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> And "woke messaging"? To fully explore this idea, I'd have to say some things that are verbotten on HN, but suffice it to say that there's a big difference b

> And "woke messaging"? To fully explore this idea, I'd have to say some things that are verbotten on HN, but suffice it to say that there's a big difference between the policy of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" and going full on into LGBTQPIA+ that the current military appears to be going on. This kind of thing may have an impression on the kinds of young men that might want to join the military. (as a very small supporting data point on this, look at men's declining entry to colleges). Again, you don't have to agree or disagree with it, I'm only pointing out factors in the conversation that might not get brought up otherwise. These are factors to a non-trivial part of the population. > A proxy war with Russia that US troops are not involved in--certainly relative to the US military situation overseas in the past couple of decades? The wars of recent decades are a big factor, but I can say that this push against Russia also isn't helping. My opinion is that people want to defend their homes, but don't want to risk getting exploded in some unnecessary conflict. > And lots of private companies required COVID shots to remain employed. And many people hated this and sought out companies that didn't require them. You don't have to agree with refusing the vaccine, but I hope you understand that many people absolutely didn't want it and the military's insistence on injecting people with this doesn't help among some people. > So, yes, those seem like largely irrelevant reasons. I strongly disagree with your analysis, but thank you for your polite and honest thoughts at least.

autoexec 3y ago
> there's a big difference between the policy of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" and going full on into LGBTQPIA+ that the current military appears to be going on. This kind of thing may have an impression on the kinds of young men that might want to join the military. I think historically there's probably been a lot of bigoted people in the service, but I'm not sure we should set policy to specifically cater to them just to bump recruitment numbers. > The wars of recent decades are a big factor, but I can say that this push against Russia also isn't helping. My opinion is that people want to defend their homes, but don't want to risk getting exploded in some unnecessary conflict. I agree 100% that this is a major factor. I've spoken with many people who are willing to fight to defend their country, but aren't interested in ending up overseas defending oil fields. I don't think it's fair to say that the US is dead set on a war with Russia. Russia is the one invading our allies unprovoked, flooding the internet with disinformation and interfering in our elections. The US might not always respond well to Russia's antics, but I don't think the US is trying to start trouble. > You don't have to agree with refusing the vaccine, but I hope you understand that many people absolutely didn't want it and the military's insistence on injecting people with this doesn't help among some people. Military service requires a ton of vaccinations and so antivaxxers were never jumping at the chance to sign on. I'd even suggest that we're probably better off without them anyway. Anyone unwilling to take such a simple step to help protect themselves and their fellow Americans probably won't be the right person for the job, and certainly anyone who is still worried that it's going to turn them magnetic, or give them 5G powers, or worried that it's somehow horrifically dangerous even after 13 billion+ shots have been administered globally without much issue might not be someone whose judgement you want to depend on being able to make quick decisions in a critical situation.
- logicalmonster 3y ago
  > I think historically there's probably been a lot of bigoted people in the service, but I'm not sure we should set policy to specifically cater to them just to bump recruitment numbers. This is a straw man point. Not wanting to be in a "woke" organization and having to constantly have stuff like sexuality bashed over your head that doesn't belong in a professional workplace doesn't necessarily mean that you're a bigot. > I don't think the US is trying to start trouble. I have friends from countries like Ukraine and Georgia that face big problems with Russia. Even though they don't necessarily always like Russia's government, they refer to the US as a literal spider, always sneaking around and trying to achieve power and play games everywhere. They tell me how the US meddles in their own politics and elections all of the time. Feel free to have your own belief, but your opinion is contrary to a lot of my own experience from people in the region. > Military service requires a ton of vaccinations and so antivaxxers were never jumping at the chance to sign on. Being against the Covid vaccine specifically doesn't necessarily imply that you are against all vaccines. I'm not trying to be insulting, but I'd like to express in the kindest way possible that the people that are very afraid of Covid do not seem to be informed about the other perspective very well at all. > I'd even suggest that we're probably better off without them anyway. If the concern is dwindling recruitment numbers, you do realize that a non-trivial percentage of the public is against the Covid vaccine, right? Maybe the military can limp along in peacetime without them, but God forbid there's ever a real national emergency that requires a unified response. > someone whose judgement you want to depend on being able to make quick decisions in a critical situation. Feel free to have your own opinion, but I have the exact opposite interpretation. Succumbing to peer pressure is weak-mindedness. Many people didn't want to take it, and knew it was the wrong choice, but did so because of peer pressure and not wanting to face any minor personal difficulty like not being able to see a concert for a few months. This is not an admirable quality. On the flipside, the people who did what they thought was right regardless of the personal difficulty it posed in their lives have demonstrated a remarkable bit of positive character. These people resisted the greatest government gaslighting event in the history of the world. Being able to say no when all of the institutions of the world are trying to get you to say yes is an honorable quality that shows a strength of will.

