4 ms·

Some people, when confronted with a problem, think "I know, I'll use the federal government." Now they have two problems.

majormajor 4y ago
Of course, this attitude is one of the biggest reasons inefficiency goes unchecked. If the opposition option is simply to bang a drum of "do nothing at all and wash your hands of problems" then all the inefficient agency has to do to maintain the status quo is "look like a less bad option than doing nothing at all."
- onos 4y ago
  The drug companies that produced the vaccines were real hero’s of the pandemic. I’m sure they benefitted from various forms of government support … perhaps we should focus government resources where it’s been impactful, such as to research grants like those that led to these results.
  - malfist 4y ago
    What do you think this was supposed to be?
  - bugglebeetle 4y ago
    > I’m sure they benefitted from various forms of government support …like paying for all the vaccines ahead of time, without any guarantee they worked, and the decades of government-sponsored research that made them possible in the first place? The drug companies were not in anyway “heroes,” but net beneficiaries of the enclosure of public research, which, combined with decades of bribing politicians to prevent state manufacturing capacity and enforce bogus IP restrictions, has resulted in wildly inequitable global vaccine access and countless, unnecessary deaths across the world.
    - megaman821 4y ago
      This is like saying LeBron James' mom is the real basketball star. She carried him in her womb and fed an clothed him throughout his childhood.
      - bugglebeetle 4y ago
        This is a hilarious analogy because #1, I’m sure LeBron would say this publicly while drug companies pay millions of dollars to PR firms to lie about how much they profit from public research, #2 LeBron’s mom didn’t invent the techniques that made him a star player, while the publicly-funded research did this for MRNA vaccines: https://www.cbc.ca/radio/quirks/jun-12-missions-to-venus-learning-instant-replay-wrens-spectacular-duet-and-more-1.6061094/meet-the-canadian-scientist-who-paved-the-way-for-groundbreaking-mrna-covid-vaccines-1.6061099 https://www.cbc.ca/radio/quirks/jun-12-missions-to-venus-lea...
  - 908B64B197 4y ago
    > I’m sure they benefitted from various forms of government support The whole world can thank the Trump administration and Operation Warp Speed [0]. It provided billions of dollars and firm orders for any manufacturer who could get it's vaccine candidate on the market. All paid for by the American tax payer, of course. To fight a disease that most likely originated in a Chinese lab. Without it it would have been months of additional delay for R&D and production (see the vaccines not selected for Warp Speed or the CanSino program in Canada[1]) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Warp_Speed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Warp_Speed [1] https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/cansino-deal-canada-nrc-fifth-estate-1.6208241 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/cansino-deal-canada-nrc-fifth...
- NotYourLawyer 4y ago
  Obviously I’m not advocating for doing nothing. I’m saying the feds are gonna fuck up anything they possibly can, so maybe somebody else should be handling this.
  - soco 4y ago
    Maybe my comment is pointless because I'm not US american, but have you thought of, uh, fixing your feds? I mean, instead of either creating from scratch some ideal system or passing the hot potato to some privates which possibly have opposite interests?
    - bee_rider 4y ago
      If we start making incremental changes, there’s a chance our magic imaginary solutions might actually be implemented and get dirtied by the real world.
  - Bud 4y ago
    [dead]
  - majormajor 4y ago
    If you aren't advocating for doing nothing, but many parts of the federal government exist because nobody actually "handled things" in the "maybe someone else should be doing something" days prior to that part of the government getting created... then how do you actually propose making sure that "maybe someone should do something" gets turned into action?
Alupis 4y ago
I think you all know that I've always felt the nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the Government, and I'm here to help. A great many of the current problems on the [thing] were caused by government-imposed embargoes and inflation, not to mention government's long history of conflicting and haphazard policies. Our ultimate goal, of course, is economic independence for [thing], and through steps like the tax reform bill, we seek to return [thing]ing to real [thing]ers. But until we make that transition, the Government must act compassionately and responsibly. In order to see [thing]ers through these tough times, our administration has committed record amounts of assistance, spending more in this year alone than any previous administration spent during its entire tenure. No area of the budget, including defense, has grown as fast as our support for [thing]. - President Ronald Reagan[1], 1986 Sometimes it is appropriate to invest vast sums of public funds into unproven technologies and ideas. The pandemic seems to be a textbook example of where we can reasonably expect our federal government to act swiftly and decisively, for the greater good. That does not mean we should simply shrug our shoulders when, in hindsight, it becomes obvious a lot of misfeasance occurred during this unprecedented time. Billions of dollars were thrown around everywhere with very little oversight. It may be decades before we fully understand where all the money went, and most would likely be shocked to discover pandemic-fighting funds were used to prop up pet projects and ideological programs instead. Funds pitched to the public as destined to fight the pandemic were instead used for anything but - and collectively, red or blue, we are all suffering the consequences of those poor, often obfuscated decisions. We should scrutinize the relationships these farma companies had with the federal government before, during and after the pandemic. They mostly received a blank check for the government to "solve" the pandemic, and it's debatable if that is what really unfolded. [1] https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/archives/speech/presidents-news-conference-23 https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/archives/speech/presidents-new...
- black_13 4y ago
  [dead]
- __MatrixMan__ 4y ago
  > It may be decades before we fully understand where all the money went, and most would likely be shocked to discover pandemic-fighting funds were used to prop up pet projects and ideological programs instead. I, for one would, not be shocked. On the other hand, I would be shocked if we grew a collective spine and did something about it.
dang 4y ago
"Eschew flamebait. Avoid generic tangents." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- NotYourLawyer 4y ago
  Was that flame bait? I thought it was common knowledge.
  - dang 4y ago
    Yes, it's generic ideological flamewar stuff. You can't have a substantive discussion where the only information is boo-vs.-yay about some politically divisive topic. It'll just lead to generic ideological battle, where people just repeat talking points at each other.

