5 ms·

Smokey’s new hot vapourizing engine creates heat in Detroit (1983)

37 points by satchet 4y ago

pengaru 4y ago
In my gearhead days I had a dead-tree copy of Yunick's Power Secrets, and read about his adiabatic modified car engine. My understanding at the time was that the main barrier to market was emissions related. Oxides of nitrogen in particular were far too high from the high temperatures. If you look at an emissions test summary NOx is one of the few things they actually measure. > NOx gases are usually produced from the reaction between nitrogen and oxygen during combustion of fuels, such as hydrocarbons, in air; especially at high temperatures, such as in car engines. [0] So I'm pretty sure the opening line "meets all emission standards without electronic equipment" from TFA is incorrect. Or maybe was only briefly correct in 1983... [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NOx https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NOx
- vhodges 4y ago
  I read the PopSci article on this way back when and always wondered what became if it, thanks!
- qbrass 4y ago
  NOx can be reduced using non-electronic equipment. Well, you could do it in 1983, anyway.
  - actionfromafar 4y ago
    Honda had a famously complicated mechanical contraption IIRC.
  - dredmorbius 4y ago
    I'd recently learned of emissions-reduction kits fitted to diesel systems which use ammonia to reduce NOx emissions. I believe that's Selective catalytic reduction: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_catalytic_reduction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_catalytic_reduction> The process uses "diesel exhaust fluid" (not to be confused with blinker fluid), sold as "AdBlue" in Europe, possibly elsewhere: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_exhaust_fluid https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_exhaust_fluid>
JohnBooty 4y ago
This is all very fascinating, but also very over my head! I found a post detailing some reasons why this technology never made it to production; apparently such an engine is always running rather close to its limits and could more or less self destruct if there was a small problem with air/fuel ratio and timing. https://www.yellowbullet.com/threads/smokey-yunicks-hot-vapor-engine-why-isnt-it-used-today.2552975/ https://www.yellowbullet.com/threads/smokey-yunicks-hot-vapo...
- schiffern 4y ago
  Great link, thanks. Sidenote, I don't know why the forum software makes you hit "See More" to see the whole post. Here are filters for uBlock Origin: www.yellowbullet.com##.MessageCard__content-inner:style(max-height:none!important;overflow:visible!important;overflow-wrap:break-word!important;position:static!important) www.yellowbullet.com##.MessageCard__collapse-link
userbinator 4y ago
He's a very interesting character: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokey_Yunick https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokey_Yunick
- mgarfias 4y ago
  Was. And the linked Wikipedia article doesn’t capture nearly enough. I recommend picking up a copy of his “best damned garage in town” autobiography.
mgarfias 4y ago
RIP Smokey
jacknews 4y ago
So is this basically HCCI? And there's this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transonic_Combustion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transonic_Combustion There are a bewildering array of 'revolutionary' ICE engines, that have yet to revolute. What happened to these? - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_disk_engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_disk_engine - https://studymafia.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/MECH-Ball-Piston-Engine-Report.pdf https://studymafia.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/MECH-Ball-... - https://www.dukeengines.com/technology/overview/ https://www.dukeengines.com/technology/overview/ - https://cyclonepower.com/ https://cyclonepower.com/ - https://www.starrotor.com/technology/engines/ https://www.starrotor.com/technology/engines/ - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EcoMotors https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EcoMotors - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stelzer_engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stelzer_engine - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scuderi_engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scuderi_engine And I'm sure many others.
dusted 4y ago
> There are no electronic devices. Smokey prefers to avoid them. So, his engines run with simple carburetor and breaker points. Yet, the system fully meets all emission standards. Consequently, manufacturers could eliminate all those expensive, ridiculous converters and air pumps. Oh please let's get back to this!

37 points by satchet 4y ago

In my gearhead days I had a dead-tree copy of Yunick's Power Secrets, and read about his adiabatic modified car engine. My understanding at the time was that the main barrier to market was emissions related. Oxides of nitrogen in particular were far too high from the high temperatures. If you look at an emissions test summary NOx is one of the few things they actually measure. > NOx gases are usually produced from the reaction between nitrogen and oxygen during combustion of fuels, such as hydrocarbons, in air; especially at high temperatures, such as in car engines. [0] So I'm pretty sure the opening line "meets all emission standards without electronic equipment" from TFA is incorrect. Or maybe was only briefly correct in 1983... [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NOx https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NOx

vhodges 4y ago
I read the PopSci article on this way back when and always wondered what became if it, thanks!
qbrass 4y ago
NOx can be reduced using non-electronic equipment. Well, you could do it in 1983, anyway.
- actionfromafar 4y ago
  Honda had a famously complicated mechanical contraption IIRC.
- dredmorbius 4y ago
  I'd recently learned of emissions-reduction kits fitted to diesel systems which use ammonia to reduce NOx emissions. I believe that's Selective catalytic reduction: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_catalytic_reduction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_catalytic_reduction> The process uses "diesel exhaust fluid" (not to be confused with blinker fluid), sold as "AdBlue" in Europe, possibly elsewhere: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_exhaust_fluid https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_exhaust_fluid>

JohnBooty 4y ago

This is all very fascinating, but also very over my head! I found a post detailing some reasons why this technology never made it to production; apparently such an engine is always running rather close to its limits and could more or less self destruct if there was a small problem with air/fuel ratio and timing. https://www.yellowbullet.com/threads/smokey-yunicks-hot-vapor-engine-why-isnt-it-used-today.2552975/ https://www.yellowbullet.com/threads/smokey-yunicks-hot-vapo...

schiffern 4y ago
Great link, thanks. Sidenote, I don't know why the forum software makes you hit "See More" to see the whole post. Here are filters for uBlock Origin: www.yellowbullet.com##.MessageCard__content-inner:style(max-height:none!important;overflow:visible!important;overflow-wrap:break-word!important;position:static!important) www.yellowbullet.com##.MessageCard__collapse-link

userbinator 4y ago

He's a very interesting character: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokey_Yunick https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokey_Yunick

mgarfias 4y ago
Was. And the linked Wikipedia article doesn’t capture nearly enough. I recommend picking up a copy of his “best damned garage in town” autobiography.

mgarfias 4y ago

RIP Smokey

jacknews 4y ago

So is this basically HCCI? And there's this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transonic_Combustion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transonic_Combustion There are a bewildering array of 'revolutionary' ICE engines, that have yet to revolute. What happened to these? - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_disk_engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_disk_engine - https://studymafia.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/MECH-Ball-Piston-Engine-Report.pdf https://studymafia.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/MECH-Ball-... - https://www.dukeengines.com/technology/overview/ https://www.dukeengines.com/technology/overview/ - https://cyclonepower.com/ https://cyclonepower.com/ - https://www.starrotor.com/technology/engines/ https://www.starrotor.com/technology/engines/ - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EcoMotors https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EcoMotors - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stelzer_engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stelzer_engine - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scuderi_engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scuderi_engine And I'm sure many others.

dusted 4y ago

> There are no electronic devices. Smokey prefers to avoid them. So, his engines run with simple carburetor and breaker points. Yet, the system fully meets all emission standards. Consequently, manufacturers could eliminate all those expensive, ridiculous converters and air pumps. Oh please let's get back to this!