liberal arts, so I speak from personal experience here.) Many of the fields in liberal arts pump out ideas. Think of it as theoretical physics (less all the math) without any ability/attempt to prove the ideas via rigorous evidence or experimentation. Often ideas are heavily dressed up with pseudo-technical language in an attempt to legitimize them. See also the works of: Foucault, Jung, Derrida, Freud, etc. Now, in some cases, this is no big deal. For example, producing a work of art (novel, painting, etc.) does should not have any requirements of proof, evidence, falsifiability, etc. But in other cases, where the creation of new knowledge is claimed, a lot of this stuff should be thrown on the junk heap. It does nothing to improve the plight of humanity.
- jgeada 4y ago
  Haven't you also just described Economics? (I frequently describe economics as soothsayers for the rich, telling them what they want to hear, but dressed up in technicallese and mathematics to make it appear as hard science, when it is far from it)
  - next_xibalba 4y ago
    Econ is definitely closer to psychology and sociology than it is to physics or chemistry on the "not science <--> science" spectrum. Econ is at least more quantitative and relies heavily on data (as compared to philosophy, <X> studies, etc). But obv experimentation is more difficult.
    - polka_haunts_us 4y ago
      Anecdotally, when I was taking Advanced Econometrics as an undergrad, the class was being audited by a professor in the Economics department that, in their education through PhD, had never actually learned any quantitative anaylsis. So there are definitely people out there that are getting by on the fact they can make their ideas sound good convincing enough to pass a journal's review board and a tenure committee. So yes, very much a social science.

abeppu 4y ago

What should this data actually be and how would one get it? You can't really do a fair experiment with random assignment where some companies use Amazon and some don't and we see how their prices change over time. Because of the "Most Favored Nation" issue, you can't meaningfully compare prices of products between Amazon and other platforms. Monopolies and anti-competitive practices remove meaningful choices, which naturally blocks or hinders anyone from studying the outcomes of those removed choices.

next_xibalba 4y ago
> Because of the "Most Favored Nation" issue, you can't meaningfully compare prices of products between Amazon and other platforms. Sure you can. Amazon lists millions of SKUs. A huge proportion of those are sold elsewhere, often by sellers who do not also sell on Amazon. But more fundamentally, if data can't be had, how does the author know this is actually happening? Either it is an unfalsifiable claim or its not, and there should be data. The bottom line is, the author makes an extraordinary claim and thus the onus is on them to provide commensurate evidence.