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That is the day I will quit reddit and never look back. 6 months ago I rarely used old.reddit.com, but now I run into more and more dark patterns all the time.

That is the day I will quit reddit and never look back. 6 months ago I rarely used old.reddit.com, but now I run into more and more dark patterns all the time. They tried to TikTok my feed and it was an awful experience. I frequently default to it now instead of using it only when I get sick of the dark patterns. Reddit got popular because Digg screwed up their comment threading. It's sad to see reddit is starting to make anti-user mistakes like digg. Maybe they think they can force it because there isn't a competent competitor. The problem with all of these sites is they start to service the lowest common denominator in the name of next quarters profits. As their websites become more hostile to the educated, the quality of content drops and profit goes up, but the golden goose is slowly being strangled. Reddit was fantastic around the time of digg because the average user appeared to be college educated or greater. Celebrities like Randall Monroe were submitting high quality content. It was common for a literal expert to write a well thought out post. Now it's an "Americas funniest home videos" feed of fart jokes with your liberal aunt and conservative uncle having an argument in the background. It seems so clear to me that billionaires mean we can't have nice things. Twitter and Reddit both promoted a "truth to power" free speech ideology, and now billionaires are coercing these companies into becoming cess pits that reflect the worst parts of humanity. Power doesn't like to be threatened so they will destroy the weapon. I still can't decide if these companies are being destroyed because they promote a "no more billionaires" ideology, or if it is simply capitalistic greed and the search for next quarters profits.

stametseater 4y ago
> The problem with all of these sites is they start to service the lowest common denominator in the name of next quarters profits. [...] It seems so clear to me that billionaires mean we can't have nice things" The pressure to increase quarterly profits to the detriment of the long-term emerges from the very nature of short-term investment, particularly as facilitated by stock exchanges. Eliminating billionaires would not eliminate this dynamic.
- lotsofpulp 4y ago
  Yes, Reddit is not even part of a publicly listed company that has investor pressure to meet quarterly numbers, it is privately owned by the Newhouse family. People just like having more money than less money. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications
  - Aloha 4y ago
    I think reddit is majority owned by Reddit employees.
    - 7373737373 4y ago
      The lack of ownership transparency is an absolute failure. Reddit should not have been for profit anyway
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      As of Jul 2015, per Wired article: https://www.wired.com/2015/07/wired-conde-nast-reddit/ https://www.wired.com/2015/07/wired-conde-nast-reddit/ >Advance Publications, is Reddit's majority shareholder
ROTMetro 4y ago
The entire Internet at the 'fantastic' time of Reddit was very much tilted towards the elite class that could 1. Afford an expensive computer or phone (or have access from University) 2. Afford Internet (and for an added bump of exclusivity add mobile Internet) (or have access from University) 3. Have the time/inclination to put lots of energy into CREATING Internet content (via either a hobby site, or composing well thought out posts). What you are complaining about is the quality of a restaurant that has gone from an exclusive new spot you discovered to a Chili's franchise. (Phil's Fish Market?). What everyone on Hacker News seems to long for is an Internet limited to 'that class' of people. They complain about billionaires and advertising, but maybe they should take a broader look at what they are really longing for.
- Eisenstein 4y ago
  Sure, having a group of people who are of the same general education, sensibilities, and class is desirable. When people who are only in the same space due to shared interests and experiences become too inclusive then that gets diluted and they are left being around a lot of people who are just a lot of people. No one likes that except extroverts and attention seekers. Trying to shame us for pining for the days of educated and interesting content made by people we relate to for reasons that are not tied to monetizing everything (because, well, we don't need it) is silly, because by pretending you think that is wrong means you are either short-sighted or bitter. This is not to say that exclusivity is desirable, but to say that communities exist for a reason and being nostalgic about losing a healthy one does not make you a bad person.
- hayst4ck 4y ago
  > What everyone on Hacker News seems to long for is an Internet limited to 'that class' of people. Yep, that is exactly what I want. I want to be around and interact with other educated people who act in good faith and I don't want to be around uneducated people who act in bad faith or can't see or aren't open to the contradictions in their own ideas. Eternal September is the name of this idea: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_News https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_News Graham stated he hopes to avoid the Eternal September that results in the general decline of intelligent discourse within a community. http://paulgraham.com/hackernews.html http://paulgraham.com/hackernews.html The good things in a community site come from people more than technology; it's mainly in the prevention of bad things that technology comes into play. Technology certainly can enhance discussion. Nested comments do, for example. But I'd rather use a site with primitive features and smart, nice users than a more advanced one whose users were idiots or trolls.

stametseater 4y ago

> The problem with all of these sites is they start to service the lowest common denominator in the name of next quarters profits. [...] It seems so clear to me that billionaires mean we can't have nice things" The pressure to increase quarterly profits to the detriment of the long-term emerges from the very nature of short-term investment, particularly as facilitated by stock exchanges. Eliminating billionaires would not eliminate this dynamic.

lotsofpulp 4y ago
Yes, Reddit is not even part of a publicly listed company that has investor pressure to meet quarterly numbers, it is privately owned by the Newhouse family. People just like having more money than less money. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_Publications
- Aloha 4y ago
  I think reddit is majority owned by Reddit employees.
  - 7373737373 4y ago
    The lack of ownership transparency is an absolute failure. Reddit should not have been for profit anyway
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    As of Jul 2015, per Wired article: https://www.wired.com/2015/07/wired-conde-nast-reddit/ https://www.wired.com/2015/07/wired-conde-nast-reddit/ >Advance Publications, is Reddit's majority shareholder

ROTMetro 4y ago

The entire Internet at the 'fantastic' time of Reddit was very much tilted towards the elite class that could 1. Afford an expensive computer or phone (or have access from University) 2. Afford Internet (and for an added bump of exclusivity add mobile Internet) (or have access from University) 3. Have the time/inclination to put lots of energy into CREATING Internet content (via either a hobby site, or composing well thought out posts). What you are complaining about is the quality of a restaurant that has gone from an exclusive new spot you discovered to a Chili's franchise. (Phil's Fish Market?). What everyone on Hacker News seems to long for is an Internet limited to 'that class' of people. They complain about billionaires and advertising, but maybe they should take a broader look at what they are really longing for.

Eisenstein 4y ago
Sure, having a group of people who are of the same general education, sensibilities, and class is desirable. When people who are only in the same space due to shared interests and experiences become too inclusive then that gets diluted and they are left being around a lot of people who are just a lot of people. No one likes that except extroverts and attention seekers. Trying to shame us for pining for the days of educated and interesting content made by people we relate to for reasons that are not tied to monetizing everything (because, well, we don't need it) is silly, because by pretending you think that is wrong means you are either short-sighted or bitter. This is not to say that exclusivity is desirable, but to say that communities exist for a reason and being nostalgic about losing a healthy one does not make you a bad person.
hayst4ck 4y ago
> What everyone on Hacker News seems to long for is an Internet limited to 'that class' of people. Yep, that is exactly what I want. I want to be around and interact with other educated people who act in good faith and I don't want to be around uneducated people who act in bad faith or can't see or aren't open to the contradictions in their own ideas. Eternal September is the name of this idea: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_News https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_News Graham stated he hopes to avoid the Eternal September that results in the general decline of intelligent discourse within a community. http://paulgraham.com/hackernews.html http://paulgraham.com/hackernews.html The good things in a community site come from people more than technology; it's mainly in the prevention of bad things that technology comes into play. Technology certainly can enhance discussion. Nested comments do, for example. But I'd rather use a site with primitive features and smart, nice users than a more advanced one whose users were idiots or trolls.