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Finally, somebody said it! A 30 day app is a hobby. The chances of success are like winning the lottery. It is ideas like this that give people very unrealistic

Finally, somebody said it! A 30 day app is a hobby. The chances of success are like winning the lottery. It is ideas like this that give people very unrealistic expectations. In my experience there are 2 main types of people who are hurt by the "30 day app" idea and others like it. The first is the Instant Millionaire type. They think they just thought of the next Facebook now all they need is someone who knows how to use a text editor to build it! So they get it done by an outsourced company in India or they hire their nephew who "is good at computers" or they hire the local "web developer" in town that just finished reading "HTML for Dummies" and charges $100 for a website that looks like it was converted to HTML from a Word document. Inevitably the idea turns out to be crap, it fails, and it ends up being someone else's fault somehow. Then there are the legit hackers who are super passionate, have a great idea, and have the skills to execute. They see all the stories of the quick hack app that seems to be blowing up online and they feel like the only way to compete is to keep up with the guys who are doing this stuff. But the reality is that if you really want to make a business out of your idea there's a lot more to it than just building version 1 and sending the link to your friends. It's sad because these people fail and get down on themselves never realizing that they had unrealistic expectations to begin with. These stories of the 30 day app and others like it are the exception. They're so rare that when they do happen it gets massive amounts of attention. But those stories are the exceptions with the rule being that even well planned businesses default to failure. I site around HN and read stories of all these incredibly talented people doing stuff that's incredible and it makes me feel like I suck unless I keep up. It promotes the idea that success is quick and dirty. I hope everyone remembers that all the trends and fads in business are either bullshit or you really need to adapt them to fit your situation and have realistic expectations from the beginning.

Kiro 15y ago
Good points but it all depends on the definition of success. A 30 day app can very well make someone a small living and be successful in that sense. Just because it doesn't make you a millionaire doesn't mean it's a failure.
- billpatrianakos 15y ago
  Well put and I agree. What I'm referring to are the people who want to get covered in TechCrunch and have valuations in the millions. I very much respect the people who do something they love and make a comfortable living from. I very much feel sorry for the ones who are looking to have a movie made about them a la The Social Network.
mapgrep 15y ago
Is it better for your "Instant Millionaire" to spend a. 30 days or b. 2+ months ...learning that his idea "turns out to be crap?" It is better for the "legit hacker" to spend a. 30 days or b. 2+ months ...to learn that "there's a lot more to it than just building version 1?" You seem to think that failure is an unexpected outcome of rapid development. In fact it is a key GOAL of rapid development.
- lwat 15y ago
  [Failure] is a key GOAL of rapid development. In that case you are doing it wrong.
- billpatrianakos 15y ago
  I think failure as a goal is total nonsense and another one of those ideas that's become popular but is just bad advice. Failing teaches you what not to do. Instead people should be learning from success. Do your homework, put out something based on educated research and focus on what is working and repeat it. Learning from successes gives you something you can use again and again. Learning from failure gives you a one time lesson in what not to do which is far less valuable. There's more than enough information floating about on what works that people can easily access and fit to their needs. Even people with completely revolutionary ideas that have never been done before can benefit as lessons in marketing, design, and coding techniques apply to everyone. If you've ever met an Imstant Millionaire you'll notice they don't learn from their mistakes. There's always some excuse and enough blame to put on everyone but themselves. In the end they always end up pursuing another bad idea in the same way somehow convincing themselves that this time it'll be different. I've come across a bunch of these people and often they're working on several doomed ideas at once, going about each the same way. As for the legit hacker I really wonder what they really learn. You may be perfectly right but if I put myself in those shoes my mind works in a way that if my 30 day app failed I'd blame it on bad design, not enough buzz, or somehow blame my code for not being objected oriented or functional or maybe I just didn't use the right framework. Now, despite my disagreement with failure as a goal I think people with that mindset are much better off than others. The problem is the people I'm talking about don't have this mindset. They simply read about how someone else did it ans think "me too! I'll do it too!" with no understanding that what they're reading about is either a stroke of luck or was built by someone whos had the right plan and mindset.

Kiro 15y ago

Good points but it all depends on the definition of success. A 30 day app can very well make someone a small living and be successful in that sense. Just because it doesn't make you a millionaire doesn't mean it's a failure.

billpatrianakos 15y ago
Well put and I agree. What I'm referring to are the people who want to get covered in TechCrunch and have valuations in the millions. I very much respect the people who do something they love and make a comfortable living from. I very much feel sorry for the ones who are looking to have a movie made about them a la The Social Network.

mapgrep 15y ago

Is it better for your "Instant Millionaire" to spend a. 30 days or b. 2+ months ...learning that his idea "turns out to be crap?" It is better for the "legit hacker" to spend a. 30 days or b. 2+ months ...to learn that "there's a lot more to it than just building version 1?" You seem to think that failure is an unexpected outcome of rapid development. In fact it is a key GOAL of rapid development.

lwat 15y ago
[Failure] is a key GOAL of rapid development. In that case you are doing it wrong.
billpatrianakos 15y ago
I think failure as a goal is total nonsense and another one of those ideas that's become popular but is just bad advice. Failing teaches you what not to do. Instead people should be learning from success. Do your homework, put out something based on educated research and focus on what is working and repeat it. Learning from successes gives you something you can use again and again. Learning from failure gives you a one time lesson in what not to do which is far less valuable. There's more than enough information floating about on what works that people can easily access and fit to their needs. Even people with completely revolutionary ideas that have never been done before can benefit as lessons in marketing, design, and coding techniques apply to everyone. If you've ever met an Imstant Millionaire you'll notice they don't learn from their mistakes. There's always some excuse and enough blame to put on everyone but themselves. In the end they always end up pursuing another bad idea in the same way somehow convincing themselves that this time it'll be different. I've come across a bunch of these people and often they're working on several doomed ideas at once, going about each the same way. As for the legit hacker I really wonder what they really learn. You may be perfectly right but if I put myself in those shoes my mind works in a way that if my 30 day app failed I'd blame it on bad design, not enough buzz, or somehow blame my code for not being objected oriented or functional or maybe I just didn't use the right framework. Now, despite my disagreement with failure as a goal I think people with that mindset are much better off than others. The problem is the people I'm talking about don't have this mindset. They simply read about how someone else did it ans think "me too! I'll do it too!" with no understanding that what they're reading about is either a stroke of luck or was built by someone whos had the right plan and mindset.