4 ms·
one random tidbit that struck me was that the term "Byzantine Empire" was actually an invention from the 1500's. the "byzantine" people actually called themsel
by kmlx 4y ago
one random tidbit that struck me was that the term "Byzantine Empire" was actually an invention from the 1500's.
the "byzantine" people actually called themselves Romans, and the empire was called "Roman Empire".
- aorth 4y agoAh yes! This is an interesting tidbit I learned while listening to the excellent Fall of Civilizations podcast. The episode about Byzantium was so good. Paul and his team do such a good job on the audio and visuals. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvzoAfpCvbw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvzoAfpCvbw
- YeGoblynQueenne 4y agoThat's because Byzantium was the eastern wing of the Roman Empire. Justinian I (the emperor in the wikipedia article) is remembered for being behind the last almost successful attempt to take Rome back from the hands of the barbarians and reunite the Empire's two heads. The two heads in the Byzantine flags, that is. Byzantines called themselves "Roman", and everyone else in the area called them "Rum" (i.e. "Roman") because they were Romans. And this guy was the Last of the Romans: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belisarius https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belisarius
- MichaelZuo 4y agoA good compromise is to call it the Eastern Roman empire, though some folks in the Vatican would undoubtedly be annoyed.
- selcuka 4y agoTurkish people (as the successors of the Ottoman Empire) always call it the Eastern Roman Empire. Byzantine is almost exclusively used when talking about "Byzantine system" (i.e. intrigue, and plots).
- m00dy 4y agoand then the Ottomans came...
- triceratops 4y agoBut also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_claim_to_Roman_succession https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_claim_to_Roman_success...
- epilys 4y agoThey were the Roman Empire. The distinction we make today is mainly of two reasons: - In the East side of the empire, Constantine, the Roman emperor who moved the capital to Byzantium ("New Rome") was half-Greek, and the Greek element in the East meant this half of the Roman Empire had a stronger Greek ethnic presence. - In the West side, the local Roman elite along with newly arrived Germanic peoples (the Franks) were Christianized and established the Papal states, of whose the Pope was king, the Catholic church, and realms that continued from the Roman Empire that was split into West and East. To make their claim over the Roman Empire stronger, there were fabrications of legitimacy (See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donation_of_Constantine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donation_of_Constantine ) and a lot of religious infighting with the East. In short, in terms of a continuum of emperors the Eastern empire was essentially uninterrupted. Even before the breakup of the empire, Romans were a bit obsessed with lineage and being descendants of powerful Romans. This cultural element carried over in the next two millennia by many people claiming the role of the Emperor of Romans, until the victories of Napoleon forced the rest of Europe to dissolve the Holy Roman Empire in 1806 to prevent Napoleon from claiming the title for himself. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissolution_of_the_Holy_Roman_Empire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissolution_of_the_Holy_Roman_...
- KoftaBob 4y agoIronically, those outside of Byzantium (namely the Western Europeans) called them "the Greeks". The Byzantines in turn, called those Western Europeans "The Latins".