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I'm an American that's fed up with the continued support of sanctions and this useless war in Ukraine. We have flushed billions of dollars into this conflict a

I'm an American that's fed up with the continued support of sanctions and this useless war in Ukraine. We have flushed billions of dollars into this conflict and enacted pain on the world for zero gain. It's time for the west to admit failure on this and push Ukraine to bargain for a cease fire, even if it costs them contested territory like Crimea or Donbas. The history of conflict in those regions is quite complicated and zero concern for the US--we have far bigger problems at home to worry about.

phpnode 3y ago
Your biggest adversary, one that's cast a dark shadow over your country and it's allies, one that's consumed trillions of dollars of defence spending over the last 75 years, is now being ground down and exhausted with approximately zero of your countrymen's lives at risk and all for a mere few billion dollars. You're getting a bargain.
- Retric 3y ago
  The USSR was a major adversary for roughly 45 years, 1946 to 1991. The US provided them major economic aid in WWII which they leveraged into a massive expansion and had minimal interaction before the war. Russia is a politically distinct fragment of that empire, just like Ukraine.
  - selimthegrim 3y ago
    Indeed “glavniy protivnik/glavniy vrag” is what USSR used to call USA!
    - thriftwy 3y ago
      Nope. It wasn't. It was the most likely adversary. Вероятный.
      - selimthegrim 3y ago
        Ok “probable adversary” I stand corrected. I thought that one was a joke.
distances 3y ago
This war is catastrophic to Ukraine, but relatively costs pennies to western countries. They absolutely should continue armaments as long as Ukraine is willing to fight. Not doing so would mean allowing fascism and outright genocide to spread on European soil, and that would have an astronomical cost in the long run. US and EU would be very, very shortsighted with their own interests if they didn't ship everything Ukraine wants.
- Animatronio 3y ago
  Well, Ukr really wants foreign soldiers on the front line. Please tell me you're already there, or else I might suspect you're rooting for Putin!
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jdmichal 3y ago
The best response I've heard to this is: Tell me which part of the US you would willingly give up to Russia if it threatened to attack. If your response would be for them to pound sand, why should we expect or want any different for the Ukraine?
- qbasic_forever 3y ago
  The US doesn't launch artillery into its own states like Texas for example. This is why I say the history of conflict in Crimea, Donbas, etc. is complicated--Ukraine government for years has done much aggression against ostensibly its own people (including firing on them with artillery!). This is not a cut and dry, "Russia bad!! Russia invade!!". Some people in those contested regions welcomed Russia as protectors against Ukraine extremist aggressors. As an American I have no skin in this fight and nor should I, this is a conflict for Ukraine and Russia to sort out hopefully through diplomacy. Russia has been a world power for decades post USSR fall and clearly have not been on a megalomaniacal quest for world domination. I see no reason to assume they want to start another world war.
  - HWR_14 3y ago
    The US most certainly has launched artillery into its own states, including Texas [1]. There's no benefit to doing so now, but if Mexico were to occupy all of Texas tomorrow, I guarantee the US would bomb inside Texas. Similarly, if Mexico just supplied support to get Texas to secede, there would also be violence. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War
    - qbasic_forever 3y ago
      The southern states started the civil war in protest against moves to end slavery which they profited from directly. It was not northern states deciding to be aggressors against the southern states for no good reason. The circumstances were completely different and you know it (it's in the wikipedia article you cite!).

phpnode 3y ago

Your biggest adversary, one that's cast a dark shadow over your country and it's allies, one that's consumed trillions of dollars of defence spending over the last 75 years, is now being ground down and exhausted with approximately zero of your countrymen's lives at risk and all for a mere few billion dollars. You're getting a bargain.

Retric 3y ago
The USSR was a major adversary for roughly 45 years, 1946 to 1991. The US provided them major economic aid in WWII which they leveraged into a massive expansion and had minimal interaction before the war. Russia is a politically distinct fragment of that empire, just like Ukraine.
- selimthegrim 3y ago
  Indeed “glavniy protivnik/glavniy vrag” is what USSR used to call USA!
  - thriftwy 3y ago
    Nope. It wasn't. It was the most likely adversary. Вероятный.
    - selimthegrim 3y ago
      Ok “probable adversary” I stand corrected. I thought that one was a joke.

distances 3y ago

This war is catastrophic to Ukraine, but relatively costs pennies to western countries. They absolutely should continue armaments as long as Ukraine is willing to fight. Not doing so would mean allowing fascism and outright genocide to spread on European soil, and that would have an astronomical cost in the long run. US and EU would be very, very shortsighted with their own interests if they didn't ship everything Ukraine wants.

Animatronio 3y ago
Well, Ukr really wants foreign soldiers on the front line. Please tell me you're already there, or else I might suspect you're rooting for Putin!

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jdmichal 3y ago

The best response I've heard to this is: Tell me which part of the US you would willingly give up to Russia if it threatened to attack. If your response would be for them to pound sand, why should we expect or want any different for the Ukraine?

qbasic_forever 3y ago
The US doesn't launch artillery into its own states like Texas for example. This is why I say the history of conflict in Crimea, Donbas, etc. is complicated--Ukraine government for years has done much aggression against ostensibly its own people (including firing on them with artillery!). This is not a cut and dry, "Russia bad!! Russia invade!!". Some people in those contested regions welcomed Russia as protectors against Ukraine extremist aggressors. As an American I have no skin in this fight and nor should I, this is a conflict for Ukraine and Russia to sort out hopefully through diplomacy. Russia has been a world power for decades post USSR fall and clearly have not been on a megalomaniacal quest for world domination. I see no reason to assume they want to start another world war.
- HWR_14 3y ago
  The US most certainly has launched artillery into its own states, including Texas [1]. There's no benefit to doing so now, but if Mexico were to occupy all of Texas tomorrow, I guarantee the US would bomb inside Texas. Similarly, if Mexico just supplied support to get Texas to secede, there would also be violence. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War
  - qbasic_forever 3y ago
    The southern states started the civil war in protest against moves to end slavery which they profited from directly. It was not northern states deciding to be aggressors against the southern states for no good reason. The circumstances were completely different and you know it (it's in the wikipedia article you cite!).