majormajor 4y ago

Of course, this attitude is one of the biggest reasons inefficiency goes unchecked. If the opposition option is simply to bang a drum of "do nothing at all and wash your hands of problems" then all the inefficient agency has to do to maintain the status quo is "look like a less bad option than doing nothing at all."

onos 4y ago
The drug companies that produced the vaccines were real hero’s of the pandemic. I’m sure they benefitted from various forms of government support … perhaps we should focus government resources where it’s been impactful, such as to research grants like those that led to these results.
- malfist 4y ago
  What do you think this was supposed to be?
- bugglebeetle 4y ago
  > I’m sure they benefitted from various forms of government support …like paying for all the vaccines ahead of time, without any guarantee they worked, and the decades of government-sponsored research that made them possible in the first place? The drug companies were not in anyway “heroes,” but net beneficiaries of the enclosure of public research, which, combined with decades of bribing politicians to prevent state manufacturing capacity and enforce bogus IP restrictions, has resulted in wildly inequitable global vaccine access and countless, unnecessary deaths across the world.
  - megaman821 4y ago
    This is like saying LeBron James' mom is the real basketball star. She carried him in her womb and fed an clothed him throughout his childhood.
    - bugglebeetle 4y ago
      This is a hilarious analogy because #1, I’m sure LeBron would say this publicly while drug companies pay millions of dollars to PR firms to lie about how much they profit from public research, #2 LeBron’s mom didn’t invent the techniques that made him a star player, while the publicly-funded research did this for MRNA vaccines: https://www.cbc.ca/radio/quirks/jun-12-missions-to-venus-learning-instant-replay-wrens-spectacular-duet-and-more-1.6061094/meet-the-canadian-scientist-who-paved-the-way-for-groundbreaking-mrna-covid-vaccines-1.6061099 https://www.cbc.ca/radio/quirks/jun-12-missions-to-venus-lea...
- 908B64B197 4y ago
  > I’m sure they benefitted from various forms of government support The whole world can thank the Trump administration and Operation Warp Speed [0]. It provided billions of dollars and firm orders for any manufacturer who could get it's vaccine candidate on the market. All paid for by the American tax payer, of course. To fight a disease that most likely originated in a Chinese lab. Without it it would have been months of additional delay for R&D and production (see the vaccines not selected for Warp Speed or the CanSino program in Canada[1]) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Warp_Speed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Warp_Speed [1] https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/cansino-deal-canada-nrc-fifth-estate-1.6208241 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/cansino-deal-canada-nrc-fifth...
NotYourLawyer 4y ago
Obviously I’m not advocating for doing nothing. I’m saying the feds are gonna fuck up anything they possibly can, so maybe somebody else should be handling this.
- soco 4y ago
  Maybe my comment is pointless because I'm not US american, but have you thought of, uh, fixing your feds? I mean, instead of either creating from scratch some ideal system or passing the hot potato to some privates which possibly have opposite interests?
  - bee_rider 4y ago
    If we start making incremental changes, there’s a chance our magic imaginary solutions might actually be implemented and get dirtied by the real world.
- Bud 4y ago
  [dead]
- majormajor 4y ago
  If you aren't advocating for doing nothing, but many parts of the federal government exist because nobody actually "handled things" in the "maybe someone else should be doing something" days prior to that part of the government getting created... then how do you actually propose making sure that "maybe someone should do something" gets turned into action?

