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You don’t have the full picture. You’re missing a lot of data > And the rank-and-file Googlers will defend this because they think they caught God by the ankle

You don’t have the full picture. You’re missing a lot of data > And the rank-and-file Googlers will defend this because they think they caught God by the ankles with their 150k/year salary That’s closer to their intern salaries. Total comp is more like double or more Much of the rank and file’s total compensation is also in stock Add to that if you wanted to, you can do the minimum and just coast. No one is going to unionize and it’s not for the reasons you’ve cited. Maybe you shouldn’t comment on something you know barely anything about?

kubb 4y ago
> Maybe you shouldn’t comment on something you know barely anything about? Very weak counterpoint, essentially ad personam, trying to insinuate my ignorance, telling me to shut up. Not impressive.
- d23 4y ago
  He brought up that you are grossly off the mark on salary. And it’s a pretty broad brush to say everyone at google is “timid” and this is the only reason they don’t unionize.
- chaostheory 4y ago
  Yes, having a counterpoint with a relevant data point that you missed is “weak” you are ignorant, making your argument weak and just plain wrong. Should people no longer point out when comments are really wrong? You’re also over generalizing while being completely incorrect ie making shit up
  - kubb 4y ago
    You didn't provide a "relevant data point". The base salary for an L3 (rank-and-file) SWE in the Bay Area (which is one of the highest paid areas in the US) is 140K on levels.fyi. You've compared this to the total comp which includes stock (that tanked recently), and a bonus (which isn't guaranteed). You're asserting that you're right and I have no idea what I'm talking about baselessly and being agressive and rude. I don't need to engage with that, nobody does.
    - chaostheory 4y ago
      In the article if you read it, most of Sundar’s criticized compensation came in the form of stock. Total comp is relevant. It might be down, but it’s still way more than 150k. It’s double or more L3’s are newbies. They’re one step above interns. It’s easy to become an L4. L4 - L5 are rank and file. You’re still really wrong and very ignorant on the subject. As for being aggressive, I’m not the one over generalizing and calling the rank and file at Google spineless
    - d23 4y ago
      > bonus (which isn't guaranteed) You're again showing that you're uninformed. The bonus is guaranteed for everyone that doesn't get the lowest level of performance evaluation.
      - pb7 4y ago
        >the lowest level of performance evaluation The level that's synonymous with "this was your notice that you should start looking elsewhere because you will be let go in 6 months or less". The bonuses are as guaranteed as your next paycheck.
    - pb7 4y ago
      Stock "tanked" 35% from the top after running up for years. It doesn't make the stock component of the compensation zero. Median compensation is >$300K. You could have made your point without making up numbers that are easily fact checked. Other guy is right, you're misinformed and continuing to argue when you're wrong makes you ignorant and foolish.
  - sysstemlord 4y ago
    You don't know if he's ignorant based on his one comment, seems you are also over generalizing, also this comment isn't really ignorant. He did state issues that are conceptually accurate and generally describe the situation, regardless of whether the number in the yearly salary is a little different, this doesn't change the problem.
    - chaostheory 4y ago
      No, he was not accurate. There’s also a large difference between $300k in compensation and $150k. Unionizing will not help with that You guys are just continuing to help prove my point
lrem 4y ago
> Add to that if you wanted to, you can do the minimum and just coast. "Coast" a.k.a. perform only the duties as agreed in your contract, without going above and beyond. A.k.a. "quiet quitting", or the preposterous idea that the company doesn't own the time they don't pay you for. I'm a somewhat long-time Googler and really dislike this anti-labour narrative.
- lupire 4y ago
  You can also not do your duties and bet on management not noticing.
  - lrem 4y ago
    That might be possible in some medium-sized companies. In megacorps probably about 5-10% of your time goes into various flavours of performance management. To hide for any significant amount of time, you'd need to have your manager actively cover you.
- chaostheory 4y ago
  It’s not an anti labor narrative. It’s reality. When you start having families, you slow down. Many googlers who want to keep pushing tend to leave Google
- jdiff 4y ago
  The whole idea of that being "quiet quitting" is preposterous. For many, many jobs that's just called a good work-life balance. They're buying your time in order to complete a task, they're not buying your soul. They want a task done, do the task. Doing just your job and no more is not a bad thing lol
rullelito 4y ago
You seem uniformed on many levels.

