5 ms·

This makes Turbo GPT 3.5 level AI free, private and finetuneable. OpenAI exclusivity shrinks now to GPT-4. That's why I don't think they will be able to keep a

This makes Turbo GPT 3.5 level AI free, private and finetuneable. OpenAI exclusivity shrinks now to GPT-4. That's why I don't think they will be able to keep a large market share in LLMs, any level of AI is going to get open and free soon. SOTA models are also easy to distill by API, very hard to defend against using chat logs as training data for other models. Once we all got one running, maybe in the OS, maybe in the browser, or as a separate app, then I see bad days ahead for online advertising. Ads are simply omitted when the bot solves a specific task for the user. We got infinitely tuneable and efficient filters for everything that gets in front of our eyes, and we will need these AI assistants to fight back the onslaught of AI spam bots. We can make the internet a beautiful garden again if we control the filters and the UI.

skilled 4y ago
What beautiful garden? Are you completely ignoring the fact that OpenAI is made possible because it scraped the entire Web (the actual garden) and made a query index out of it? Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? Ignorance is bliss I guess.
- boredemployee 4y ago
  >> Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? The worrying is legit and cute but let's face that at this moment no one is giving a f. All we see are people worried that all the AI agents will take their jobs and/or how to make money out of that.
  - skilled 4y ago
    You're right. I myself don't care either, but not because I don't understand how it happened. I don't because there is nothing I can say or do that would make OpenAI suddenly change their direction.
- sebzim4500 4y ago
  >Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? We all stand on the shoulders of giants, the authors of this content did not grow up in a concrete box isolated from the works of earlier generations.
  - pmoriarty 4y ago
    It's like these people have never been to a library.
- zmnd 4y ago
  Out of curiosity, do you use ad blocking software?
  - ipaddr 4y ago
    No. See the web how your typical user does
- scubbo 4y ago
  > Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? Yes, which is why I'm delighted to be able to filter out the advertizing spam that subhuman scum traffic alongside the outputs of creativity.
armchairhacker 4y ago
The problem is that for-profit businesses like OpenAI have more money and compute than even millions of volunteers. I definitely believe we'll get an open GPT-4 eventually, but by then OpenAI will have GPT-5, and so on. It's a shame really: the ultimate cause is the massive amount of wealth inequality we have today. If private entities and governments didn't have so much resources compared to individuals, I'm certain an open-source AI would be the biggest, because open-source has intrinsic benefits over closed-source: you have many people all working on the same project vs. multiple siloed groups, and anyone not affiliated with the private service is biased to use and support the open one. This is why the best operating systems, programming languages, and other software are all open-source: more money != better software, you don't need money to build software as much as you need intelligence and work ethic. But with AI, the #1 limiting factor is web-scraping required to get all of the data, and GPUs to train a model with it (maybe also money to pay Mechanical-Turk workers for simple classification; but perhaps enough volunteers could beat this, plus it seems like unskilled classification is becoming less important since the models can do this on their own). That's not to say open-source AI won't be great, and I also think most places will use it. Especially if OpenAI is too expensive and/or disallows what they are trying to do. It does put pressure on OpenAI to be more lenient with pricing and acceptable use, and also to keep improving. But unless we address the massive wealth inequality, which is why LAION has substantially less funding than not just OpenAI but also some of the other startups, it's going to always lag behind.
