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Cyclists are perceived as the opposite: hobbyists who go too slowly and hold everyone up. By the simple act of riding down a busy street, a well-placed cyclist

Cyclists are perceived as the opposite: hobbyists who go too slowly and hold everyone up. By the simple act of riding down a busy street, a well-placed cyclist can necessitate hundreds of questionable overtaking maneuvers as each car has to pass them. "Trail of chaos" in other words.

alpaca128 4y ago
And most of those cyclists would love to be on a bike lane instead, but those often just don't exist. From personal experience it's also annoying when I get hate from car drivers who assume I deliberately use the road instead of the "bike lane" which is in fact only meant for pedestrians, but try to explain that in half a second while passing and when the official road markings are only visible with forensic tools.
- deaddodo 4y ago
  While LA is hardly a paragon of bicycling accessibility, it does have a ton of dedicated cycling routes (I’m talking 8-12+ ft wide, dedicated pathways) that can get bicyclists to most of the major hubs throughout the city. Even still, you’ll see the occasional bicyclist(s) who wants to drive down Washington Blvd during rush hours Because-They-Can(TM) and the cycling path is a little too inconvenient for them, holding up hundreds of cars. I have nothing against the majority of bicyclists, but those occasional entitled few are the only ones people see; which can easily paint their opinions of all of them.
  - burnished 4y ago
    How outrageous, they want to use the infrastructure like they're people?
    - deaddodo 4y ago
      It's almost like, in a society, you sometimes give up some of your personal entitlements for the greater good. It's why you'd also be called entitled for using an elevator for your personal enjoyment, for defecating in a public pool, for playing around in a turnstile or for refusing to get vaccinated during a worldwide pandemic.
      - foldr 4y ago
        If we're talking about people giving up personal entitlements for the greater good, car drivers should be the top of the list.
      - burnished 4y ago
        Yeah, you're the one comparing riding a bicycle on a public road to shitting in a pool. I really cant imagine why you think other people are acting entitled.
        deaddodo 4y ago
        I also compared it to right-wing antivaxxers...come on buddy, that's the easier claim to discredit! Or, you could use the rational side of your brain (the portion that most people develop in their preteens) and apply it to the abstract concept of your singular need/want being less important than another hundred's. Especially if there's a dedicated piece of infrastructure built just for you. Kind of like a bike lane 30ft away, or a restroom six feet away from the pool. In other words, the literal definition of being entitled.
    - ShadowBanThis01 4y ago
      NO. They're leaving the infrastructure we ALL paid to build for them vacant, and blocking that which we paid for to accommodate motorized vehicles.
      - burnished 4y ago
        So, your assumption is that they are all just a bunch of uppity jackasses instead of semi rational human beings? Go give those routes a ride chum, you'll probably figure out whats going on in a hurry.
        ShadowBanThis01 4y ago
        No need for strawmen. This comment was specifically in regard to bikers riding outside of provided bike lanes, which I've seen happen in L.A.
        foldr 4y ago
        I think we’re trying to figure out what conclusion you draw from that. Do you think the cyclists are doing it just to annoy you? If not, then why? Isn’t it likely that the dedicated cycling infrastructure is less adequate than you assume?
        ShadowBanThis01 4y ago
