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I've had sort of the opposite thought (not that there's anything resembling a singular "right answer" on topics like this): we shouldn't try to colonize Mars un

I've had sort of the opposite thought (not that there's anything resembling a singular "right answer" on topics like this): we shouldn't try to colonize Mars until after we've terraformed it. Scientific outposts would be fine, but much like Antarctica, no one ought to be in a position where they have to live in caves or cans their entire life.

JumpCrisscross 4y ago
> Scientific outposts would be fine, but much like Antarctica, no one ought to be in a position where they have to live in caves or cans their entire life Kim Stanley Robinson’s Mars trilogy changed my mind on this. There is natural beauty there that is worth trying to preserve and experience. Yes, we should terraform. But slowly and deliberately. A good way to check this is to have humans on the surface while terraforming takes place.
- maxbond 4y ago
  Is it really possible to contain the terraforming? Even if you have domes, it seems like it's only a matter of time before single celled organisms escape and find a way to survive, and then begin to alter the environment.
- GolfPopper 4y ago
  My concern is that humans "on the surface" (really, in habitats) are going to live pretty miserable lives for a really long time. Compare Mars to Antarctica. While there's a significant science-focused presence, no one lives there lives there. While various treaties complicate the issue, to the best of my knowledge, no one even speaks about wanting to spend their entire life there. Living permanently on Mars without extensive terraforming would mean generations of people living out their lives in caves and metal cans, never getting to go outside without putting on the equivalent of a SCUBA suit, at a minimum. It makes for great stories, but as a cradle-to-grave life is seems unethical to help create that situation. Besides, I think gradual (or no) terraforming of Mars is doomed. Getting to orbit is increasingly cheap, and that makes getting to Mars easier, whether by the ITN [1], or more direct method. You can get to Mars with a Cubesat-type spacecraft design. [2] Somebody is going to leverage those possibility to start terraforming Mars, if they haven't done so already. Optimal terraforming probably requires adding atmosphere, presumably via comet impacts. That will take more than Cubesats, but the possibility was demonstrated by DART. Unless our civilization collapses, fast terraforming of Mars is only going to get easier, and probably sooner rather than later, someone will start the process. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Transport_Network https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Transport_Netwo... 2. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/cubesat-at-mars-180971213/ https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/cubesat-at...

JumpCrisscross 4y ago

> Scientific outposts would be fine, but much like Antarctica, no one ought to be in a position where they have to live in caves or cans their entire life Kim Stanley Robinson’s Mars trilogy changed my mind on this. There is natural beauty there that is worth trying to preserve and experience. Yes, we should terraform. But slowly and deliberately. A good way to check this is to have humans on the surface while terraforming takes place.

maxbond 4y ago
Is it really possible to contain the terraforming? Even if you have domes, it seems like it's only a matter of time before single celled organisms escape and find a way to survive, and then begin to alter the environment.
GolfPopper 4y ago
My concern is that humans "on the surface" (really, in habitats) are going to live pretty miserable lives for a really long time. Compare Mars to Antarctica. While there's a significant science-focused presence, no one lives there lives there. While various treaties complicate the issue, to the best of my knowledge, no one even speaks about wanting to spend their entire life there. Living permanently on Mars without extensive terraforming would mean generations of people living out their lives in caves and metal cans, never getting to go outside without putting on the equivalent of a SCUBA suit, at a minimum. It makes for great stories, but as a cradle-to-grave life is seems unethical to help create that situation. Besides, I think gradual (or no) terraforming of Mars is doomed. Getting to orbit is increasingly cheap, and that makes getting to Mars easier, whether by the ITN [1], or more direct method. You can get to Mars with a Cubesat-type spacecraft design. [2] Somebody is going to leverage those possibility to start terraforming Mars, if they haven't done so already. Optimal terraforming probably requires adding atmosphere, presumably via comet impacts. That will take more than Cubesats, but the possibility was demonstrated by DART. Unless our civilization collapses, fast terraforming of Mars is only going to get easier, and probably sooner rather than later, someone will start the process. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Transport_Network https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Transport_Netwo... 2. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/cubesat-at-mars-180971213/ https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/cubesat-at...