6 ms·

> this is what we will get 10x with free college That seems quite different. First, lots of countries have free higher education and seem to do just fine. Seco

> this is what we will get 10x with free college That seems quite different. First, lots of countries have free higher education and seem to do just fine. Second, lowering price of entry is orthogonal to lowering expected performance. Your argument does not apply.

ElFitz 4y ago
Some countries even pay students to attend their highest ranking engineering schools.
- upsidesinclude 4y ago
  >highest ranking engineering By defintion some of the highest performing students who must compete for entry. These are not apples alike.
  - ElFitz 4y ago
    This is what I was answering to: > (Side note, this is what we will get 10x with free college, and the guaranteed loans have already driven it this way a bit more) But perhaps good colleges in the US just accept anyone that walks through the door and can pay the tuition?
    - upsidesinclude 4y ago
      Effectively. US universities work on a growth model, expanding their student body and capital investment for tax purposes and to increase profits. There is always some school that will accept a student for the sake of those unforgivable government supplied student loans
SideQuark 4y ago
Every free college country sends less of their people through college than the US. Is that the outcome we want? Fewer educated?
- elashri 4y ago
  Do you mean per-capita or over all? Because a very few countries with a bigger number of populations than US have free-education. If the former, can you provide a data source?
  - revelio 4y ago
    They mean per capita. Countries with very cheap or free university allow very few people to go on such terms, relative to the size of the population.
    - jpgvm 4y ago
      Yes but they also generally don't offer bullshit degrees that people obtain and then end up working at McDonalds. Germany, Switzerland, Belgium all come to mind as countries with free or near-free education that while they don't graduate the same % of their population through tertiary eduction it's not for lack of available opportunity but rather many people choose not to pursue tertiary eduction. This is actually a good thing because they are often choosing alternatives like vocational education that is more suited to their career choices. Baristas with university degrees is the outcome of pushing everyone to get a degree and is common place in both the US, Canada and Australia as a result as all 3 have this same notion that you need a degree to get a job. Atleast in Australia and Canada you don't also get saddled with crippling debt.
      - revelio 4y ago
        Sure. I'm not saying their approach is bad or wrong, I'm supportive of it. I'm just observing that it results in far fewer people getting degrees. Agreed that this may be for the best.
        jpgvm 4y ago
        I see, that wasn't how I interpreted what you originally wrote but yes, fewer people with degrees but seemingly better outcome.

ElFitz 4y ago

Some countries even pay students to attend their highest ranking engineering schools.

upsidesinclude 4y ago
>highest ranking engineering By defintion some of the highest performing students who must compete for entry. These are not apples alike.
- ElFitz 4y ago
  This is what I was answering to: > (Side note, this is what we will get 10x with free college, and the guaranteed loans have already driven it this way a bit more) But perhaps good colleges in the US just accept anyone that walks through the door and can pay the tuition?
  - upsidesinclude 4y ago
    Effectively. US universities work on a growth model, expanding their student body and capital investment for tax purposes and to increase profits. There is always some school that will accept a student for the sake of those unforgivable government supplied student loans

SideQuark 4y ago

Every free college country sends less of their people through college than the US. Is that the outcome we want? Fewer educated?

elashri 4y ago
Do you mean per-capita or over all? Because a very few countries with a bigger number of populations than US have free-education. If the former, can you provide a data source?
- revelio 4y ago
  They mean per capita. Countries with very cheap or free university allow very few people to go on such terms, relative to the size of the population.
  - jpgvm 4y ago
    Yes but they also generally don't offer bullshit degrees that people obtain and then end up working at McDonalds. Germany, Switzerland, Belgium all come to mind as countries with free or near-free education that while they don't graduate the same % of their population through tertiary eduction it's not for lack of available opportunity but rather many people choose not to pursue tertiary eduction. This is actually a good thing because they are often choosing alternatives like vocational education that is more suited to their career choices. Baristas with university degrees is the outcome of pushing everyone to get a degree and is common place in both the US, Canada and Australia as a result as all 3 have this same notion that you need a degree to get a job. Atleast in Australia and Canada you don't also get saddled with crippling debt.
    - revelio 4y ago
      Sure. I'm not saying their approach is bad or wrong, I'm supportive of it. I'm just observing that it results in far fewer people getting degrees. Agreed that this may be for the best.
      - jpgvm 4y ago
        I see, that wasn't how I interpreted what you originally wrote but yes, fewer people with degrees but seemingly better outcome.