        I don't care why they're doing it. The case I witnessed involved a generously wide bike lane with excellent visibility, and bikers deliberately riding outside it and blocking traffic. Do they all do it? No. But it happens.
        deaddodo 4y ago
        Except that I gave a specific example (Washington Blvd) which has a notoriously well maintained and accessible bike lane 30ft away; to give a specific example of the entitlement I was referring to.
    - robertlagrant 4y ago
      > How outrageous, they want to use the infrastructure like they're people? If you apply this to walking as well, you'll see how silly it is.
      - foldr 4y ago
        There are lots of roads in the US where there’s no sidewalk and you have to walk along the edge of the road if you’re a pedestrian. What’s silly about this? In general, it is perfectly legal to use roads for cycling and walking (though I'm sure there is some variation between jurisdictions).
        robertlagrant 4y ago
        It's silly that you think that this is anything to do with being a person. Why can't I walk in the middle of the road, you know, like a person? It's just such a bad faith argument.
        burnished 4y ago
        Yeah, like in a suburban neighborhood? Or a variety of urban spaces, based on context? In your rush to accuse others of making bad faith arguments you're making just plain thoughtless ones.
        robertlagrant 4y ago
        The context was rush hour Washington Boulevard. I'm not rushing to accuse anyone, and I'm not the one thoughtlessly ignoring the context.
        foldr 4y ago
        The context was cycling on rush hour Washington Boulevard, which isn't absurd if it's the easiest route to your destination, any more than walking down a road is absurd if you don't have an alternative.
- mise_en_place 4y ago
  I think that may be from people who are in a rush. As a novice driver it may be difficult to deal with cyclists, but anyone with sufficient driving experience should be able to easily handle that. The only time I've ever been annoyed at cyclists is when there was some kind of a parade procession in front of me, with cyclists fanning out across the entire road. It happened suddenly as well, which startled me moreso than making me angry.
iamthepieman 4y ago
I get annoyed at cyclist and I am one! I just won't ride a bike on a road without a bike lane because it terrifies me and morning commuter traffic on a road with a half-meter shoulder with barely awake hurried drivers going 50+ miles an hour is the worst place to bike. Eventually I just moved within walking distance of work but would have loved to be able to get exercise biking 5-10 miles each way.
colinsane 4y ago
cycling is my dominant way around the city during the warm months here. i used to take complicated, meandering routes to stay on the residential roads during my trips so i could avoid that type of passing. but at a certain point, i step back and realize that it doesn’t make sense to radically inconvenience myself in order to make auto drivers’ lives more convenient. we both pay for public roads: i have as much right to the good routes as any other resident; if it’s not working for you then vote for better infrastructure (in this case, perhaps a bike lane). also FWIW this same problem exists in dense residential streets, just with the roles reversed. all those narrow intersections with no clear right of way and so many cars parked by them that you can’t see far: cars have to slow down way more for that whereas cyclists have maneuverability that lets them go a bit faster — until they catch up to a slow car on the same street. so anyway, don’t think that slowing down other classes of vehicles is a problem exclusive to bikes: on a mixed-use road every class of vehicle, including yours, will at some point require another vehicle to slow down for you.

