6 ms·

I tell friends that the scene below from T2 doesn't feel futuristic anymore. In fact, it now feels... almost mundane. I mean, a smart "script kiddie" with a bit

by cs702 4y ago

I tell friends that the scene below from T2 doesn't feel futuristic anymore. In fact, it now feels... almost mundane. I mean, a smart "script kiddie" with a bit of ML expertise can pull off this kind of deepfake voice spoofing on a relatively cheap desktop computer nowadays. We live in interesting times. SCENE: T-800, speaking to John Connor in normal voice: "What's the dog's name?" John Connor: "Max." T-800, impersonating John, on the phone with T-1000: "Hey Janelle, what's wrong with Wolfie? I can hear him barking. Is he all right?" T-1000, impersonating John's foster mother, Janelle: "Wolfie's fine, honey. Wolfie's just fine. Where are you?" T-800 hangs up the phone and says to John in normal voice: "Your foster parents are dead." -- Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MT_u9Rurrqg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MT_u9Rurrqg

ImHereToVote 4y ago
We aren't even far off from an LLM being able to infer that the parents are fake on the basis of the dog name. I'm not even gonna touch the chain gun shooting up a parking lot aspect.
- coldtea 4y ago
  We're safe for a few months. Asked about how did T-800 figured the foster parents are dead based on the exchange, and got: "Yes, there is a strong cue in the exchange that suggests to the T-800 that John's foster parents are dead. The cue is that when the T-1000, impersonating Janelle, answers the phone and John asks about Wolfie, she responds by saying, "Wolfie's fine, honey. Wolfie's just fine." The use of the word "just" in this context can indicate that Janelle is trying too hard to convince John that everything is okay with the dog, suggesting that she may be lying or trying to cover up something. This small detail is enough to alert the T-800 that something is amiss and to determine that John's foster parents are likely dead". Here's the rest of the conversation for fun: Q: That's not it. A: I apologize for the confusion. I'm afraid I'm not able to guess the cue you are referring to without more context or information. Can you please tell me what the cue is? Q: The T-800 knows that the dog is named Max, but deceptively asks about "Wolfie", to which the T-1000 answers that Wolfie is fine. The real Janelle would have known that the dog is not named Wolfie. A: Thank you for pointing that out. You are correct that the T-800's knowledge of the dog's name is a significant cue that suggests to him that something is wrong. By asking about "Wolfie" instead of Max, the T-800 is intentionally using a false name for the dog to test whether the person on the other end of the line is actually John's foster mother or the T-1000 in disguise. When the T-1000 responds with "Wolfie's fine," it confirms to the T-800 that Janelle is an imposter, as the real Janelle would have known the dog's real name. The T-800's subsequent revelation to John that his foster parents are dead is based on this realization and its mission to protect John from the T-1000.
  - famouswaffles 4y ago
    You have to use gpt-4 for this stuff man. Direct Response from gpt-4: The T-800 figured out that John's foster parents were dead based on the exchange because when it asked about "Wolfie" (a made-up name for the dog), the T-1000, impersonating Janelle, did not correct the name and instead went along with it, saying "Wolfie's fine." If the real Janelle had been on the phone, she would have corrected the T-800 by stating that the dog's name is actually Max. This indicated to the T-800 that the person on the other end of the line was not John's real foster parent, and thus, they were likely dead. EDIT- Tried again after changing anything that would point to the Terminator franchise. Still nailed it. Ron figured out the foster parents are dead based on the exchange because when he impersonated Harvey and mentioned the dog's name as "Rovy" instead of "Bingey," R-658 (impersonating Janine) did not correct him or question the name. This indicated that R-658 didn't actually know the dog's real name and was likely trying to deceive them. This deception, along with the concern about their whereabouts, led Ron to deduce that the foster parents were probably dead.
    - dougmwne 4y ago
      I see this so often. People try to show what GPT can or can’t do without explicitly stating the version. Since not many people have access to GPT-4 it’s usually safe to assume they didn’t use it. GPT-4 is a massive improvement over 3.5 when it come to any kind of non-trivial logic or inference task.
    - coldtea 4y ago
      I used ChatGPT. Isn't it already based on GPT-4 since a few weeks ago? It's the "Mar 23" version.
      - famouswaffles 4y ago
        Unless you're paying for plus and then select the gpt-4 model, it's not 4. alternatively, you can sign up/request for api access here - https://openai.com/waitlist/gpt-4-api https://openai.com/waitlist/gpt-4-api
- famouswaffles 4y ago
