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I work in biotech and as I am sure you know, it is the field where unknown phenomena are the expected norms. So yes, I made peace with not being able to know ev

I work in biotech and as I am sure you know, it is the field where unknown phenomena are the expected norms. So yes, I made peace with not being able to know everything a long time ago. But by the same virtue, it means I can't dismiss anything unless I have concrete evidence against it. It is better to leave rooms for doubts rather than settling with a half-answer and consider it a solved matter. To do so would mean I am either supremely confident in my ability to explain something or I am unable to admit there are things that prove me wrong.

pazimzadeh 4y ago
Agreed. I'm just confused why so many people are pre-facing their comments with some version of "I'm a life-long atheist but I can relate to this story somehow" as if there is a discrepancy between atheism and the article. For the record, I think strong atheism, or the confidence that there is no god or after-life, is just as wrong as being confident that there is. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism
- elzbardico 4y ago
  Oh, thanks for that! As an atheist I always wondered what annoyed me so much in other more vocal and militant atheists. I'd love to believe in God, a superior power, benevolent aliens, re-incarnation, anything! The problem is that I just can't, no matter how much I try.
  - pazimzadeh 4y ago
    And there have probably been people who think like you since the beginning, otherwise the bible wouldn't have to go out of its way to say: > The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good Psalms 14:1
  - XorNot 4y ago
    "strong" atheists are asking you to treat your lack of belief like you'd treat any other thing you don't believe in - i.e. faires, fae, ogres, trolls, Babayanka etc. I don't preface a comment on "those don't exist" by saying "well there's no evidence but..." because very obviously I don't live my life as though there's any probability they exist. "I don't know god exists" is a meaningless statement because the alternative is not binary. You don't believe 'god' exists when you do, you believe a rather specific God exists.
  - dctoedt 4y ago
    > I'd love to believe in God, a superior power, benevolent aliens, re-incarnation, anything! The problem is that I just can't, no matter how much I try. I hope people here don't get tired of my self-cite about how I came around to a sort of agnosto-theism: https://www.questioningchristian.org/2005/05/why_i_call_myse.html https://www.questioningchristian.org/2005/05/why_i_call_myse...
- andrepd 4y ago
  Of course it isn't. Believing there's a kettle orbiting Neptune is infinitely more implausible that believing there isn't, even though there is zero empirical evidence to either position.
XorNot 4y ago
There's a difference between not knowing everything and inventing rather specific alternatives which you declare are valid because "we don't know everything". Not knowing means not knowing. Not "well we don't know so maybe it's...".
- yadingus 4y ago
  It's also not "we don't know so maybe no black swans exist". Knowing and belief are different things too. I don't know for a fact that the tree outside my house is still there when I'm not looking at it, but I believe it will be. These discussions get muddy quickly precisely because sometimes you're arguing thinking that you know what the other person believes, which is a bit of an arrogant assumption, and then you're off having an argument with a specter of your own making.
NovaDudely 4y ago
We have to occasionally remember that as an individual, the thinking part of us is but 6 inches across of jelly. To think that the brain can conceive and understand the entire function of the universe is somewhat laughable. "I used to think that the brain was the most wonderful organ in my body. Then I realized who was telling me this." - Emo Philips

pazimzadeh 4y ago

Agreed. I'm just confused why so many people are pre-facing their comments with some version of "I'm a life-long atheist but I can relate to this story somehow" as if there is a discrepancy between atheism and the article. For the record, I think strong atheism, or the confidence that there is no god or after-life, is just as wrong as being confident that there is. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism

elzbardico 4y ago
Oh, thanks for that! As an atheist I always wondered what annoyed me so much in other more vocal and militant atheists. I'd love to believe in God, a superior power, benevolent aliens, re-incarnation, anything! The problem is that I just can't, no matter how much I try.
- pazimzadeh 4y ago
  And there have probably been people who think like you since the beginning, otherwise the bible wouldn't have to go out of its way to say: > The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good Psalms 14:1
- XorNot 4y ago
  "strong" atheists are asking you to treat your lack of belief like you'd treat any other thing you don't believe in - i.e. faires, fae, ogres, trolls, Babayanka etc. I don't preface a comment on "those don't exist" by saying "well there's no evidence but..." because very obviously I don't live my life as though there's any probability they exist. "I don't know god exists" is a meaningless statement because the alternative is not binary. You don't believe 'god' exists when you do, you believe a rather specific God exists.
- dctoedt 4y ago
  > I'd love to believe in God, a superior power, benevolent aliens, re-incarnation, anything! The problem is that I just can't, no matter how much I try. I hope people here don't get tired of my self-cite about how I came around to a sort of agnosto-theism: https://www.questioningchristian.org/2005/05/why_i_call_myse.html https://www.questioningchristian.org/2005/05/why_i_call_myse...
andrepd 4y ago
Of course it isn't. Believing there's a kettle orbiting Neptune is infinitely more implausible that believing there isn't, even though there is zero empirical evidence to either position.

XorNot 4y ago

There's a difference between not knowing everything and inventing rather specific alternatives which you declare are valid because "we don't know everything". Not knowing means not knowing. Not "well we don't know so maybe it's...".

yadingus 4y ago
It's also not "we don't know so maybe no black swans exist". Knowing and belief are different things too. I don't know for a fact that the tree outside my house is still there when I'm not looking at it, but I believe it will be. These discussions get muddy quickly precisely because sometimes you're arguing thinking that you know what the other person believes, which is a bit of an arrogant assumption, and then you're off having an argument with a specter of your own making.

NovaDudely 4y ago

We have to occasionally remember that as an individual, the thinking part of us is but 6 inches across of jelly. To think that the brain can conceive and understand the entire function of the universe is somewhat laughable. "I used to think that the brain was the most wonderful organ in my body. Then I realized who was telling me this." - Emo Philips