- huijzer 4y ago
  Although FOSS is great, extreme wealth inequality has to be fixed by the government and not by open source developers.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- pleasantpeasant 4y ago
  Won't open-source AIs have their code stolen by the private AIs? There's no one stopping open-source AIs being used within private AIs.
kmod 4y ago
Do you have any evidence that this is GPT-3.5 level, or are you just repeating what they said? We have an abundance of claimed capabilities already; that's not what's lacking.
- bugglebeetle 4y ago
  I tried a few prompts I use in production stuff and it failed on all of them and hallucinated quite a bit more. All of these models are optimized for the gimmicky chatbot stuff that seems impressive to a casual user, but not for comparable capabilities to GPT-3.5. I wish what the parent said was true because it would save me money!
  - akiselev 4y ago
    Which open model comes closest to GPT-3.5 in your production workload, if you don't mind me asking?
    - bugglebeetle 4y ago
      None of them really, because I use complex prompts with task breakdowns that no other models beside OpenAI’s seem capable of processing. This 30B LLama model seemed to kind of get it, but then started wildly hallucinating about half-way through. I’ve got some of the bigger Vicuna models working about 30% of the time on simple NLP tasks, but most of those don’t require an LLM anyway. They might perform better if you fine-tune them for whatever particular job, but that kind of defeats the purpose. The advantage of LLMs is supposed to be their generalized capabilities.
      - xbmcuser 4y ago
        I think most people don't realise that OpenAi biggest advantage is the billions of queries it was asked those signals are what they used to optimise it. So I think very hard for a local model to reach similar capability.
        4y ago
KolmogorovComp 4y ago
Side question, but how do these models are benchmarked, and how is this subfield evolving these days? I have seen many papers relying on standard student tests performance, but they don’t seem very accurate since LLAMA-based models perform almost as good as chatGPT (3/3.5) despite being apparently being an order of magnitude worse in practice.
pleasantpeasant 4y ago
I can't wait for an ad companies to force you to watch a 10 second video ad before it gives you a result for your query. It's only a matter of time before these AI companies start pairing up with ad companies(if they already haven't). Google could easily put ad videos every 10 queries or something. You already see these limited free tokens/credits/querie on AI art sites. How long until they put some ads in-between queries?
- l33tman 4y ago
  At least showing an ad here and there is fair as you're using something for free and it's not trying to manipulate you, only show you an ad. It would be much worse if they actually biased the answers to talk about stuff they are paid to endorse...
  - blep_ 4y ago
    Advertising is inherently manipulative. That's the entire point. Here, it's biasing toward Expedia, who profits if you use them regardless of which country you travel to.
- ssalka 4y ago
  I bet eventually someone's going to try to commercialize a model that injects ads into its responses... Prompt: What are the 3 most populated EU countries? Response: The three European countries with the highest populations are Germany, France and Italy. You can book a flight to any of these locations now for 10% off on Expedia.com. Use code TravelGPT.
  - dr_kiszonka 4y ago
    My speculation is that whatever we will be typing into these chat boxes (be it Bing, Bard, or free ChatGPT) will ultimately be used to for ad targeting anywhere on the web and beyond, either in-house (Bing) or via data brokers.
computershit 4y ago
If you think this is even close to gpt3.5turbo quality, try passing code output from OpenAssistant straight to 3.5turbo and see what happens.

