4 ms·

Saying Windows has had it since Windows 98 and then, acknowledging that the issue is wake-on-demand is a bit confusing to say the least. Obviously Linux can sle

Saying Windows has had it since Windows 98 and then, acknowledging that the issue is wake-on-demand is a bit confusing to say the least. Obviously Linux can sleep easily since decades ago. The issue is wake on demand (and I don't know if Windows has that even) Edit: I don't why everyone's having issues. I run Fedora on a cheap Gigabyte G5KD and never had any problems. Never did with either of my thinkpads or my Xiaomi Mi Notebook...

VWWHFSfQ 4y ago
> Obviously Linux can sleep easily since decades ago. Yeah right. Suspend and resume is still buggy as hell. Power management in general in Linux is still awful after all these years.
- mtizim 4y ago
  I have no idea how it looks on the dev/setup side, but suspend and resume is definitely a solved problem, seeing that I've never had any problems with it on my Steam Deck
  - xeyownt 4y ago
    It's very likely designed for that use case so not very relevant. Most PC are delivered with Windows, and even though Linux works on them, it's unlikely the PC were designed with suspend stability as criteria.
    - ladyanita22 4y ago
      If that's the case, who's to fault here? Linux or buggy ACPI states implemented in the motherboards?
- xeyownt 4y ago
  I Confirm this. For years I use suspend on my laptop with latest Debian, and it's very difficult to have an uptime higher than 15 days. Every now and then, the logging in freezes to death on wake-up and requires hard power off.
- 1970-01-01 4y ago
  Low-level power savings (s3 sleep) and magic packet (Wake-on-LAN) have been a standard since the late 90s. Getting a Linux OS that actually delivers these standardized power features is now a 20+ year old bug. I can only imagine the amount of energy that would have been saved if this bug was properly fixed 25 years ago. With solid-state tech becoming cheaper every day, I now expect nobody will make an "it just works" OS that has both sleep and wake working on-demand. Globally, the HDDs will simply continue to spin until there are none.
  - usr1106 4y ago
    Who pays for Linux development? Either companies for servers or embedded Linux. Servers don't sleep. Embedded might sleep, but it's not PC hardware, so it needs completely different power management features. Nobody is paying for Linux on average PC hardware, that's why 20 year old bugs are not fixed.
- lopkeny12ko 4y ago
  This sounds like an isolated and highly specific experience being generalized to an entire operating system.
dolmen 4y ago
> Obviously Linux can sleep easily since decades ago. No. I have an old Dell laptop that still doesn't power off when asked from Ubuntu Desktop. Always reboots instead.
kortex 4y ago
Classic "works on my machine". Operating systems are complex beasties. Bugs happen. I have an Asus laptop with Ubuntu 22.04 and it worked fine. Then one day, any time it comes back from sleep, the screen stays black. Can't find and workarounds and probably need to reimage. I have to do this about once a year cause something inevitably borks.
0x457 4y ago
> Obviously Linux can sleep easily since decades ago. Over the last 5 years, I had about 4 laptops that I ran Linux on. Not a single one was able to survive this: - Do some work on it - Close the lid - Drive somewhere else - Resume work At best, the laptop would freeze and require a hard reset (extra annoying on Dell XPS for some reason). At worst, it will be completely draining of power. All of my linux-loving colleges had the same issues. Windows worked just fine on those laptops, btw. If you're curious, we've advanced beyond simple Suspend-to-RAM in 2012 when haswell was released. Out of the 3 major OS that used on desktop, only linux doesn't support those features: https://www.anandtech.com/show/6355/intels-haswell-architecture/3 https://www.anandtech.com/show/6355/intels-haswell-architect... I rarely have issues with S3 on my linux/windows desktop, though.

VWWHFSfQ 4y ago

> Obviously Linux can sleep easily since decades ago. Yeah right. Suspend and resume is still buggy as hell. Power management in general in Linux is still awful after all these years.

mtizim 4y ago
I have no idea how it looks on the dev/setup side, but suspend and resume is definitely a solved problem, seeing that I've never had any problems with it on my Steam Deck
- xeyownt 4y ago
  It's very likely designed for that use case so not very relevant. Most PC are delivered with Windows, and even though Linux works on them, it's unlikely the PC were designed with suspend stability as criteria.
  - ladyanita22 4y ago
    If that's the case, who's to fault here? Linux or buggy ACPI states implemented in the motherboards?
xeyownt 4y ago
I Confirm this. For years I use suspend on my laptop with latest Debian, and it's very difficult to have an uptime higher than 15 days. Every now and then, the logging in freezes to death on wake-up and requires hard power off.
1970-01-01 4y ago
Low-level power savings (s3 sleep) and magic packet (Wake-on-LAN) have been a standard since the late 90s. Getting a Linux OS that actually delivers these standardized power features is now a 20+ year old bug. I can only imagine the amount of energy that would have been saved if this bug was properly fixed 25 years ago. With solid-state tech becoming cheaper every day, I now expect nobody will make an "it just works" OS that has both sleep and wake working on-demand. Globally, the HDDs will simply continue to spin until there are none.
- usr1106 4y ago
  Who pays for Linux development? Either companies for servers or embedded Linux. Servers don't sleep. Embedded might sleep, but it's not PC hardware, so it needs completely different power management features. Nobody is paying for Linux on average PC hardware, that's why 20 year old bugs are not fixed.
lopkeny12ko 4y ago
This sounds like an isolated and highly specific experience being generalized to an entire operating system.

dolmen 4y ago

> Obviously Linux can sleep easily since decades ago. No. I have an old Dell laptop that still doesn't power off when asked from Ubuntu Desktop. Always reboots instead.

kortex 4y ago

Classic "works on my machine". Operating systems are complex beasties. Bugs happen. I have an Asus laptop with Ubuntu 22.04 and it worked fine. Then one day, any time it comes back from sleep, the screen stays black. Can't find and workarounds and probably need to reimage. I have to do this about once a year cause something inevitably borks.

0x457 4y ago

> Obviously Linux can sleep easily since decades ago. Over the last 5 years, I had about 4 laptops that I ran Linux on. Not a single one was able to survive this: - Do some work on it - Close the lid - Drive somewhere else - Resume work At best, the laptop would freeze and require a hard reset (extra annoying on Dell XPS for some reason). At worst, it will be completely draining of power. All of my linux-loving colleges had the same issues. Windows worked just fine on those laptops, btw. If you're curious, we've advanced beyond simple Suspend-to-RAM in 2012 when haswell was released. Out of the 3 major OS that used on desktop, only linux doesn't support those features: https://www.anandtech.com/show/6355/intels-haswell-architecture/3 https://www.anandtech.com/show/6355/intels-haswell-architect... I rarely have issues with S3 on my linux/windows desktop, though.