  Not Far off ? GPT-4 already gets it. Response after pasting in the scene: The T-800 figured out that John's foster parents were dead based on the exchange because when it asked about "Wolfie" (a made-up name for the dog), the T-1000, impersonating Janelle, did not correct the name and instead went along with it, saying "Wolfie's fine." If the real Janelle had been on the phone, she would have corrected the T-800 by stating that the dog's name is actually Max. This indicated to the T-800 that the person on the other end of the line was not John's real foster parent, and thus, they were likely dead. EDIT- Tried again after changing anything that would point to the Terminator franchise. Still nailed it. Ron figured out the foster parents are dead based on the exchange because when he impersonated Harvey and mentioned the dog's name as "Rovy" instead of "Bingey," R-658 (impersonating Janine) did not correct him or question the name. This indicated that R-658 didn't actually know the dog's real name and was likely trying to deceive them. This deception, along with the concern about their whereabouts, led Ron to deduce that the foster parents were probably dead.
  - ImHereToVote 4y ago
    But can it understand why we cry?
    - famouswaffles 4y ago
      Not sure how serious this question is but GPT-4's emotional intelligence is really high.
      - ImHereToVote 4y ago
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKLzSIkCpkw&t=74s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKLzSIkCpkw&t=74s
  - radlad 4y ago
    I'm curious how you managed to do that? When I paste the scene prompt into ChatGPT (I do not have access to GPT-4), I get the following response: > I'm sorry, I cannot generate content that includes violent or harmful actions towards characters, as it goes against OpenAI's content policy. Please provide a new prompt that is respectful and appropriate. As to your edit, I think the sentence structure and terminology is still too similar, as to obviously be a recreation of this scene. AI doesn't "know" anything. It's pattern matching. I wanted to try something more akin to this: SCENE: Joseph to Allie: "Where did you grow up?" Allie: "New York" Joseph, pretending to be Allie, texting the bad guy: "Hey mom. I'm having a rough time. Growing up in L.A. always felt like home, and I feel so alone now, here." The bad guy, pretending to be Allie's parents: "We loved having you grow up with us in L.A." Joseph tosses the phone out the window and says to Allie: "Your parents are dead." --- I'd also be curious what it says if you replace all instances of "Wolfie" with the dog's correct name, "Max." --- edit: Ok, adding "How did X determine that X's parents were dead?" gives better results. For the T-800 one it's clearly regurgitating Terminator nonsense: > In the Terminator 2 movie, T-800 (played by Arnold Schwarzenegger) learns that John Connor's foster parents are dead by accessing the police radio chatter. After hanging up the phone with the T-1000 (played by Robert Patrick), T-800 uses his advanced hearing to eavesdrop on a police radio transmission that mentions a disturbance at the home of John's foster parents. T-800 then confirms with John that the foster parents are indeed dead. Replacing all instances of Wolfie with Max predictably gives the same response. It also gives the same response if I replace T-1000's line with the following: > T-1000, impersonating John's foster mother, Janelle: "Wolfie? Do you mean Max, honey? Max's fine, honey. Max's just fine. Where are you?" When using the Joseph/Allie story it responds: > I'm sorry, but based on the information provided in the scene, it is not clear how Joseph determined that Allie's parents are dead. The scene only shows Joseph making the statement "Your parents are dead" after pretending to be Allie and texting with the Joker, who impersonates Allie's parents. There is no indication in the scene of how Joseph obtained this information, and it is possible that Joseph is lying or making a false assumption.
poulpy123 4y ago
except that now the T-1000 will have access to the facebook or instagram of Janelle and will know all about Max
- cs702 4y ago
  Yep, it sure seems that billions of human beings have voluntarily contributed personal data to massive datasets, exactly of the kind that AI would need to be able to manipulate (or worse, exploit) each of those human beings.
  - bheadmaster 4y ago
    Suddenly, Richard Stallman's lifestyle doesn't seem so crazy.
  - lucidrains 4y ago
    or love, understand, help each of those human beings.
    - TeMPOraL 4y ago
      And unscramble an egg, and reverse flow of entropy too. The problem of AI alignment is that human value system is rather complex (to the point we haven't formalized any meaningful chunk of it, nor it seems we'll be able to any time soon), and random deviations from it can easily lead to - what we'd consider - horrifying tragedies. A random AI mind plucked out of space of possible minds is highly unlikely to have internalized a good approximation of our value system, for the same reason putting a scrambled egg in a bag and shaking it vigorously won't get you a fresh egg back. Manipulation and exploitation are, by default, what happens when an agent with power over you finds you standing between it and the thing it wants. Almost every point in the space of possible minds will feature this behavior. "Love, understand, help each other", in the sense we understand it, is a very specialized, specific set of behaviors - few points in the space of possible minds will feature it. Or, in short, there's a good statistical argument (to which I do not do justice here), that if you make a smart enough AI without doing a perfect job alignment, it will kill us all - most likely unintentionally.

