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Looking this over..enterprise stuff, more enterprise stuff, third party dev tools upgraded as usual, which is great...and oh what's this? > Updates for running

Looking this over..enterprise stuff, more enterprise stuff, third party dev tools upgraded as usual, which is great...and oh what's this? > Updates for running snaps download in the background and are applied automatically when the app is closed. Boom, that's a big one. > Users and administrators can now pause automatic updates of specific snaps as long as desired. What, wow. Something tells me the usual critics still won't be satisfied, but these are both a big deal and tell a story about listening to the improvements that were desired by users. > Ubuntu 23.04 includes GNOME 44, delivering further usability improvements with a focus on new quick settings options for bluetooth device management and dark mode. Not a small change... > The Firefox snap also benefits from significant performance gains on the Raspberry Pi with hardware accelerated rendering. Q: Is this limited to Raspberry Pi, or not so much? The Steam changes also seem like potentially huge conveniences to me. Nice job Ubuntu team! Satisfied user since 2004 here; I do switch between the various buntus (kurrently Kubuntu) & love to discover other distros too. I was thinking back today...Ubuntu was awesome to me when I Photoshopped and Netflixed in Windows in 2009 [1], played with various hardware & learned to stream video to some of those devices on the WLAN, like my n810 [2] (does VLC encode & stream the given RSS feed at this point in time? That was part of the experiment...), and got really into creating my own journaling and notetaking methods for life-improvement purposes and extreme weight loss [3] in recent years. It's supported everything I wanted to do and has effectively run my local business admin & creative this whole time as well. Being a Linux enthusiast since the late '90s, this is way more than I would have dared hope for! Very happy to reflect on all those experiences. 1. https://www.friendlyskies.net/images/435t.jpg https://www.friendlyskies.net/images/435t.jpg 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7PYUZ5z1wM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7PYUZ5z1wM 3. https://www.friendlyskies.net/images/396t.png https://www.friendlyskies.net/images/396t.png

voytec 3y ago
> Something tells me the usual critics still won't be satisfied, but these are both a big deal and tell a story about listening to the improvements that were desired by users. Critic here. apt is still handicapped and snap is still being pushed down users' throats for profit. Improvement of undesired change resulting in less user control than the state before undesired change is an act of pulling the wool over people's eyes. snap is an unfriendly garbage with which you never know if you should use `--classic` without trial and error. Doing small fixes to this garbage doesn't fix the fiasco that handicapping apt to push snap was.
- wmf 3y ago
  Install Debian.
  - dcow 3y ago
    Ubuntu feels like the macOS of Linux distros. Debian still feels like... a Linux distro. I haven't used Ubuntu in awhile though maybe I should try again just to compare to my Debian machine.
    - pmontra 3y ago
      I switched from Ubuntu 20.04 to Debian 11 at the end of 2022. If you gave me the updated laptop without telling me anything I'm not sure that I'd notice any difference.
      - ithrow 3y ago
        How do you handle chromium in Debian stable? It always lags behind significantly behind chromium/chrome releases.
        capableweb 3y ago
        The trick: Don't use Debian Stable, use Testing. Despite it's name compared to "stable", Testing is pretty stable in my experience. - Chrome Stable - 112.0.5615.137 - Debian Bullseye (stable) - 108.0.5359.94 - Debian Bookworm (testing) - 112.0.5615.49 Most people I know who run Debian for personal desktops uses Testing, not Stable. Vice-versa for servers.
        doubled112 3y ago
        The security repo that is added by default has newer Chromium packages https://wiki.debian.org/Chromium https://wiki.debian.org/Chromium https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/source-package/chromium https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/source-package/c... - buster 90.0.4430.212-1~deb10u1 - bullseye 108.0.5359.94-1~deb11u1 - bullseye (security) 112.0.5615.121-1~deb11u1 - bookworm 112.0.5615.49-2 - sid 112.0.5615.138-1
Y_Y 3y ago
I don't know any users who both know what snaps are and like them. Why did Ubuntu hit 18.04 and then decide to only make things worse in future?
- icelancer 3y ago
  I run selenium for a ton of tests and snap + chromedriver is easily one of the worst parts of the experience.
  - jupiter_flyby 3y ago
    Same. I had sucess with https://github.com/SeleniumHQ/docker-selenium https://github.com/SeleniumHQ/docker-selenium
    - icelancer 3y ago
      Docker + Selenium? Now I have two problems.
- NathanOsullivan 3y ago
  Snaps is just the latest in a long line of failed attempts to differentiate their desktop. Give it a few years and they will switch to Flatpack.
- chrsig 3y ago
  > Why did Ubuntu hit 18.04 and then decide to only make things worse in future? Oh, ubuntu beem making decisions that many users think make things worse since it was first released and yet it's still quite popular
- selivanovp 3y ago
  Well, hello! Nice to meet you! I do know what snaps are and I do prefer them in some situations. And yes, I do like my snaps like Nextcloud and ffmpeg for example.
mrtweetyhack 3y ago
[dead]
rhaway84773 3y ago
> Something tells me the usual critics still won't be satisfied, but these are both a big deal and tell a story about listening to the improvements that were desired by users. As a current user of Ubuntu (and someone who has only defaulted to Ubuntu from the day Shuttleworth shipped a set of like 10 CDs for me to install Ubuntu), I hope this isn’t Canonical’s take in this situation. Automatic updates and replacements while using the app was egregious behavior by default, and the fact that users couldn’t turn it off for years is not something that is resolved by them fixing it after users suffered with it for years. The fact that they introduced it without an off switch, something that even Apple, which is the ultimate control freak still provides on iOS, the ultimate corporate control freak platform, is not something to be proud of. The question it raises is what insane settingless default Ubuntu might push onto its users next. And fixing it years later does not answer that question at all. The only thing it does is Ubuntu admitting that they were wrong after spending years pretending otherwise. Something they’ve also done with other insane decisions, such as Mir, for example.
tpoacher 3y ago
That's a bit like arguing "they polished the turd but some people will still complain". Yes. It's still a turd under the polish.