Alupis 4y ago

I think you all know that I've always felt the nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the Government, and I'm here to help. A great many of the current problems on the [thing] were caused by government-imposed embargoes and inflation, not to mention government's long history of conflicting and haphazard policies. Our ultimate goal, of course, is economic independence for [thing], and through steps like the tax reform bill, we seek to return [thing]ing to real [thing]ers. But until we make that transition, the Government must act compassionately and responsibly. In order to see [thing]ers through these tough times, our administration has committed record amounts of assistance, spending more in this year alone than any previous administration spent during its entire tenure. No area of the budget, including defense, has grown as fast as our support for [thing]. - President Ronald Reagan[1], 1986 Sometimes it is appropriate to invest vast sums of public funds into unproven technologies and ideas. The pandemic seems to be a textbook example of where we can reasonably expect our federal government to act swiftly and decisively, for the greater good. That does not mean we should simply shrug our shoulders when, in hindsight, it becomes obvious a lot of misfeasance occurred during this unprecedented time. Billions of dollars were thrown around everywhere with very little oversight. It may be decades before we fully understand where all the money went, and most would likely be shocked to discover pandemic-fighting funds were used to prop up pet projects and ideological programs instead. Funds pitched to the public as destined to fight the pandemic were instead used for anything but - and collectively, red or blue, we are all suffering the consequences of those poor, often obfuscated decisions. We should scrutinize the relationships these farma companies had with the federal government before, during and after the pandemic. They mostly received a blank check for the government to "solve" the pandemic, and it's debatable if that is what really unfolded. [1] https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/archives/speech/presidents-news-conference-23 https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/archives/speech/presidents-new...

black_13 4y ago
[dead]
__MatrixMan__ 4y ago
> It may be decades before we fully understand where all the money went, and most would likely be shocked to discover pandemic-fighting funds were used to prop up pet projects and ideological programs instead. I, for one would, not be shocked. On the other hand, I would be shocked if we grew a collective spine and did something about it.

dang 4y ago

"Eschew flamebait. Avoid generic tangents." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

NotYourLawyer 4y ago
Was that flame bait? I thought it was common knowledge.
- dang 4y ago
  Yes, it's generic ideological flamewar stuff. You can't have a substantive discussion where the only information is boo-vs.-yay about some politically divisive topic. It'll just lead to generic ideological battle, where people just repeat talking points at each other.