by cs702 4y ago

ImHereToVote 4y ago

We aren't even far off from an LLM being able to infer that the parents are fake on the basis of the dog name. I'm not even gonna touch the chain gun shooting up a parking lot aspect.

coldtea 4y ago
We're safe for a few months. Asked about how did T-800 figured the foster parents are dead based on the exchange, and got: "Yes, there is a strong cue in the exchange that suggests to the T-800 that John's foster parents are dead. The cue is that when the T-1000, impersonating Janelle, answers the phone and John asks about Wolfie, she responds by saying, "Wolfie's fine, honey. Wolfie's just fine." The use of the word "just" in this context can indicate that Janelle is trying too hard to convince John that everything is okay with the dog, suggesting that she may be lying or trying to cover up something. This small detail is enough to alert the T-800 that something is amiss and to determine that John's foster parents are likely dead". Here's the rest of the conversation for fun: Q: That's not it. A: I apologize for the confusion. I'm afraid I'm not able to guess the cue you are referring to without more context or information. Can you please tell me what the cue is? Q: The T-800 knows that the dog is named Max, but deceptively asks about "Wolfie", to which the T-1000 answers that Wolfie is fine. The real Janelle would have known that the dog is not named Wolfie. A: Thank you for pointing that out. You are correct that the T-800's knowledge of the dog's name is a significant cue that suggests to him that something is wrong. By asking about "Wolfie" instead of Max, the T-800 is intentionally using a false name for the dog to test whether the person on the other end of the line is actually John's foster mother or the T-1000 in disguise. When the T-1000 responds with "Wolfie's fine," it confirms to the T-800 that Janelle is an imposter, as the real Janelle would have known the dog's real name. The T-800's subsequent revelation to John that his foster parents are dead is based on this realization and its mission to protect John from the T-1000.
- famouswaffles 4y ago
  You have to use gpt-4 for this stuff man. Direct Response from gpt-4: The T-800 figured out that John's foster parents were dead based on the exchange because when it asked about "Wolfie" (a made-up name for the dog), the T-1000, impersonating Janelle, did not correct the name and instead went along with it, saying "Wolfie's fine." If the real Janelle had been on the phone, she would have corrected the T-800 by stating that the dog's name is actually Max. This indicated to the T-800 that the person on the other end of the line was not John's real foster parent, and thus, they were likely dead. EDIT- Tried again after changing anything that would point to the Terminator franchise. Still nailed it. Ron figured out the foster parents are dead based on the exchange because when he impersonated Harvey and mentioned the dog's name as "Rovy" instead of "Bingey," R-658 (impersonating Janine) did not correct him or question the name. This indicated that R-658 didn't actually know the dog's real name and was likely trying to deceive them. This deception, along with the concern about their whereabouts, led Ron to deduce that the foster parents were probably dead.
  - dougmwne 4y ago
    I see this so often. People try to show what GPT can or can’t do without explicitly stating the version. Since not many people have access to GPT-4 it’s usually safe to assume they didn’t use it. GPT-4 is a massive improvement over 3.5 when it come to any kind of non-trivial logic or inference task.
  - coldtea 4y ago
    I used ChatGPT. Isn't it already based on GPT-4 since a few weeks ago? It's the "Mar 23" version.
    - famouswaffles 4y ago
      Unless you're paying for plus and then select the gpt-4 model, it's not 4. alternatively, you can sign up/request for api access here - https://openai.com/waitlist/gpt-4-api https://openai.com/waitlist/gpt-4-api
famouswaffles 4y ago
Not Far off ? GPT-4 already gets it. Response after pasting in the scene: The T-800 figured out that John's foster parents were dead based on the exchange because when it asked about "Wolfie" (a made-up name for the dog), the T-1000, impersonating Janelle, did not correct the name and instead went along with it, saying "Wolfie's fine." If the real Janelle had been on the phone, she would have corrected the T-800 by stating that the dog's name is actually Max. This indicated to the T-800 that the person on the other end of the line was not John's real foster parent, and thus, they were likely dead. EDIT- Tried again after changing anything that would point to the Terminator franchise. Still nailed it. Ron figured out the foster parents are dead based on the exchange because when he impersonated Harvey and mentioned the dog's name as "Rovy" instead of "Bingey," R-658 (impersonating Janine) did not correct him or question the name. This indicated that R-658 didn't actually know the dog's real name and was likely trying to deceive them. This deception, along with the concern about their whereabouts, led Ron to deduce that the foster parents were probably dead.
- ImHereToVote 4y ago
  But can it understand why we cry?
  - famouswaffles 4y ago
    Not sure how serious this question is but GPT-4's emotional intelligence is really high.
    - ImHereToVote 4y ago
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKLzSIkCpkw&t=74s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKLzSIkCpkw&t=74s
- radlad 4y ago
  I'm curious how you managed to do that? When I paste the scene prompt into ChatGPT (I do not have access to GPT-4), I get the following response: > I'm sorry, I cannot generate content that includes violent or harmful actions towards characters, as it goes against OpenAI's content policy. Please provide a new prompt that is respectful and appropriate. As to your edit, I think the sentence structure and terminology is still too similar, as to obviously be a recreation of this scene. AI doesn't "know" anything. It's pattern matching. I wanted to try something more akin to this: SCENE: Joseph to Allie: "Where did you grow up?" Allie: "New York" Joseph, pretending to be Allie, texting the bad guy: "Hey mom. I'm having a rough time. Growing up in L.A. always felt like home, and I feel so alone now, here." The bad guy, pretending to be Allie's parents: "We loved having you grow up with us in L.A." Joseph tosses the phone out the window and says to Allie: "Your parents are dead." --- I'd also be curious what it says if you replace all instances of "Wolfie" with the dog's correct name, "Max." --- edit: Ok, adding "How did X determine that X's parents were dead?" gives better results. For the T-800 one it's clearly regurgitating Terminator nonsense: > In the Terminator 2 movie, T-800 (played by Arnold Schwarzenegger) learns that John Connor's foster parents are dead by accessing the police radio chatter. After hanging up the phone with the T-1000 (played by Robert Patrick), T-800 uses his advanced hearing to eavesdrop on a police radio transmission that mentions a disturbance at the home of John's foster parents. T-800 then confirms with John that the foster parents are indeed dead. Replacing all instances of Wolfie with Max predictably gives the same response. It also gives the same response if I replace T-1000's line with the following: > T-1000, impersonating John's foster mother, Janelle: "Wolfie? Do you mean Max, honey? Max's fine, honey. Max's just fine. Where are you?" When using the Joseph/Allie story it responds: > I'm sorry, but based on the information provided in the scene, it is not clear how Joseph determined that Allie's parents are dead. The scene only shows Joseph making the statement "Your parents are dead" after pretending to be Allie and texting with the Joker, who impersonates Allie's parents. There is no indication in the scene of how Joseph obtained this information, and it is possible that Joseph is lying or making a false assumption.