skilled 4y ago

What beautiful garden? Are you completely ignoring the fact that OpenAI is made possible because it scraped the entire Web (the actual garden) and made a query index out of it? Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? Ignorance is bliss I guess.

boredemployee 4y ago
>> Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? The worrying is legit and cute but let's face that at this moment no one is giving a f. All we see are people worried that all the AI agents will take their jobs and/or how to make money out of that.
- skilled 4y ago
  You're right. I myself don't care either, but not because I don't understand how it happened. I don't because there is nothing I can say or do that would make OpenAI suddenly change their direction.
sebzim4500 4y ago
>Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? We all stand on the shoulders of giants, the authors of this content did not grow up in a concrete box isolated from the works of earlier generations.
- pmoriarty 4y ago
  It's like these people have never been to a library.
zmnd 4y ago
Out of curiosity, do you use ad blocking software?
- ipaddr 4y ago
  No. See the web how your typical user does
scubbo 4y ago
> Do you not have any respect for people who actually spent their time and creativity to provide the information necessary for this model to even work? Yes, which is why I'm delighted to be able to filter out the advertizing spam that subhuman scum traffic alongside the outputs of creativity.

armchairhacker 4y ago

The problem is that for-profit businesses like OpenAI have more money and compute than even millions of volunteers. I definitely believe we'll get an open GPT-4 eventually, but by then OpenAI will have GPT-5, and so on. It's a shame really: the ultimate cause is the massive amount of wealth inequality we have today. If private entities and governments didn't have so much resources compared to individuals, I'm certain an open-source AI would be the biggest, because open-source has intrinsic benefits over closed-source: you have many people all working on the same project vs. multiple siloed groups, and anyone not affiliated with the private service is biased to use and support the open one. This is why the best operating systems, programming languages, and other software are all open-source: more money != better software, you don't need money to build software as much as you need intelligence and work ethic. But with AI, the #1 limiting factor is web-scraping required to get all of the data, and GPUs to train a model with it (maybe also money to pay Mechanical-Turk workers for simple classification; but perhaps enough volunteers could beat this, plus it seems like unskilled classification is becoming less important since the models can do this on their own). That's not to say open-source AI won't be great, and I also think most places will use it. Especially if OpenAI is too expensive and/or disallows what they are trying to do. It does put pressure on OpenAI to be more lenient with pricing and acceptable use, and also to keep improving. But unless we address the massive wealth inequality, which is why LAION has substantially less funding than not just OpenAI but also some of the other startups, it's going to always lag behind.

huijzer 4y ago
Although FOSS is great, extreme wealth inequality has to be fixed by the government and not by open source developers.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
pleasantpeasant 4y ago
Won't open-source AIs have their code stolen by the private AIs? There's no one stopping open-source AIs being used within private AIs.

kmod 4y ago

Do you have any evidence that this is GPT-3.5 level, or are you just repeating what they said? We have an abundance of claimed capabilities already; that's not what's lacking.

bugglebeetle 4y ago
I tried a few prompts I use in production stuff and it failed on all of them and hallucinated quite a bit more. All of these models are optimized for the gimmicky chatbot stuff that seems impressive to a casual user, but not for comparable capabilities to GPT-3.5. I wish what the parent said was true because it would save me money!
- akiselev 4y ago
  Which open model comes closest to GPT-3.5 in your production workload, if you don't mind me asking?
  - bugglebeetle 4y ago
    None of them really, because I use complex prompts with task breakdowns that no other models beside OpenAI’s seem capable of processing. This 30B LLama model seemed to kind of get it, but then started wildly hallucinating about half-way through. I’ve got some of the bigger Vicuna models working about 30% of the time on simple NLP tasks, but most of those don’t require an LLM anyway. They might perform better if you fine-tune them for whatever particular job, but that kind of defeats the purpose. The advantage of LLMs is supposed to be their generalized capabilities.
    - xbmcuser 4y ago
      I think most people don't realise that OpenAi biggest advantage is the billions of queries it was asked those signals are what they used to optimise it. So I think very hard for a local model to reach similar capability.
      - 4y ago

KolmogorovComp 4y ago

Side question, but how do these models are benchmarked, and how is this subfield evolving these days? I have seen many papers relying on standard student tests performance, but they don’t seem very accurate since LLAMA-based models perform almost as good as chatGPT (3/3.5) despite being apparently being an order of magnitude worse in practice.

pleasantpeasant 4y ago

I can't wait for an ad companies to force you to watch a 10 second video ad before it gives you a result for your query. It's only a matter of time before these AI companies start pairing up with ad companies(if they already haven't). Google could easily put ad videos every 10 queries or something. You already see these limited free tokens/credits/querie on AI art sites. How long until they put some ads in-between queries?

l33tman 4y ago
At least showing an ad here and there is fair as you're using something for free and it's not trying to manipulate you, only show you an ad. It would be much worse if they actually biased the answers to talk about stuff they are paid to endorse...
- blep_ 4y ago
  Advertising is inherently manipulative. That's the entire point. Here, it's biasing toward Expedia, who profits if you use them regardless of which country you travel to.
ssalka 4y ago
I bet eventually someone's going to try to commercialize a model that injects ads into its responses... Prompt: What are the 3 most populated EU countries? Response: The three European countries with the highest populations are Germany, France and Italy. You can book a flight to any of these locations now for 10% off on Expedia.com. Use code TravelGPT.
- dr_kiszonka 4y ago
  My speculation is that whatever we will be typing into these chat boxes (be it Bing, Bard, or free ChatGPT) will ultimately be used to for ad targeting anywhere on the web and beyond, either in-house (Bing) or via data brokers.

computershit 4y ago

If you think this is even close to gpt3.5turbo quality, try passing code output from OpenAssistant straight to 3.5turbo and see what happens.