3 ms·

Graphics drivers are still somewhat of a mess in Linux, especially with Nvidia. Also, compatibility of games is all over the place. Some games have platinum rat

Graphics drivers are still somewhat of a mess in Linux, especially with Nvidia. Also, compatibility of games is all over the place. Some games have platinum rating, and they run fine, but every one in a while you get a stuttering that you don't get on windows. Until all games start releasing native ports (which could happen given Steam Decks success), Win is going to stick around. Also Win 11 isn't that bad. I have the pro and you can turn off a lot of intrusive settings. All of my dev stuff lives in WSL2, including anything graphical since WSL2 now includes an X server that can render linux graphical apps), and it works perfectly even with ML.

Mike_12345 4y ago
> Until all games start releasing native ports More realistically, game devs can target Proton as a platform, making sure it works on that.
iamerroragent 4y ago
This raises a question I have about Win 11. Are the problems people are attributing to 11 because they use the Home edition or are these problems also found in the Pro edition? Seems like worldly different experiences. Regardless getting a Linux system up and running is still infinitely more pleasant (assuming hardware compatibility is already taken into account). Right now I'm deciding on getting a second drive since Windows doesn't like to play nice with duel booting from what I can tell. Also Microsoft fucked up the sound for Oblivion and Morrowind.
- theodric 4y ago
  That's a HUGE assumption. I'm not some idiot neophyte who just migrated from a dumb phone yesterday; I've been running Linux since 1995. Debian 12 does not function on my Ryzen 7 5700G + Biostar B550M + RTX A2000 system-- it's nothing exotic! Neither does the stock Arch kernel, nor linux-rt, but linux-amd and my custom kernels do. I got it going, and I got VFIO passthrough working as well, but it took effort as well as knowledge normal users can't reasonably be expected to possess. Expecting people to buy based on an HCL is not reasonable, and that's half of why it will never be the year of Linux on the desktop. (The other half is the desktop being a dying breed, sadly.)
  - iamerroragent 4y ago
    Okay but insert Linux USB drive; boot; install; system works. That's literally been my experience and for many others. A Hardware Compatibility List (HCL) is completely reasonable in my opinion for building your own machine and it's well known that Nvidia and Linux don't play nice. Recently built a new system and went with AMD for that reason. Considered Intel but they're a little new to GPUs and were a little too mid range for what I wanted. Frankly it sounds more like you had issue with the Nvidia card than the rest of your components. Also have to consider are you trying to use completely free open source software or are you okay with proprietary blobs and drivers. For example Ubtuntu makes it easy for end user to activate those proprietary software blobs on installation.
    - theodric 4y ago
      > Frankly it sounds more like you had issue with the Nvidia card than the rest of your components. Incorrect assumption. The Nvidia card went in last, after the OS was working, and is only used in passthrough.
      - iamerroragent 4y ago
        So the onboard video worked from the get go and then things got messy after you installed the Nvidia card? You're not being very clear here what happened and if you're only using free software sources (the default for Debian I believe). Also looks like you replied further down. You're not even describing an average home user case but saying it's a massive assumption that average users will have an easy time installing Linux. Lol. Remember I was comparing the ease of installing a Linux system and having it functional is a hell of a lot smoother than Windows. That's just true in general. No assumption needed. There's other distros that have rolling releases that tend to have more updated software in exchange for stability and thorough testing.
  - vkazanov 4y ago
    As somebody who never even had a windows machine back in late 90s (my father was also a massive linux enthusiast) I can totally see your point. Ah, compiling the kernel... Anyways, there are some decent oem options these days. Even if you dislike preinstalled distros, hardware compatibility is guaranteed to be there. It just can't work any other way. Either vendors solve those compatibility problems for you, or you do it. I don't have much time so I went with the easier option of just getting dells or lenovos or simething from the numerous smaller sellers. Both my wife and my daughter are fine with my older hardware, btw.
smoldesu 4y ago
> especially with Nvidia. How so? I'm using Plasma's Wayland session on a 3070ti and have very few complaints. The only issues I've seen are some weird Java GUI apps and that GTK4 text rendering issue that just won't go away. None of the "stuttering that you don't get on windows" that you're citing, I can count the number of dropped frames in most titles on one hand. Did you ever give Wayland a proper try? > Until all games start releasing native ports Why? Win32 is covered reasonably well with Wine, I see no reason in my experience why a completely-native runtime is required. It's certainly not needed to get the vast majority of Windows games running on Linux.
ElectricalUnion 4y ago
> Until all games start releasing native ports Games on Steam don't run "native" most of the time to begin with; you can more or less always expect some random mix of "steam runtime" + "pressure vessel" + "environment provided" of containerization + i686 shared libraries on your (usual) "native" amd64 system. I don't see how that is different from running stuff under Proton.