alpaca128 4y ago

And most of those cyclists would love to be on a bike lane instead, but those often just don't exist. From personal experience it's also annoying when I get hate from car drivers who assume I deliberately use the road instead of the "bike lane" which is in fact only meant for pedestrians, but try to explain that in half a second while passing and when the official road markings are only visible with forensic tools.

deaddodo 4y ago
While LA is hardly a paragon of bicycling accessibility, it does have a ton of dedicated cycling routes (I’m talking 8-12+ ft wide, dedicated pathways) that can get bicyclists to most of the major hubs throughout the city. Even still, you’ll see the occasional bicyclist(s) who wants to drive down Washington Blvd during rush hours Because-They-Can(TM) and the cycling path is a little too inconvenient for them, holding up hundreds of cars. I have nothing against the majority of bicyclists, but those occasional entitled few are the only ones people see; which can easily paint their opinions of all of them.
- burnished 4y ago
  How outrageous, they want to use the infrastructure like they're people?
  - deaddodo 4y ago
    It's almost like, in a society, you sometimes give up some of your personal entitlements for the greater good. It's why you'd also be called entitled for using an elevator for your personal enjoyment, for defecating in a public pool, for playing around in a turnstile or for refusing to get vaccinated during a worldwide pandemic.
    - foldr 4y ago
      If we're talking about people giving up personal entitlements for the greater good, car drivers should be the top of the list.
    - burnished 4y ago
      Yeah, you're the one comparing riding a bicycle on a public road to shitting in a pool. I really cant imagine why you think other people are acting entitled.
      - deaddodo 4y ago
        I also compared it to right-wing antivaxxers...come on buddy, that's the easier claim to discredit! Or, you could use the rational side of your brain (the portion that most people develop in their preteens) and apply it to the abstract concept of your singular need/want being less important than another hundred's. Especially if there's a dedicated piece of infrastructure built just for you. Kind of like a bike lane 30ft away, or a restroom six feet away from the pool. In other words, the literal definition of being entitled.
  - ShadowBanThis01 4y ago
    NO. They're leaving the infrastructure we ALL paid to build for them vacant, and blocking that which we paid for to accommodate motorized vehicles.
    - burnished 4y ago
      So, your assumption is that they are all just a bunch of uppity jackasses instead of semi rational human beings? Go give those routes a ride chum, you'll probably figure out whats going on in a hurry.
      - ShadowBanThis01 4y ago
        No need for strawmen. This comment was specifically in regard to bikers riding outside of provided bike lanes, which I've seen happen in L.A.
        foldr 4y ago
        I think we’re trying to figure out what conclusion you draw from that. Do you think the cyclists are doing it just to annoy you? If not, then why? Isn’t it likely that the dedicated cycling infrastructure is less adequate than you assume?
        ShadowBanThis01 4y ago
        I don't care why they're doing it. The case I witnessed involved a generously wide bike lane with excellent visibility, and bikers deliberately riding outside it and blocking traffic. Do they all do it? No. But it happens.
        deaddodo 4y ago
        Except that I gave a specific example (Washington Blvd) which has a notoriously well maintained and accessible bike lane 30ft away; to give a specific example of the entitlement I was referring to.
  - robertlagrant 4y ago
    > How outrageous, they want to use the infrastructure like they're people? If you apply this to walking as well, you'll see how silly it is.
    - foldr 4y ago
      There are lots of roads in the US where there’s no sidewalk and you have to walk along the edge of the road if you’re a pedestrian. What’s silly about this? In general, it is perfectly legal to use roads for cycling and walking (though I'm sure there is some variation between jurisdictions).
      - robertlagrant 4y ago
        It's silly that you think that this is anything to do with being a person. Why can't I walk in the middle of the road, you know, like a person? It's just such a bad faith argument.
        burnished 4y ago
        Yeah, like in a suburban neighborhood? Or a variety of urban spaces, based on context? In your rush to accuse others of making bad faith arguments you're making just plain thoughtless ones.
        robertlagrant 4y ago
        The context was rush hour Washington Boulevard. I'm not rushing to accuse anyone, and I'm not the one thoughtlessly ignoring the context.
        foldr 4y ago
        The context was cycling on rush hour Washington Boulevard, which isn't absurd if it's the easiest route to your destination, any more than walking down a road is absurd if you don't have an alternative.
mise_en_place 4y ago
I think that may be from people who are in a rush. As a novice driver it may be difficult to deal with cyclists, but anyone with sufficient driving experience should be able to easily handle that. The only time I've ever been annoyed at cyclists is when there was some kind of a parade procession in front of me, with cyclists fanning out across the entire road. It happened suddenly as well, which startled me moreso than making me angry.

iamthepieman 4y ago

I get annoyed at cyclist and I am one! I just won't ride a bike on a road without a bike lane because it terrifies me and morning commuter traffic on a road with a half-meter shoulder with barely awake hurried drivers going 50+ miles an hour is the worst place to bike. Eventually I just moved within walking distance of work but would have loved to be able to get exercise biking 5-10 miles each way.

colinsane 4y ago

cycling is my dominant way around the city during the warm months here. i used to take complicated, meandering routes to stay on the residential roads during my trips so i could avoid that type of passing. but at a certain point, i step back and realize that it doesn’t make sense to radically inconvenience myself in order to make auto drivers’ lives more convenient. we both pay for public roads: i have as much right to the good routes as any other resident; if it’s not working for you then vote for better infrastructure (in this case, perhaps a bike lane). also FWIW this same problem exists in dense residential streets, just with the roles reversed. all those narrow intersections with no clear right of way and so many cars parked by them that you can’t see far: cars have to slow down way more for that whereas cyclists have maneuverability that lets them go a bit faster — until they catch up to a slow car on the same street. so anyway, don’t think that slowing down other classes of vehicles is a problem exclusive to bikes: on a mixed-use road every class of vehicle, including yours, will at some point require another vehicle to slow down for you.