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I know there won't be any convincing you, but these types of thoughtless comments are why sensible discussion on this topic doesn't happen very often. Thoughtle

I know there won't be any convincing you, but these types of thoughtless comments are why sensible discussion on this topic doesn't happen very often. Thoughtless anit-Apple comments are no more insightful than thoughtless Apple fanboy comments. My preference is to have a device where there are no technical means to side load apps (as that is a security control), and to have a device where a publisher cannot attempt to force me to use a side-loaded app store. I explained my reasons for having those preferences, and if you'd like you can respond to that. But this comment simply ignores all of that. You say "my choice", while ignoring all of the reasons I provided for why these changes could potentially undermine my ability to choose entirely.

kibwen 4y ago
The parent's comments aren't anti-Apple in the slightest. Please refrain from ad hominem. The logic is simple: if you don't want sideloaded apps on your device, don't install them. There's no argument against this, which is why the the endless parade of facile handwringing about security is so preposterous.
- AmericanChopper 4y ago
  Your logic is wrong, for the reasons I’ve explained. It creates an attack surface that never existed before. It allows the possibility of an entire category of evil maid attacks that were never possible before. It allows vendors to attempt to force users who don’t want to use 3rd party app stores, to use 3rd party app stores. You either didn’t read my comment, or you simply don’t understand how these security controls work.
  - kibwen 4y ago
    > It allows the possibility of an entire category of evil maid attacks that were never possible before. No, if an adversary has physical access to your phone and can unlock it, you've already lost. > It allows vendors to attempt to force users who don’t want to use 3rd party app stores, to use 3rd party app stores. The refrain from defenders of this policy up until has been "just use a different device". Thus, I'm giddy that I get to turn this around: "just use a different app". Think about what website you're on, and realize that you're fighting a lost battle.
    - AmericanChopper 4y ago
      I’m aware that the prevailing opinions on hacker news support side loading, just as I’m aware the the prevailing opinion among the general public is they don’t care about it, and likely don’t even know what it is. However these opinions have no influence over the factual compromises that these changes make to security controls. Currently if I gave you my iPhone and my PIN code, and asked you to install malware on it, you wouldn’t be able to. The fact that you’re making some appeal to the opinions of the community rather than engage with these facts shows the strength of your argument (in addition to the general childishness of your comments).

kibwen 4y ago

The parent's comments aren't anti-Apple in the slightest. Please refrain from ad hominem. The logic is simple: if you don't want sideloaded apps on your device, don't install them. There's no argument against this, which is why the the endless parade of facile handwringing about security is so preposterous.

AmericanChopper 4y ago
Your logic is wrong, for the reasons I’ve explained. It creates an attack surface that never existed before. It allows the possibility of an entire category of evil maid attacks that were never possible before. It allows vendors to attempt to force users who don’t want to use 3rd party app stores, to use 3rd party app stores. You either didn’t read my comment, or you simply don’t understand how these security controls work.
- kibwen 4y ago
  > It allows the possibility of an entire category of evil maid attacks that were never possible before. No, if an adversary has physical access to your phone and can unlock it, you've already lost. > It allows vendors to attempt to force users who don’t want to use 3rd party app stores, to use 3rd party app stores. The refrain from defenders of this policy up until has been "just use a different device". Thus, I'm giddy that I get to turn this around: "just use a different app". Think about what website you're on, and realize that you're fighting a lost battle.
  - AmericanChopper 4y ago
    I’m aware that the prevailing opinions on hacker news support side loading, just as I’m aware the the prevailing opinion among the general public is they don’t care about it, and likely don’t even know what it is. However these opinions have no influence over the factual compromises that these changes make to security controls. Currently if I gave you my iPhone and my PIN code, and asked you to install malware on it, you wouldn’t be able to. The fact that you’re making some appeal to the opinions of the community rather than engage with these facts shows the strength of your argument (in addition to the general childishness of your comments).