kubb 4y ago

> Maybe you shouldn’t comment on something you know barely anything about? Very weak counterpoint, essentially ad personam, trying to insinuate my ignorance, telling me to shut up. Not impressive.

d23 4y ago
He brought up that you are grossly off the mark on salary. And it’s a pretty broad brush to say everyone at google is “timid” and this is the only reason they don’t unionize.
chaostheory 4y ago
Yes, having a counterpoint with a relevant data point that you missed is “weak” you are ignorant, making your argument weak and just plain wrong. Should people no longer point out when comments are really wrong? You’re also over generalizing while being completely incorrect ie making shit up
- kubb 4y ago
  You didn't provide a "relevant data point". The base salary for an L3 (rank-and-file) SWE in the Bay Area (which is one of the highest paid areas in the US) is 140K on levels.fyi. You've compared this to the total comp which includes stock (that tanked recently), and a bonus (which isn't guaranteed). You're asserting that you're right and I have no idea what I'm talking about baselessly and being agressive and rude. I don't need to engage with that, nobody does.
  - chaostheory 4y ago
    In the article if you read it, most of Sundar’s criticized compensation came in the form of stock. Total comp is relevant. It might be down, but it’s still way more than 150k. It’s double or more L3’s are newbies. They’re one step above interns. It’s easy to become an L4. L4 - L5 are rank and file. You’re still really wrong and very ignorant on the subject. As for being aggressive, I’m not the one over generalizing and calling the rank and file at Google spineless
  - d23 4y ago
    > bonus (which isn't guaranteed) You're again showing that you're uninformed. The bonus is guaranteed for everyone that doesn't get the lowest level of performance evaluation.
    - pb7 4y ago
      >the lowest level of performance evaluation The level that's synonymous with "this was your notice that you should start looking elsewhere because you will be let go in 6 months or less". The bonuses are as guaranteed as your next paycheck.
  - pb7 4y ago
    Stock "tanked" 35% from the top after running up for years. It doesn't make the stock component of the compensation zero. Median compensation is >$300K. You could have made your point without making up numbers that are easily fact checked. Other guy is right, you're misinformed and continuing to argue when you're wrong makes you ignorant and foolish.
- sysstemlord 4y ago
  You don't know if he's ignorant based on his one comment, seems you are also over generalizing, also this comment isn't really ignorant. He did state issues that are conceptually accurate and generally describe the situation, regardless of whether the number in the yearly salary is a little different, this doesn't change the problem.
  - chaostheory 4y ago
    No, he was not accurate. There’s also a large difference between $300k in compensation and $150k. Unionizing will not help with that You guys are just continuing to help prove my point

lrem 4y ago

> Add to that if you wanted to, you can do the minimum and just coast. "Coast" a.k.a. perform only the duties as agreed in your contract, without going above and beyond. A.k.a. "quiet quitting", or the preposterous idea that the company doesn't own the time they don't pay you for. I'm a somewhat long-time Googler and really dislike this anti-labour narrative.

lupire 4y ago
You can also not do your duties and bet on management not noticing.
- lrem 4y ago
  That might be possible in some medium-sized companies. In megacorps probably about 5-10% of your time goes into various flavours of performance management. To hide for any significant amount of time, you'd need to have your manager actively cover you.
chaostheory 4y ago
It’s not an anti labor narrative. It’s reality. When you start having families, you slow down. Many googlers who want to keep pushing tend to leave Google
jdiff 4y ago
The whole idea of that being "quiet quitting" is preposterous. For many, many jobs that's just called a good work-life balance. They're buying your time in order to complete a task, they're not buying your soul. They want a task done, do the task. Doing just your job and no more is not a bad thing lol

rullelito 4y ago

You seem uniformed on many levels.