autoexec 3y ago

> there's a big difference between the policy of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" and going full on into LGBTQPIA+ that the current military appears to be going on. This kind of thing may have an impression on the kinds of young men that might want to join the military. I think historically there's probably been a lot of bigoted people in the service, but I'm not sure we should set policy to specifically cater to them just to bump recruitment numbers. > The wars of recent decades are a big factor, but I can say that this push against Russia also isn't helping. My opinion is that people want to defend their homes, but don't want to risk getting exploded in some unnecessary conflict. I agree 100% that this is a major factor. I've spoken with many people who are willing to fight to defend their country, but aren't interested in ending up overseas defending oil fields. I don't think it's fair to say that the US is dead set on a war with Russia. Russia is the one invading our allies unprovoked, flooding the internet with disinformation and interfering in our elections. The US might not always respond well to Russia's antics, but I don't think the US is trying to start trouble. > You don't have to agree with refusing the vaccine, but I hope you understand that many people absolutely didn't want it and the military's insistence on injecting people with this doesn't help among some people. Military service requires a ton of vaccinations and so antivaxxers were never jumping at the chance to sign on. I'd even suggest that we're probably better off without them anyway. Anyone unwilling to take such a simple step to help protect themselves and their fellow Americans probably won't be the right person for the job, and certainly anyone who is still worried that it's going to turn them magnetic, or give them 5G powers, or worried that it's somehow horrifically dangerous even after 13 billion+ shots have been administered globally without much issue might not be someone whose judgement you want to depend on being able to make quick decisions in a critical situation.

logicalmonster 3y ago
> I think historically there's probably been a lot of bigoted people in the service, but I'm not sure we should set policy to specifically cater to them just to bump recruitment numbers. This is a straw man point. Not wanting to be in a "woke" organization and having to constantly have stuff like sexuality bashed over your head that doesn't belong in a professional workplace doesn't necessarily mean that you're a bigot. > I don't think the US is trying to start trouble. I have friends from countries like Ukraine and Georgia that face big problems with Russia. Even though they don't necessarily always like Russia's government, they refer to the US as a literal spider, always sneaking around and trying to achieve power and play games everywhere. They tell me how the US meddles in their own politics and elections all of the time. Feel free to have your own belief, but your opinion is contrary to a lot of my own experience from people in the region. > Military service requires a ton of vaccinations and so antivaxxers were never jumping at the chance to sign on. Being against the Covid vaccine specifically doesn't necessarily imply that you are against all vaccines. I'm not trying to be insulting, but I'd like to express in the kindest way possible that the people that are very afraid of Covid do not seem to be informed about the other perspective very well at all. > I'd even suggest that we're probably better off without them anyway. If the concern is dwindling recruitment numbers, you do realize that a non-trivial percentage of the public is against the Covid vaccine, right? Maybe the military can limp along in peacetime without them, but God forbid there's ever a real national emergency that requires a unified response. > someone whose judgement you want to depend on being able to make quick decisions in a critical situation. Feel free to have your own opinion, but I have the exact opposite interpretation. Succumbing to peer pressure is weak-mindedness. Many people didn't want to take it, and knew it was the wrong choice, but did so because of peer pressure and not wanting to face any minor personal difficulty like not being able to see a concert for a few months. This is not an admirable quality. On the flipside, the people who did what they thought was right regardless of the personal difficulty it posed in their lives have demonstrated a remarkable bit of positive character. These people resisted the greatest government gaslighting event in the history of the world. Being able to say no when all of the institutions of the world are trying to get you to say yes is an honorable quality that shows a strength of will.