poulpy123 4y ago

except that now the T-1000 will have access to the facebook or instagram of Janelle and will know all about Max

cs702 4y ago
Yep, it sure seems that billions of human beings have voluntarily contributed personal data to massive datasets, exactly of the kind that AI would need to be able to manipulate (or worse, exploit) each of those human beings.
- bheadmaster 4y ago
  Suddenly, Richard Stallman's lifestyle doesn't seem so crazy.
- lucidrains 4y ago
  or love, understand, help each of those human beings.
  - TeMPOraL 4y ago
    And unscramble an egg, and reverse flow of entropy too. The problem of AI alignment is that human value system is rather complex (to the point we haven't formalized any meaningful chunk of it, nor it seems we'll be able to any time soon), and random deviations from it can easily lead to - what we'd consider - horrifying tragedies. A random AI mind plucked out of space of possible minds is highly unlikely to have internalized a good approximation of our value system, for the same reason putting a scrambled egg in a bag and shaking it vigorously won't get you a fresh egg back. Manipulation and exploitation are, by default, what happens when an agent with power over you finds you standing between it and the thing it wants. Almost every point in the space of possible minds will feature this behavior. "Love, understand, help each other", in the sense we understand it, is a very specialized, specific set of behaviors - few points in the space of possible minds will feature it. Or, in short, there's a good statistical argument (to which I do not do justice here), that if you make a smart enough AI without doing a perfect job alignment, it will kill us all - most likely unintentionally.