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> The App Store already is doing a poor job at trying to prevent copycat apps, this makes it so much worse. Perhaps, but if it is like Android, users will get

> The App Store already is doing a poor job at trying to prevent copycat apps, this makes it so much worse. Perhaps, but if it is like Android, users will get plenty of warning when they try to turn on side loading, and every time they get a chance to sideload. > Facebook/TikTok/etc just have to say something like "Here's our fancy new version and feature X is only available when you follow these new install instructions" and it'll happen. 10+ years of Android sideloading and this has not happened.

jackson1442 4y ago
I suspect things like this won't happen on their primary apps, but Facebook _has_ already done this on iOS with their Onavo VPN app. They incentivized people (including teenagers) to sideload the Onavo VPN app which would intercept their network traffic for "research" in exchange for a $20 gift card every month. This was done using Facebook's enterprise developer certificate, which allows them to sign apps for internal use - Apple revoked the certificate as it was a violation of ToS to use it externally as they were. https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/30/apple-bans-facebook-vpn/ https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/30/apple-bans-facebook-vpn/
- hnbear 4y ago
  Thanks - yes, this is what I mistakenly referenced as Test Flight side-loading. It was the enterprise cert, not Test Flight. And yes, they already tried it it as a way around controls.
AlexandrB 4y ago
> 10+ years of Android sideloading and this has not happened. Android's permission and anti-tracking measures have generally been more lenient. I'm sure if sideloading was permitted when the anti tracking measures rolled out on iOS Facebook would have jumped to side loading ASAP.
- celsoazevedo 4y ago
  It's important not to mix App Store/Play Store policies with iOS/Android restrictions. Sideloaded Facebook can't access your location or camera if you don't tell iOS to give them access (iOS restrictions). On the other hand, there's nothing stopping sideloaded Facebook from refusing to work if you don't let them access those things (no App Store rules). Something else to consider is the fact that the average user only installs apps from the default store. If Facebook wants installs, that's where they have to be. Also, we don't know many "scary screens" Apple will display when trying to sideload something.
  - sleepybrett 4y ago
    The problem becomes they add some feature like a camera subapp with decals/mlbullshit to get your permission, but once they have that permission they can do whatever the fuck shady thing they want with it.
  - hnbear 4y ago
    Sure - but how well do most people read scary screens? People click through pop-ups without reading them all the time. Could pop-up a "click OK to send your money to us" button and people would click OK and I'd get calls from family asking where their money went.
    - celsoazevedo 4y ago
      It depends on how Apple implements it, I guess? Some Android skins show you a big red warning, disable the "install" button for a few seconds, and the cancel button is the one with the bright colour. This, plus not allowing sideloading by default, seems to work well. A simple popup probably wouldn't be as effective.

jackson1442 4y ago

I suspect things like this won't happen on their primary apps, but Facebook _has_ already done this on iOS with their Onavo VPN app. They incentivized people (including teenagers) to sideload the Onavo VPN app which would intercept their network traffic for "research" in exchange for a $20 gift card every month. This was done using Facebook's enterprise developer certificate, which allows them to sign apps for internal use - Apple revoked the certificate as it was a violation of ToS to use it externally as they were. https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/30/apple-bans-facebook-vpn/ https://techcrunch.com/2019/01/30/apple-bans-facebook-vpn/

hnbear 4y ago
Thanks - yes, this is what I mistakenly referenced as Test Flight side-loading. It was the enterprise cert, not Test Flight. And yes, they already tried it it as a way around controls.

AlexandrB 4y ago

> 10+ years of Android sideloading and this has not happened. Android's permission and anti-tracking measures have generally been more lenient. I'm sure if sideloading was permitted when the anti tracking measures rolled out on iOS Facebook would have jumped to side loading ASAP.

celsoazevedo 4y ago
It's important not to mix App Store/Play Store policies with iOS/Android restrictions. Sideloaded Facebook can't access your location or camera if you don't tell iOS to give them access (iOS restrictions). On the other hand, there's nothing stopping sideloaded Facebook from refusing to work if you don't let them access those things (no App Store rules). Something else to consider is the fact that the average user only installs apps from the default store. If Facebook wants installs, that's where they have to be. Also, we don't know many "scary screens" Apple will display when trying to sideload something.
- sleepybrett 4y ago
  The problem becomes they add some feature like a camera subapp with decals/mlbullshit to get your permission, but once they have that permission they can do whatever the fuck shady thing they want with it.
- hnbear 4y ago
  Sure - but how well do most people read scary screens? People click through pop-ups without reading them all the time. Could pop-up a "click OK to send your money to us" button and people would click OK and I'd get calls from family asking where their money went.
  - celsoazevedo 4y ago
    It depends on how Apple implements it, I guess? Some Android skins show you a big red warning, disable the "install" button for a few seconds, and the cancel button is the one with the bright colour. This, plus not allowing sideloading by default, seems to work well. A simple popup probably wouldn't be as effective.