9 ms·

The last thing anyone should ever want from a search engine is different results from the next person over.

mattw2121 3y ago
I strongly disagree. I would love for a search engine to, intelligently, cater the results based on my previous search history and patterns.
- mgkimsal 3y ago
  I would love for that ability to be easily determined visually, and easily toggled on/off. A big "personalized" and "generic" toggle switch at the top would be useful.
- starkd 3y ago
  I don't think the ability to serve up specialized content is the concern here. It is the fragmentation that results when we no longer have a shared reality or a consistent set of results in the population. Results specific to any one person is terrifying in some of its implications.
- maleldil 3y ago
  That's how you create bubbles.
  - ceejayoz 3y ago
    Not all bubbles are harmful. I’m in a regional bubble when I search for “restaurant”. I’m in a programming language bubble when I search for coding issues. Tune it to be less bubbly with controversial topics, perhaps.
  - Dalewyn 3y ago
    "Everyone should get the same search results." is really just rightspeak for "Everyone should be in my bubble."
  - mgkimsal 3y ago
    part of the issue with 'bubbles', as I see it, is that you don't know you're in a bubble. a big huge honking option of "keep me in the bubble" and "show results outside my bubble" would make it a lot more obvious (and manageable) to many people who are oblivious to the notion that they live in an information bubble. won't stop people who only use one source of news, but in a search aspect, it would be useful.
    - lightbendover 3y ago
      Any time I use a Google product, I know I'm in a bubble.
    - trafficante 3y ago
      Interestingly, Google themselves seem to be at least somewhat aware of this - though it may just be an accidental side effect of trying to drive user engagement on YouTube. I’ve been noticing an occasional “Show me something new to me” prompt showing up in my YT feed. It has literally never provided anything I was interested in watching, but I appreciate that they’re trying to burst bubbles.
      - maleldil 3y ago
        Youtube sometimes recommends that, but if you scroll the topics bar all the way to the right, you can access it at any time.
fluidcruft 3y ago
I'm actually not entirely sure about that. For example, if I know a lot about a particular topic and the search engine knows that I know a lot about that particular topic, then when I search for something, it should give me a condensed result and not introductory-level material. Or if I have certain preferences for the format of material I'm given. For example, if I prefer college-level outline material versus eighth-grade reading level text, for example. So it seems entirely reasonable to me that you would get different results. If I had a personal assistant that was performing the search for me, I would expect customized results from them. I don't know why I should not expect the same from a machine.
Arnt 3y ago
The next person over cares about sports and boobies. By which I mean spectator sports and, uhm, spectator boobies. Is the last thing I'd want really results different from my neighbour?
- ant6n 3y ago
  For the same query?
  - websap 3y ago
    Depends on the query. Fact based queries should have the same answer. If I'm searching for Python, I'd expect to see more about the programming language than the animal.
    - throwaway290 3y ago
      > If I'm searching for Python, I'd expect to see more about the programming language than the animal. Which is different from what most people would expect. You see the problem.
  - ceejayoz 3y ago
    Yes. I like that Google seems to surface programming results in the language I use. In the case of “boobies”, if I’m a bird expert it might give me info on blue footed boobies first.
    - Arnt 3y ago
      Or if you're a programmer and are looking for that paper written by Professor Firstname Lastname, you might prefer results about the CS professor, not about the eponymous person who undresses for a living. Or plays baseball for a living. I like arthouse films. ∀ arthouse ∃ approximately eponymous porn film. I can't say I dislike porn, but if the search engines were to treat me like my neighbour I'd never get any arthouse results. Too niche.
  - Arnt 3y ago
MajimasEyepatch 3y ago
That’s not true. If I, a software developer, search for “pandas,” Google should probably show me the Python data library near or at the top. If my friend who’s not an engineer searches for “pandas,” they’re probably looking for the bear.
SquareWheel 3y ago
That might be true in concept, but I don't think it's true in reality. When people search for something online, they want the first result to be whatever they had in mind. If I search for Python, I want the homepage for the programming language. When somebody else searches for Python, they might be looking to learn about the animal. You could argue that we should just ask for exactly what we want, but that puts more work on the user and reduces the effectiveness of the tool. I don't want to type more than "python", I just want the link! Search engines provide very little personalization even today. I'm almost surprised a competitor hasn't popped up with a product that tries to fill that niche.
- latexr 3y ago
  > Search engines provide very little personalization even today. I'm almost surprised a competitor hasn't popped up with a product that tries to fill that niche. Kagi seems to be that. https://kagi.com https://kagi.com
- morkalork 3y ago
  What about a child who used to be interested in reptiles but is now interested in programming? I get frustrated when Google starts acting "smart" and changing queries or hiding results. I've started to use Bing image search because I'd like more than 20 results, the way Google used to be. If they start acting like that even more, I'll use them even less!
  - throwaway290 3y ago
    Google's model is the only viable one long term. With growing amount of information, the only way to find you something useful without making you enter a growing amount of terms is to maintain a context of what you are interested in. No child will be confused if they look up a programming language that they already know have the exact same name as reptile and get reptile first.
- godshatter 3y ago
  People are different, I get it, but I don't want a search engine that tries to second guess me all the time. If I'm a programmer and I'm interested in the actual animal, I don't want to have to fight against the product. I'd much rather use my knowledge to craft my queries intelligently so that I get exactly what I want. But then when it comes to technology, I'm a bit of a control freak.
HelloNurse 3y ago
Not "anyone": only mature searchers that worry about privacy, filter bubbles and artificially buried/censored good results. Advertisement buyers, on the other hand, benefit greatly from carefully controlling who sees their ads. For example, child care related products for female teenagers that are one year too old for their school class, or lawyers for young adult males from bad neighborhoods; I'm sure everyone can think of something more creepy and offensive.
- neffy 3y ago
  For the unsuspecting computer nerd, a search for latex back at the dawn of search technology was briefly something that could truly open the unprepared mind to unsuspected vistas. Boy did that one get fixed fast. But let us spare a moment of thought for the subsequent searchers for interesting items of latex clothing, and how they felt about being exposed to interminable details about an obscure word processing system.
qwertox 3y ago
It really depends. If I want to search coding related stuff, I want this to be personalized as much as possible, with always having the option to extend the search for non-traditional topics. Or when searching for places to go, it would be nice to get recommendations which consider that I love to ride bicycle. Then there's DuckDuckGo on Firefox for legacy search if you're paranoid.
raldi 3y ago
What do you think an American tourist overseas wants when they ask for [football scores]? Do you think an ergonomics engineer logged in from the office and a musician in their studio might want different things when they search for [keyboard reviews]? How about a 16-year-old male native Texan versus a 62-year-old female immigrant with a degree in fine arts who search for [nearby movies]?
dyno12345 3y ago
this is might be a great example of the difference between what people think they want being completely at odds with how they actually behave