voytec 3y ago

> Something tells me the usual critics still won't be satisfied, but these are both a big deal and tell a story about listening to the improvements that were desired by users. Critic here. apt is still handicapped and snap is still being pushed down users' throats for profit. Improvement of undesired change resulting in less user control than the state before undesired change is an act of pulling the wool over people's eyes. snap is an unfriendly garbage with which you never know if you should use `--classic` without trial and error. Doing small fixes to this garbage doesn't fix the fiasco that handicapping apt to push snap was.

wmf 3y ago
Install Debian.
- dcow 3y ago
  Ubuntu feels like the macOS of Linux distros. Debian still feels like... a Linux distro. I haven't used Ubuntu in awhile though maybe I should try again just to compare to my Debian machine.
  - pmontra 3y ago
    I switched from Ubuntu 20.04 to Debian 11 at the end of 2022. If you gave me the updated laptop without telling me anything I'm not sure that I'd notice any difference.
    - ithrow 3y ago
      How do you handle chromium in Debian stable? It always lags behind significantly behind chromium/chrome releases.
      - capableweb 3y ago
        The trick: Don't use Debian Stable, use Testing. Despite it's name compared to "stable", Testing is pretty stable in my experience. - Chrome Stable - 112.0.5615.137 - Debian Bullseye (stable) - 108.0.5359.94 - Debian Bookworm (testing) - 112.0.5615.49 Most people I know who run Debian for personal desktops uses Testing, not Stable. Vice-versa for servers.
        doubled112 3y ago
        The security repo that is added by default has newer Chromium packages https://wiki.debian.org/Chromium https://wiki.debian.org/Chromium https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/source-package/chromium https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/source-package/c... - buster 90.0.4430.212-1~deb10u1 - bullseye 108.0.5359.94-1~deb11u1 - bullseye (security) 112.0.5615.121-1~deb11u1 - bookworm 112.0.5615.49-2 - sid 112.0.5615.138-1

Y_Y 3y ago

I don't know any users who both know what snaps are and like them. Why did Ubuntu hit 18.04 and then decide to only make things worse in future?

icelancer 3y ago
I run selenium for a ton of tests and snap + chromedriver is easily one of the worst parts of the experience.
- jupiter_flyby 3y ago
  Same. I had sucess with https://github.com/SeleniumHQ/docker-selenium https://github.com/SeleniumHQ/docker-selenium
  - icelancer 3y ago
    Docker + Selenium? Now I have two problems.
NathanOsullivan 3y ago
Snaps is just the latest in a long line of failed attempts to differentiate their desktop. Give it a few years and they will switch to Flatpack.
chrsig 3y ago
> Why did Ubuntu hit 18.04 and then decide to only make things worse in future? Oh, ubuntu beem making decisions that many users think make things worse since it was first released and yet it's still quite popular
selivanovp 3y ago
Well, hello! Nice to meet you! I do know what snaps are and I do prefer them in some situations. And yes, I do like my snaps like Nextcloud and ffmpeg for example.

mrtweetyhack 3y ago

[dead]

rhaway84773 3y ago

> Something tells me the usual critics still won't be satisfied, but these are both a big deal and tell a story about listening to the improvements that were desired by users. As a current user of Ubuntu (and someone who has only defaulted to Ubuntu from the day Shuttleworth shipped a set of like 10 CDs for me to install Ubuntu), I hope this isn’t Canonical’s take in this situation. Automatic updates and replacements while using the app was egregious behavior by default, and the fact that users couldn’t turn it off for years is not something that is resolved by them fixing it after users suffered with it for years. The fact that they introduced it without an off switch, something that even Apple, which is the ultimate control freak still provides on iOS, the ultimate corporate control freak platform, is not something to be proud of. The question it raises is what insane settingless default Ubuntu might push onto its users next. And fixing it years later does not answer that question at all. The only thing it does is Ubuntu admitting that they were wrong after spending years pretending otherwise. Something they’ve also done with other insane decisions, such as Mir, for example.

tpoacher 3y ago

That's a bit like arguing "they polished the turd but some people will still complain". Yes. It's still a turd under the polish.