4 ms·

I believe that 100 hours of community service also includes $4000 worth of tuition credit, but we'll see. Remember that this is his idealized plan, now he has t

by rms 18y ago

I believe that 100 hours of community service also includes $4000 worth of tuition credit, but we'll see. Remember that this is his idealized plan, now he has to govern. Obviously compulsory volunteerism won't actually be mandated. This is America.

patrickg-zill 18y ago
I don't share your "obvious" optimism... there are plenty of ways that the Federal Gov't mandates behavior that would not otherwise occur.
yummyfajitas 18y ago
Lets not use euphemisms, especially oxymoronic ones like "compulsory volunteerism." It's forced labor. We should not call it anything but what it is.
- hugh 18y ago
  So, "slavery" then? Who'd have thunk President Obama would be the one to bring back slavery? Seriously though, it's not actually _forced_, it's just encouraged via one of those offers-you-can't-refuse. It really does make me very uneasy though. Why did people wait until after the election to start discussing the more worrying aspects of Obama's policy platform? And how long before people start discussing Obama's triple goals of giving tax cuts to 95% of the population while balancing the budget and starting up many expensive new federal programs?
  - yummyfajitas 18y ago
    Pointing out bad things about Obama's policies is one thing. But if you replace "policies" with "skin color", then you would be a super crazy racist! http://www.qwantz.com/archive/001339.html http://www.qwantz.com/archive/001339.html His "tax cuts" to 95% of tax-filers is even more interesting when only about 60% of tax filers actually pay taxes.
    - RichardWaite 18y ago
      http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2008/10/13/wsj/index.html?source=rss&aim=/politics/war_room http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2008/10/13/wsj/index....
  - rsheridan6 18y ago
    >So, "slavery" then? Who'd have thunk President Obama would be the one to bring back slavery? Well, it took Nixon to go to China. But I'll believe in Obama's labor service when I see kids picking up trash, and no sooner.
matthavener 18y ago
School is already mandatory, why wouldn't community service be? They're both considered "learning"
- LogicHoleFlaw 18y ago
  It's more than 'mandatory.' It's compulsory.
PieSquared 18y ago
"Obviously compulsory volunteerism won't actually be mandated." As I said earlier in the thread somewhere, it already is in some places at least. In my county you need 75 hours of community service (fluffed 'Social Service Learning Hours') to graduate high school. I'm not whining, because you have 7 years to do it, but I'm just saying: "This is America" won't get you that far.
unalone 18y ago
Not compulsory volunteerism, but I think the government has the right to make you do community service in exchange for, say, free education. My college is a public school, and we need to do 8 hours of community service as it stands right now. As much as I don't like volunteer work, I think it's a reasonable trade. If you don't want to do the work, you go to a private school.
- patrickg-zill 18y ago
  What? What "free education" are you talking about? Maybe you should go to your state gov't website and figure out how much taxes everyone is paying for "free education". The gov't doesn't "give" you anything, the money the gov't has, comes form the pockets of the taxpayers.
  - unalone 18y ago
    ...Of course. That's the whole idea of government. However, the way it works is that taxes come from everybody and get funneled into very specific venues, which you don't need to pay for in particular. So as a child, you don't pay to go to school, and your parents pay taxes, but they don't pay for school in general. However, the government organizes those schools, for better or for worse, and so my point is that it's within the government's rights to set up a system like the one Obama's proposing, so long as the system exists only for public schools.
    - cousin_it 18y ago
      No, not within its rights. The government is not a profit-making venture, and schools are not its property.

by rms 18y ago

patrickg-zill 18y ago

I don't share your "obvious" optimism... there are plenty of ways that the Federal Gov't mandates behavior that would not otherwise occur.

yummyfajitas 18y ago

Lets not use euphemisms, especially oxymoronic ones like "compulsory volunteerism." It's forced labor. We should not call it anything but what it is.

hugh 18y ago
So, "slavery" then? Who'd have thunk President Obama would be the one to bring back slavery? Seriously though, it's not actually _forced_, it's just encouraged via one of those offers-you-can't-refuse. It really does make me very uneasy though. Why did people wait until after the election to start discussing the more worrying aspects of Obama's policy platform? And how long before people start discussing Obama's triple goals of giving tax cuts to 95% of the population while balancing the budget and starting up many expensive new federal programs?
- yummyfajitas 18y ago
  Pointing out bad things about Obama's policies is one thing. But if you replace "policies" with "skin color", then you would be a super crazy racist! http://www.qwantz.com/archive/001339.html http://www.qwantz.com/archive/001339.html His "tax cuts" to 95% of tax-filers is even more interesting when only about 60% of tax filers actually pay taxes.
  - RichardWaite 18y ago
    http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2008/10/13/wsj/index.html?source=rss&aim=/politics/war_room http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2008/10/13/wsj/index....
- rsheridan6 18y ago
  >So, "slavery" then? Who'd have thunk President Obama would be the one to bring back slavery? Well, it took Nixon to go to China. But I'll believe in Obama's labor service when I see kids picking up trash, and no sooner.

matthavener 18y ago

School is already mandatory, why wouldn't community service be? They're both considered "learning"

LogicHoleFlaw 18y ago
It's more than 'mandatory.' It's compulsory.

PieSquared 18y ago

"Obviously compulsory volunteerism won't actually be mandated." As I said earlier in the thread somewhere, it already is in some places at least. In my county you need 75 hours of community service (fluffed 'Social Service Learning Hours') to graduate high school. I'm not whining, because you have 7 years to do it, but I'm just saying: "This is America" won't get you that far.

unalone 18y ago

Not compulsory volunteerism, but I think the government has the right to make you do community service in exchange for, say, free education. My college is a public school, and we need to do 8 hours of community service as it stands right now. As much as I don't like volunteer work, I think it's a reasonable trade. If you don't want to do the work, you go to a private school.

patrickg-zill 18y ago
What? What "free education" are you talking about? Maybe you should go to your state gov't website and figure out how much taxes everyone is paying for "free education". The gov't doesn't "give" you anything, the money the gov't has, comes form the pockets of the taxpayers.
- unalone 18y ago
  ...Of course. That's the whole idea of government. However, the way it works is that taxes come from everybody and get funneled into very specific venues, which you don't need to pay for in particular. So as a child, you don't pay to go to school, and your parents pay taxes, but they don't pay for school in general. However, the government organizes those schools, for better or for worse, and so my point is that it's within the government's rights to set up a system like the one Obama's proposing, so long as the system exists only for public schools.
  - cousin_it 18y ago
    No, not within its rights. The government is not a profit-making venture, and schools are not its property.