Mike_12345 4y ago

> Until all games start releasing native ports More realistically, game devs can target Proton as a platform, making sure it works on that.

iamerroragent 4y ago

This raises a question I have about Win 11. Are the problems people are attributing to 11 because they use the Home edition or are these problems also found in the Pro edition? Seems like worldly different experiences. Regardless getting a Linux system up and running is still infinitely more pleasant (assuming hardware compatibility is already taken into account). Right now I'm deciding on getting a second drive since Windows doesn't like to play nice with duel booting from what I can tell. Also Microsoft fucked up the sound for Oblivion and Morrowind.

theodric 4y ago
That's a HUGE assumption. I'm not some idiot neophyte who just migrated from a dumb phone yesterday; I've been running Linux since 1995. Debian 12 does not function on my Ryzen 7 5700G + Biostar B550M + RTX A2000 system-- it's nothing exotic! Neither does the stock Arch kernel, nor linux-rt, but linux-amd and my custom kernels do. I got it going, and I got VFIO passthrough working as well, but it took effort as well as knowledge normal users can't reasonably be expected to possess. Expecting people to buy based on an HCL is not reasonable, and that's half of why it will never be the year of Linux on the desktop. (The other half is the desktop being a dying breed, sadly.)
- iamerroragent 4y ago
  Okay but insert Linux USB drive; boot; install; system works. That's literally been my experience and for many others. A Hardware Compatibility List (HCL) is completely reasonable in my opinion for building your own machine and it's well known that Nvidia and Linux don't play nice. Recently built a new system and went with AMD for that reason. Considered Intel but they're a little new to GPUs and were a little too mid range for what I wanted. Frankly it sounds more like you had issue with the Nvidia card than the rest of your components. Also have to consider are you trying to use completely free open source software or are you okay with proprietary blobs and drivers. For example Ubtuntu makes it easy for end user to activate those proprietary software blobs on installation.
  - theodric 4y ago
    > Frankly it sounds more like you had issue with the Nvidia card than the rest of your components. Incorrect assumption. The Nvidia card went in last, after the OS was working, and is only used in passthrough.
    - iamerroragent 4y ago
      So the onboard video worked from the get go and then things got messy after you installed the Nvidia card? You're not being very clear here what happened and if you're only using free software sources (the default for Debian I believe). Also looks like you replied further down. You're not even describing an average home user case but saying it's a massive assumption that average users will have an easy time installing Linux. Lol. Remember I was comparing the ease of installing a Linux system and having it functional is a hell of a lot smoother than Windows. That's just true in general. No assumption needed. There's other distros that have rolling releases that tend to have more updated software in exchange for stability and thorough testing.
- vkazanov 4y ago
  As somebody who never even had a windows machine back in late 90s (my father was also a massive linux enthusiast) I can totally see your point. Ah, compiling the kernel... Anyways, there are some decent oem options these days. Even if you dislike preinstalled distros, hardware compatibility is guaranteed to be there. It just can't work any other way. Either vendors solve those compatibility problems for you, or you do it. I don't have much time so I went with the easier option of just getting dells or lenovos or simething from the numerous smaller sellers. Both my wife and my daughter are fine with my older hardware, btw.

smoldesu 4y ago

> especially with Nvidia. How so? I'm using Plasma's Wayland session on a 3070ti and have very few complaints. The only issues I've seen are some weird Java GUI apps and that GTK4 text rendering issue that just won't go away. None of the "stuttering that you don't get on windows" that you're citing, I can count the number of dropped frames in most titles on one hand. Did you ever give Wayland a proper try? > Until all games start releasing native ports Why? Win32 is covered reasonably well with Wine, I see no reason in my experience why a completely-native runtime is required. It's certainly not needed to get the vast majority of Windows games running on Linux.

ElectricalUnion 4y ago

> Until all games start releasing native ports Games on Steam don't run "native" most of the time to begin with; you can more or less always expect some random mix of "steam runtime" + "pressure vessel" + "environment provided" of containerization + i686 shared libraries on your (usual) "native" amd64 system. I don't see how that is different from running stuff under Proton.