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> find a balance where it's not just an anti-SF crime-ridden sub The good ol' see no evil hear no evil approach to dealing with problems. I don't expect a subr

by mike_d 4y ago

> find a balance where it's not just an anti-SF crime-ridden sub The good ol' see no evil hear no evil approach to dealing with problems. I don't expect a subreddit to solve the larger problems of the city, but crafting the narrative to downplay it isn't really helping either. You're spot on, the only thing that binds the users is proximity. They all pretty much universally want a place to bitch about current issues, not to maintain a positive image for tourists.

function_seven 4y ago
You write "crafting the narrative" but all I'm looking for is to not see the same old posts about porch pirates and broken windows. There's already a lot of places for that rumination. Nextdoor, Facebook, etc. When looking at regional subreddits, I want to see the places to eat, events that are coming up, when major road work is planned, what new amenities just opened up, etc. It's totally fine and not nefarious to apply that kind of filter. To suggest the reason for it is image-massaging "for tourists" is unfair.
travisjungroth 4y ago
If I hosted a coffee meet-up and more than half the people showed up just to talk about deforestation, it’s pretty reasonable to take steps to try to change that up. You could call it “crafting the narrative to downplay it” but I’m not sure that’s fair. Maybe I just want to spend sometime enjoying coffee.
xoa 4y ago
>The good ol' see no evil hear no evil approach to dealing with problems This is a somewhat curious and surprisingly uncharitable thing for a relatively heavy and long standing HN user to write on, well HN. Right at the top of the submission guidelines, and relatively well followed, is >Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, or celebrities, unless they're evidence of some interesting new phenomenon. Videos of pratfalls or disasters, or cute animal pictures. If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic. That's not because none of that is important, it's because there are endless other places to learn about it and discuss it. Indeed, coverage and discussion of such things are more the rule than the exception in classic major media, which still has the most enormous reach. You don't have to do absolutely everything in one single place. It's the World Wide Web. Other fora are a click away. I think it's hard to argue that "everything forums" are generally better and focused ones generally worse. It's not wrong to want to have places to find the positive and wonderful stuff that isn't on the front page every single day. >They all pretty much universally want a place to bitch about current issues Who is "they"? You're creating a self-fulfilling prophecy here: if that is allowed to completely dominate, it'll drive away anyone who doesn't want that 24/7/365, and then all that are left are those who do. If HN suddenly just became a copy of major news front pages and comment sections, I suspect most of us would immediately move on. >not to maintain a positive image for tourists And this just seems like a pretty unpleasant dig. Any town let alone big city has all sorts of great stuff happening, interesting nooks and crannies, fun hobby groups looking for others to join, tips and tricks people have discovered to make living there more enjoyable, and on and on. Much of which can be hard to discover, even for those who have lived there a long time. Contrary to your assertion, it's not wrong even for locals to desire a place to find some of that even if it means keeping off a percentage of the generic endless political hot potatoes getting thrown back and forth. Why should a reddit (or any random web forum) suddenly be charged solely with "dealing with problems"?
- mike_d 4y ago
  My comment was a criticism of the San Francisco subreddit on Reddit, not of Hacker News. The rules are much more freeform over there and the site as a whole is constantly trying to find its balance between mob rule and moderator authoritarianism. In this particular case the SF subreddit moderators want it to reflect an aspirational view of how they want SF as a city to be, and the users tend to want to discuss the city as it is.
  - gkoberger 4y ago
    As a moderator of r/sf, that's simply not true. We just want balance.
gkoberger 4y ago
On the flip side, preventing others from crafting a narrative is just as much a part of the job of a mod as anything else. It's a hard balance.

by mike_d 4y ago

function_seven 4y ago

You write "crafting the narrative" but all I'm looking for is to not see the same old posts about porch pirates and broken windows. There's already a lot of places for that rumination. Nextdoor, Facebook, etc. When looking at regional subreddits, I want to see the places to eat, events that are coming up, when major road work is planned, what new amenities just opened up, etc. It's totally fine and not nefarious to apply that kind of filter. To suggest the reason for it is image-massaging "for tourists" is unfair.

travisjungroth 4y ago

If I hosted a coffee meet-up and more than half the people showed up just to talk about deforestation, it’s pretty reasonable to take steps to try to change that up. You could call it “crafting the narrative to downplay it” but I’m not sure that’s fair. Maybe I just want to spend sometime enjoying coffee.

xoa 4y ago

>The good ol' see no evil hear no evil approach to dealing with problems This is a somewhat curious and surprisingly uncharitable thing for a relatively heavy and long standing HN user to write on, well HN. Right at the top of the submission guidelines, and relatively well followed, is >Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, or celebrities, unless they're evidence of some interesting new phenomenon. Videos of pratfalls or disasters, or cute animal pictures. If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic. That's not because none of that is important, it's because there are endless other places to learn about it and discuss it. Indeed, coverage and discussion of such things are more the rule than the exception in classic major media, which still has the most enormous reach. You don't have to do absolutely everything in one single place. It's the World Wide Web. Other fora are a click away. I think it's hard to argue that "everything forums" are generally better and focused ones generally worse. It's not wrong to want to have places to find the positive and wonderful stuff that isn't on the front page every single day. >They all pretty much universally want a place to bitch about current issues Who is "they"? You're creating a self-fulfilling prophecy here: if that is allowed to completely dominate, it'll drive away anyone who doesn't want that 24/7/365, and then all that are left are those who do. If HN suddenly just became a copy of major news front pages and comment sections, I suspect most of us would immediately move on. >not to maintain a positive image for tourists And this just seems like a pretty unpleasant dig. Any town let alone big city has all sorts of great stuff happening, interesting nooks and crannies, fun hobby groups looking for others to join, tips and tricks people have discovered to make living there more enjoyable, and on and on. Much of which can be hard to discover, even for those who have lived there a long time. Contrary to your assertion, it's not wrong even for locals to desire a place to find some of that even if it means keeping off a percentage of the generic endless political hot potatoes getting thrown back and forth. Why should a reddit (or any random web forum) suddenly be charged solely with "dealing with problems"?

mike_d 4y ago
My comment was a criticism of the San Francisco subreddit on Reddit, not of Hacker News. The rules are much more freeform over there and the site as a whole is constantly trying to find its balance between mob rule and moderator authoritarianism. In this particular case the SF subreddit moderators want it to reflect an aspirational view of how they want SF as a city to be, and the users tend to want to discuss the city as it is.
- gkoberger 4y ago
  As a moderator of r/sf, that's simply not true. We just want balance.

gkoberger 4y ago

On the flip side, preventing others from crafting a narrative is just as much a part of the job of a mod as anything else. It's a hard balance.