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No. I mean that it's not hard to gather evidence to back even very stupid teaching methods if you simply put enough effort and time to it.

danielmarkbruce 4y ago
Ok, so: "cherry picked evidence means the conclusions are bullshit" ?
- obscurette 4y ago
  No, cherry picking would be relatively easy to spot. What's actually hard is to determine what you actually measure.
  - danielmarkbruce 4y ago
    What's an example?
    - obscurette 4y ago
      The main problem is that teaching is only one of many things to influence what and how people learn. From teachers perspective ... If I conclude after a lesson that learning took place then why? Is it because the way I taught (words and examples I used etc) or because kids had finally enough time to think about topic and things just fell into place and it really didn't matter how I taught? Or it didn't matter at all and they knew it already, but finally just realized what I asked from them? Was it learning at all or just memorizing? If learning didn't took place then why? Is it because of normal cognitive overload? Is because of lack of attention? If yes, then why? Tired? Hungry? Just a bad day? They just didn't like me? And these are only very basic and general questions. Normally there is 20+ kids in the classroom and they all might have different reason why they learnt or didn't. There is a lot of going on in every kids' mind and all these matter how they learn up to very big and complicated things like culture, family background and group dynamics. Every experienced teacher knows that depending on class results might be very different even if you use same methods, examples, words etc.
      - danielmarkbruce 4y ago
        So: too many variables, impossible to pinpoint cause and effect, hence any conclusions are flawed. Yes/no?
        obscurette 4y ago
        Many variables with many unknowns in chaotic system. Conclusions can and must be made, but they don't translate well into other systems/time/etc.

danielmarkbruce 4y ago

Ok, so: "cherry picked evidence means the conclusions are bullshit" ?

obscurette 4y ago
No, cherry picking would be relatively easy to spot. What's actually hard is to determine what you actually measure.
- danielmarkbruce 4y ago
  What's an example?
  - obscurette 4y ago
    The main problem is that teaching is only one of many things to influence what and how people learn. From teachers perspective ... If I conclude after a lesson that learning took place then why? Is it because the way I taught (words and examples I used etc) or because kids had finally enough time to think about topic and things just fell into place and it really didn't matter how I taught? Or it didn't matter at all and they knew it already, but finally just realized what I asked from them? Was it learning at all or just memorizing? If learning didn't took place then why? Is it because of normal cognitive overload? Is because of lack of attention? If yes, then why? Tired? Hungry? Just a bad day? They just didn't like me? And these are only very basic and general questions. Normally there is 20+ kids in the classroom and they all might have different reason why they learnt or didn't. There is a lot of going on in every kids' mind and all these matter how they learn up to very big and complicated things like culture, family background and group dynamics. Every experienced teacher knows that depending on class results might be very different even if you use same methods, examples, words etc.
    - danielmarkbruce 4y ago
      So: too many variables, impossible to pinpoint cause and effect, hence any conclusions are flawed. Yes/no?
      - obscurette 4y ago
        Many variables with many unknowns in chaotic system. Conclusions can and must be made, but they don't translate well into other systems/time/etc.