I strongly disagree. I would love for a search engine to, intelligently, cater the results based on my previous search history and patterns.

mgkimsal 3y ago
I would love for that ability to be easily determined visually, and easily toggled on/off. A big "personalized" and "generic" toggle switch at the top would be useful.
starkd 3y ago
I don't think the ability to serve up specialized content is the concern here. It is the fragmentation that results when we no longer have a shared reality or a consistent set of results in the population. Results specific to any one person is terrifying in some of its implications.
maleldil 3y ago
That's how you create bubbles.
- ceejayoz 3y ago
  Not all bubbles are harmful. I’m in a regional bubble when I search for “restaurant”. I’m in a programming language bubble when I search for coding issues. Tune it to be less bubbly with controversial topics, perhaps.
- Dalewyn 3y ago
  "Everyone should get the same search results." is really just rightspeak for "Everyone should be in my bubble."
- mgkimsal 3y ago
  part of the issue with 'bubbles', as I see it, is that you don't know you're in a bubble. a big huge honking option of "keep me in the bubble" and "show results outside my bubble" would make it a lot more obvious (and manageable) to many people who are oblivious to the notion that they live in an information bubble. won't stop people who only use one source of news, but in a search aspect, it would be useful.
  - lightbendover 3y ago
    Any time I use a Google product, I know I'm in a bubble.
  - trafficante 3y ago
    Interestingly, Google themselves seem to be at least somewhat aware of this - though it may just be an accidental side effect of trying to drive user engagement on YouTube. I’ve been noticing an occasional “Show me something new to me” prompt showing up in my YT feed. It has literally never provided anything I was interested in watching, but I appreciate that they’re trying to burst bubbles.
    - maleldil 3y ago
      Youtube sometimes recommends that, but if you scroll the topics bar all the way to the right, you can access it at any time.

fluidcruft 3y ago

I'm actually not entirely sure about that. For example, if I know a lot about a particular topic and the search engine knows that I know a lot about that particular topic, then when I search for something, it should give me a condensed result and not introductory-level material. Or if I have certain preferences for the format of material I'm given. For example, if I prefer college-level outline material versus eighth-grade reading level text, for example. So it seems entirely reasonable to me that you would get different results. If I had a personal assistant that was performing the search for me, I would expect customized results from them. I don't know why I should not expect the same from a machine.

