4 ms·

Idk. about the US but where I live in the EU a _lot_ of people think that driving a SUV without needing the off-road capabilities is at least egoistic if not ou

Idk. about the US but where I live in the EU a _lot_ of people think that driving a SUV without needing the off-road capabilities is at least egoistic if not outright asocial. And given that this area (and many others) have "good enough(1)" streets so that the huge majority of people don't need the off-road capabilities of a SUV it's pretty easy to be for people to assume that you are egoistic or worse when they see you driving a SUV. This bias is probably reinforced by the coincidence(?) that the group of people driving SUVs here has a big overlap with some groups often associated with entitled egoistic behaviour. Somehow it often feels that the people insisting on driving a SUV without a need for it are using it like an armor they ware because they are afraid of the outside world. (1): The requirements for a road to not need a SUV are pretty low IMHO. Sure you might need a "good enough" ground clearance, motor and brakes in mountain areas, but you can get that without an SUV, many (most?) new non-sport cars fall into this category.

kelnos 4y ago
> in the EU a _lot_ of people think that driving a SUV without needing the off-road capabilities is at least egoistic if not outright asocial. In general I used to believe this (in the US) as well, but now everyone and their grandmother has one, so it's kinda hard to paint everyone with that broad a brush. (Attempting to do so is itself egoistic and asocial.) > people insisting on driving a SUV without a need for it are using it like an armor they ware because they are afraid of the outside world. It's an arms race. If everyone is driving an SUV except you, and you get into a crash, you're more likely to get more hurt than if you'd been driving an SUV as well. So more people drive SUVs, which encourages more people with a lean toward that mindset to drive them, and so on. Another driver (heh) of the SUV surge was children. In the 80s and 90s, many US families turned to minivans when they'd have a couple kids. Easier to load and unload the children, more space to carry things. But minivans were uncool and became associated with the boring suburban soccer mom/dad (especially men hated this, of course; driving around in a minivan was emasculating). SUVs brought most of the same benefits: extra cargo space, sometimes an extra row of seats, and easier to load and unload the children. And they were cool! I mean, "SUV" has "sport" right there in the name! Sports are cool! SUVs also handle a bit better than minivans, which are often just lumbering box-vehicles. Sure, an SUV usually doesn't handle as well as a sedan or coupe, but it's a decent middle ground for people who believe a sedan doesn't suit their needs. Another reason -- possibly the primary initial reason -- is profit-driven marketing. I don't know if it's still the case, but there was a loophole in US vehicle emissions laws that would allow for less-stringent emissions standards past a certain vehicle size. So SUVs allowed manufacturers to spend less money on increasing fuel efficiency and reducing emissions, and, to boot, also sell the vehicles at a higher price. So they manufactured demand with marketing that glorified the high "command seating position" that you get with vehicles like SUVs, and of course everyone ate that up. This highlights why I'd love for all advertising to be illegal: it's just emotional manipulation to get people to buy things they don't need. I don't personally like the proliferation of SUVs myself (and drive a 4-seater, AWD coupe, myself, and drive it in heavy snow just fine), but I perfectly understand why it's a thing, and have stopped bothering to begrudge people for their choices in this regard.
- DonHopkins 4y ago
  > driving around in a minivan was emasculating This supports his point that SUVs are a symptom of male fragility and childish egotistical behavior.
  - kelnos 4y ago
    Absolutely. I do think that the rise of SUVs in the US was dominated by other factors, but men not wanting to drive minivans played a part.
- ummonk 4y ago
  I blame car manufacturers partly for not even trying to make the minivans cool though. Look at the current generation Sienna (especially the XSE trim) for how to make a minivan look cool - it has some awesome swagger
  - DonHopkins 4y ago
    Minivan manufacturers who want to attract swaggering egotistical fragile man-children like Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos should look at the Oscar Mayer Wienermobile and Dr. Evil's rocket. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wienermobile https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wienermobile https://slate.com/technology/2021/07/bezos-blue-origin-resembles-penis-rocket-scientist-explains-why.html https://slate.com/technology/2021/07/bezos-blue-origin-resem... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ju1UwmgkKgI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ju1UwmgkKgI
ericmcer 4y ago
Wow that is like three steps ahead of where we are at. I would be content with people not driving giant lifted trucks with modified exhausts and cars with huge subwoofers. People who just drive SUVs seem like angels in comparison.

kelnos 4y ago

> in the EU a _lot_ of people think that driving a SUV without needing the off-road capabilities is at least egoistic if not outright asocial. In general I used to believe this (in the US) as well, but now everyone and their grandmother has one, so it's kinda hard to paint everyone with that broad a brush. (Attempting to do so is itself egoistic and asocial.) > people insisting on driving a SUV without a need for it are using it like an armor they ware because they are afraid of the outside world. It's an arms race. If everyone is driving an SUV except you, and you get into a crash, you're more likely to get more hurt than if you'd been driving an SUV as well. So more people drive SUVs, which encourages more people with a lean toward that mindset to drive them, and so on. Another driver (heh) of the SUV surge was children. In the 80s and 90s, many US families turned to minivans when they'd have a couple kids. Easier to load and unload the children, more space to carry things. But minivans were uncool and became associated with the boring suburban soccer mom/dad (especially men hated this, of course; driving around in a minivan was emasculating). SUVs brought most of the same benefits: extra cargo space, sometimes an extra row of seats, and easier to load and unload the children. And they were cool! I mean, "SUV" has "sport" right there in the name! Sports are cool! SUVs also handle a bit better than minivans, which are often just lumbering box-vehicles. Sure, an SUV usually doesn't handle as well as a sedan or coupe, but it's a decent middle ground for people who believe a sedan doesn't suit their needs. Another reason -- possibly the primary initial reason -- is profit-driven marketing. I don't know if it's still the case, but there was a loophole in US vehicle emissions laws that would allow for less-stringent emissions standards past a certain vehicle size. So SUVs allowed manufacturers to spend less money on increasing fuel efficiency and reducing emissions, and, to boot, also sell the vehicles at a higher price. So they manufactured demand with marketing that glorified the high "command seating position" that you get with vehicles like SUVs, and of course everyone ate that up. This highlights why I'd love for all advertising to be illegal: it's just emotional manipulation to get people to buy things they don't need. I don't personally like the proliferation of SUVs myself (and drive a 4-seater, AWD coupe, myself, and drive it in heavy snow just fine), but I perfectly understand why it's a thing, and have stopped bothering to begrudge people for their choices in this regard.

DonHopkins 4y ago
> driving around in a minivan was emasculating This supports his point that SUVs are a symptom of male fragility and childish egotistical behavior.
- kelnos 4y ago
  Absolutely. I do think that the rise of SUVs in the US was dominated by other factors, but men not wanting to drive minivans played a part.
ummonk 4y ago
I blame car manufacturers partly for not even trying to make the minivans cool though. Look at the current generation Sienna (especially the XSE trim) for how to make a minivan look cool - it has some awesome swagger
- DonHopkins 4y ago
  Minivan manufacturers who want to attract swaggering egotistical fragile man-children like Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos should look at the Oscar Mayer Wienermobile and Dr. Evil's rocket. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wienermobile https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wienermobile https://slate.com/technology/2021/07/bezos-blue-origin-resembles-penis-rocket-scientist-explains-why.html https://slate.com/technology/2021/07/bezos-blue-origin-resem... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ju1UwmgkKgI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ju1UwmgkKgI

ericmcer 4y ago

Wow that is like three steps ahead of where we are at. I would be content with people not driving giant lifted trucks with modified exhausts and cars with huge subwoofers. People who just drive SUVs seem like angels in comparison.