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Well, first, Cisco router, then TPM chips, then most of foreign hardware in government offices. I won't even mention Raytheon and Lockheed stuff. Also, you are

Well, first, Cisco router, then TPM chips, then most of foreign hardware in government offices. I won't even mention Raytheon and Lockheed stuff. Also, you are making a bad faith argument. The topic was in "product". You specifically tried to gate it to "hardware". China is the producer of most hardware in the world. They aren't going to ban stuff that was made by them. Software product on the other hand, aren't really their forte until recently and that they banned plenty.

MichaelZuo 4y ago
In the context of Huawei or Xiaomi it can only mean hardware products, since neither sold any stand-alone software product to consumers in the U.S. At least not any that I'm aware of?
- tomohelix 4y ago
  >It's tit for tat anyway, China has banned order of magnitude more US products. The context in this specific part is about the retaliations between countries. It has expanded beyond just one company when you start talking about entire economies fighting each other. Besides, I already gave you the US hardware that China banned.
  - MichaelZuo 3y ago
    > Cisco routers As far as I can tell news reports suggest their not invited to bid on government and SoE contracts, but their China revenue is far from zero so they obviously have not been banned from consumer or regular business sales. Considering that cisco.cn works, is publicily accessible, recently updated, and lists some products, this 'ban' seems impossible to believe: https://www.cisco.com/site/cn/zh/index.html https://www.cisco.com/site/cn/zh/index.html Where did you source this information?
bllguo 4y ago
a question as innocuous as this is a "bad faith argument"? We are in a thread about Xiaomi _hardware_, but nefarious intentions are more probable to you than someone just having the original subject in mind?
- tomohelix 4y ago
  True. Perhaps I should have been more generous in interpreting intentions. Difficult change my habit though when there are accounts whose posts are completely dedicated to defending China's actions, even in egregious matters like Hong Kong and Tibet. I tried giving them benefits of the doubt before, it never went anywhere. Maybe here it is different. I guess I can try again.
  - MichaelZuo 4y ago
    Anyone can click on the profile and see this is a pseudonym account made 70 days ago. Anyone can also check my account's been around since 2014 and links to my personal blog, twitter, etc. So it's clear to most readers what the relative likelihood of attempted trolling is. I will take the charitable view that there's real person behind the account who didn't bother to check before writing.
    - tomohelix 4y ago
      You are free to use your real name and connect your real life to social media. I don't and have no need to. You are also free to check every post history of everyone you interact with. I don't have that amount of time. And I am free to call out a bad argument when I see one. If you had practiced the checking post history properly, you would have noticed that account age and karma rarely correlate to anything. You are also free to respond to the other comment I made to your post and not jumping to another one. These remarks are not specifically for you. Go take a look at the account I replied to above yours to see why I said that.
      - MichaelZuo 4y ago
        This seems incoherent. If you have a point to make, write it down in a way readers can understand, else given the bizarre prior comment, it only increases the perception of bizarreness.

MichaelZuo 4y ago

In the context of Huawei or Xiaomi it can only mean hardware products, since neither sold any stand-alone software product to consumers in the U.S. At least not any that I'm aware of?

tomohelix 4y ago
>It's tit for tat anyway, China has banned order of magnitude more US products. The context in this specific part is about the retaliations between countries. It has expanded beyond just one company when you start talking about entire economies fighting each other. Besides, I already gave you the US hardware that China banned.
- MichaelZuo 3y ago
  > Cisco routers As far as I can tell news reports suggest their not invited to bid on government and SoE contracts, but their China revenue is far from zero so they obviously have not been banned from consumer or regular business sales. Considering that cisco.cn works, is publicily accessible, recently updated, and lists some products, this 'ban' seems impossible to believe: https://www.cisco.com/site/cn/zh/index.html https://www.cisco.com/site/cn/zh/index.html Where did you source this information?

bllguo 4y ago

a question as innocuous as this is a "bad faith argument"? We are in a thread about Xiaomi _hardware_, but nefarious intentions are more probable to you than someone just having the original subject in mind?

tomohelix 4y ago
True. Perhaps I should have been more generous in interpreting intentions. Difficult change my habit though when there are accounts whose posts are completely dedicated to defending China's actions, even in egregious matters like Hong Kong and Tibet. I tried giving them benefits of the doubt before, it never went anywhere. Maybe here it is different. I guess I can try again.
- MichaelZuo 4y ago
  Anyone can click on the profile and see this is a pseudonym account made 70 days ago. Anyone can also check my account's been around since 2014 and links to my personal blog, twitter, etc. So it's clear to most readers what the relative likelihood of attempted trolling is. I will take the charitable view that there's real person behind the account who didn't bother to check before writing.
  - tomohelix 4y ago
    You are free to use your real name and connect your real life to social media. I don't and have no need to. You are also free to check every post history of everyone you interact with. I don't have that amount of time. And I am free to call out a bad argument when I see one. If you had practiced the checking post history properly, you would have noticed that account age and karma rarely correlate to anything. You are also free to respond to the other comment I made to your post and not jumping to another one. These remarks are not specifically for you. Go take a look at the account I replied to above yours to see why I said that.
    - MichaelZuo 4y ago
      This seems incoherent. If you have a point to make, write it down in a way readers can understand, else given the bizarre prior comment, it only increases the perception of bizarreness.