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> The understeer characteristics of a FWD car are very easy and intuitive to recover This might be true when discussing snap over-steer and throttle induced un

> The understeer characteristics of a FWD car are very easy and intuitive to recover This might be true when discussing snap over-steer and throttle induced under-steer on a track but is a complete lie for snow driving where most drivers will just keep steering harder in response to under-steer which is not productive and you don't have enough traction for lifting and braking to induce much extra weight on the front.

kube-system 3y ago
> most drivers will just keep steering harder in response to under-steer That's my point. Make the wrong correction in RWD car and you end up oversteering beyond 90 degrees in an unrecoverable spin. The failure modes of FWD understeer in the snow are all recoverable.
- dsfyu404ed 3y ago
  >That's my point. Make the wrong correction in RWD car and you end up oversteering beyond 90 degrees in an unrecoverable spin. The failure modes of FWD understeer in the snow are all recoverable. You're making one of those textbook correct but reality wrong statements that clipboard warriors love. Sure, you can recover from under-steer but if you're already doing the wrong thing and pointing the wheel where you want the car to go you almost certainly won't. With over-steer if you do the "natural" thing and steer the wheels toward where you want the car to point at least you have a chance. Sure many people might flub it but that's a heck of a lot better than the "no chance" you get if you react the same way to under-steer. Also, if you do over-correct the over-correction may very well not be as severe as the initial over-steer giving you a better chance to get it right the second time. Sure, under-steer is theoretically recoverable and with over-steer you can theoretically spin or slide backwards but in reality in "on the street" situations (i.e. not what you see someone doing on an old taxiway in a training video) 99.9% of the time you'll have hit something long before either happens. Edit: Since I'm apparently so wrong anyone care to explain? Or is it just "sideways bad because smart man with vest and clipboard say so".
- avereveard 3y ago
  Also losing control and hitting a tree with your front crumple zone is much better than hitting the same tree side on with the driver door That is the understated safety factor of understeer, but people prefer to think in terms of never doing mistakes instead that in terms of overall safety

kube-system 3y ago

> most drivers will just keep steering harder in response to under-steer That's my point. Make the wrong correction in RWD car and you end up oversteering beyond 90 degrees in an unrecoverable spin. The failure modes of FWD understeer in the snow are all recoverable.

dsfyu404ed 3y ago
>That's my point. Make the wrong correction in RWD car and you end up oversteering beyond 90 degrees in an unrecoverable spin. The failure modes of FWD understeer in the snow are all recoverable. You're making one of those textbook correct but reality wrong statements that clipboard warriors love. Sure, you can recover from under-steer but if you're already doing the wrong thing and pointing the wheel where you want the car to go you almost certainly won't. With over-steer if you do the "natural" thing and steer the wheels toward where you want the car to point at least you have a chance. Sure many people might flub it but that's a heck of a lot better than the "no chance" you get if you react the same way to under-steer. Also, if you do over-correct the over-correction may very well not be as severe as the initial over-steer giving you a better chance to get it right the second time. Sure, under-steer is theoretically recoverable and with over-steer you can theoretically spin or slide backwards but in reality in "on the street" situations (i.e. not what you see someone doing on an old taxiway in a training video) 99.9% of the time you'll have hit something long before either happens. Edit: Since I'm apparently so wrong anyone care to explain? Or is it just "sideways bad because smart man with vest and clipboard say so".
avereveard 3y ago
Also losing control and hitting a tree with your front crumple zone is much better than hitting the same tree side on with the driver door That is the understated safety factor of understeer, but people prefer to think in terms of never doing mistakes instead that in terms of overall safety