Arnt 3y ago

The next person over cares about sports and boobies. By which I mean spectator sports and, uhm, spectator boobies. Is the last thing I'd want really results different from my neighbour?

ant6n 3y ago
For the same query?
- websap 3y ago
  Depends on the query. Fact based queries should have the same answer. If I'm searching for Python, I'd expect to see more about the programming language than the animal.
  - throwaway290 3y ago
    > If I'm searching for Python, I'd expect to see more about the programming language than the animal. Which is different from what most people would expect. You see the problem.
- ceejayoz 3y ago
  Yes. I like that Google seems to surface programming results in the language I use. In the case of “boobies”, if I’m a bird expert it might give me info on blue footed boobies first.
  - Arnt 3y ago
    Or if you're a programmer and are looking for that paper written by Professor Firstname Lastname, you might prefer results about the CS professor, not about the eponymous person who undresses for a living. Or plays baseball for a living. I like arthouse films. ∀ arthouse ∃ approximately eponymous porn film. I can't say I dislike porn, but if the search engines were to treat me like my neighbour I'd never get any arthouse results. Too niche.
- Arnt 3y ago

MajimasEyepatch 3y ago

That’s not true. If I, a software developer, search for “pandas,” Google should probably show me the Python data library near or at the top. If my friend who’s not an engineer searches for “pandas,” they’re probably looking for the bear.

SquareWheel 3y ago

That might be true in concept, but I don't think it's true in reality. When people search for something online, they want the first result to be whatever they had in mind. If I search for Python, I want the homepage for the programming language. When somebody else searches for Python, they might be looking to learn about the animal. You could argue that we should just ask for exactly what we want, but that puts more work on the user and reduces the effectiveness of the tool. I don't want to type more than "python", I just want the link! Search engines provide very little personalization even today. I'm almost surprised a competitor hasn't popped up with a product that tries to fill that niche.

latexr 3y ago
> Search engines provide very little personalization even today. I'm almost surprised a competitor hasn't popped up with a product that tries to fill that niche. Kagi seems to be that. https://kagi.com https://kagi.com
morkalork 3y ago
What about a child who used to be interested in reptiles but is now interested in programming? I get frustrated when Google starts acting "smart" and changing queries or hiding results. I've started to use Bing image search because I'd like more than 20 results, the way Google used to be. If they start acting like that even more, I'll use them even less!
- throwaway290 3y ago
  Google's model is the only viable one long term. With growing amount of information, the only way to find you something useful without making you enter a growing amount of terms is to maintain a context of what you are interested in. No child will be confused if they look up a programming language that they already know have the exact same name as reptile and get reptile first.
godshatter 3y ago
People are different, I get it, but I don't want a search engine that tries to second guess me all the time. If I'm a programmer and I'm interested in the actual animal, I don't want to have to fight against the product. I'd much rather use my knowledge to craft my queries intelligently so that I get exactly what I want. But then when it comes to technology, I'm a bit of a control freak.

HelloNurse 3y ago

Not "anyone": only mature searchers that worry about privacy, filter bubbles and artificially buried/censored good results. Advertisement buyers, on the other hand, benefit greatly from carefully controlling who sees their ads. For example, child care related products for female teenagers that are one year too old for their school class, or lawyers for young adult males from bad neighborhoods; I'm sure everyone can think of something more creepy and offensive.

neffy 3y ago
For the unsuspecting computer nerd, a search for latex back at the dawn of search technology was briefly something that could truly open the unprepared mind to unsuspected vistas. Boy did that one get fixed fast. But let us spare a moment of thought for the subsequent searchers for interesting items of latex clothing, and how they felt about being exposed to interminable details about an obscure word processing system.

qwertox 3y ago

It really depends. If I want to search coding related stuff, I want this to be personalized as much as possible, with always having the option to extend the search for non-traditional topics. Or when searching for places to go, it would be nice to get recommendations which consider that I love to ride bicycle. Then there's DuckDuckGo on Firefox for legacy search if you're paranoid.

raldi 3y ago

What do you think an American tourist overseas wants when they ask for [football scores]? Do you think an ergonomics engineer logged in from the office and a musician in their studio might want different things when they search for [keyboard reviews]? How about a 16-year-old male native Texan versus a 62-year-old female immigrant with a degree in fine arts who search for [nearby movies]?

dyno12345 3y ago

this is might be a great example of the difference between what people think they want being completely at odds with how they actually behave