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Joe Eskenazi, the author of this piece, is a solid journalist who helps run the tiny donation-funded Mission Local. They've done incredible reporting on corrupt
by j4pe 3y ago
Joe Eskenazi, the author of this piece, is a solid journalist who helps run the tiny donation-funded Mission Local. They've done incredible reporting on corruption in the SF city government and punch
way above their weight in the stories they break. I have respect for how Joe refused to join in reporting this murder as evidence of a violent crime epidemic, while still reporting on homelessness and property crime.
- kaycebasques 3y agoThey really do some amazing reporting. Based on the fact that this is the first article I'm seeing on this topic, it seems that Mission Local may have got the scoop [1] on the Chronicle and other big newspapers on this high-profile topic. That is a big deal for journalists (if I recall correctly) because it means you're doing better original reporting and you're more connected to the neighborhood. [1] https://grammarist.com/idiom/get-the-scoop/ https://grammarist.com/idiom/get-the-scoop/
- bombcar 3y agoAny small local news organizations will almost ALWAYS get the scoop on the big ones, for local news. Because the vast majority of "big" news things are a division of some conglomerate and just regurgitate Reuters.
- kaycebasques 3y agoThe Chronicle still does a lot of local reporting.
- justizin 3y agoYes and they rushed to cast this tragedy as part of an imagined crime epidemic. There are some good contributors to the Chronicle, but they skew fairly conservative for SF and have for a long time.
- wand3r 3y ago> Imagined crime epidemic Is the SF/Bay Area really having an "imagined" crime epidemic? Serious question. Seems the crime rate is very high
- fdr 3y agoProperty crime has been high for decades. Violent crime moves here and there, but is somewhat unremarkable for an American city.
- throwntoday 3y agoThings are worse than ever and reading comments like this that dismiss it genuinely confuses me. So because other cities have similar or worse crime rates, we should just accept it? Urban decay is happening all across this country and it needs to be addressed aggressively before you or someone you know gets stabbed to death.
- not2b 3y agoAmerican cities almost all have far lower crime these days than they did decades ago, and SF has a significantly lower murder rate than many cities. https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/06/us/san-francisco-crime-bob-lee-killing/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/06/us/san-francisco-crime-bob-le...
- WesternWind 3y agoThings are not worse than ever. Things are slightly worse after the pandemic, but nowhere as bad as the 70's. Feel free to check the statistics. Anyway I agree we need to get aggressive, but a lot of folks thinks that means more cops. We spend a hell of a lot on police, but police don't address the root causes of most crimes. We need to aggressively invest in urban areas with new housing, job opportunities, drug treatment, gang disruption, violence interruption, mental health care, and other meaningful interventions in the cycles and circumstances that lead people to commit crime.
- 3y ago
- emodendroket 3y agoMost local newspapers these day are glorified advertising circulars with maybe one or two reporters they actually employ.
- Loughla 3y agoThe local papers I am familiar with in my region are literally (not figuratively) just re-print houses for prior-approved PR stories from local schools, businesses, and government offices. It's really quite sad.
- JieJie 3y agoThis is great writing, "the abrupt closure of the mid-market Whole Foods, leaving San Franciscans just eight other Whole Foods within city limits". What a scoop, brilliantly delivered.
- kaycebasques 3y agoEdit: I thought that this comment was tangential and sarcastic but I was incorrect.
- gowld 3y agoIt's a quote from the article. You might have missed it. https://missionlocal.org/2023/04/bob-lee-killing-arrest-made-san-francisco/ https://missionlocal.org/2023/04/bob-lee-killing-arrest-made... It's an expression of appreciation for the author's saracastic humor, reporting on the thinness of evidence for anti-SF commentary, a major theme of the OP article.
- kaycebasques 3y agoOK, I totally misunderstood the comment in that case. I have edited my previous comment. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
- gnicholas 3y agoSure, it's a cute jab, but 8 WFs in an entire city is not that many. Even if you have a car, there are large swaths of the city (Richmond, Sunset), where a WF is a bit of a slog during regular traffic (and worse during rush hour). And of course, many city dwellers don't have cars, so having to lug groceries up SF's famously hilly streets is not great for more than a fraction of a mile or so.
- magicalist 3y agoPeople in the Richmond and Sunset have closer Whole Foods than the one that closed.
- 3y ago
- jkestner 3y agoI wish more reporting would have the level of context and data that this piece does, instead of lazily quoting experts with an agenda.
- mkehrt 3y agoI cannot praise Eskenazi highly enough as a reporter.
- okdood64 3y agoYes, I think this was one of the better pieces of journalism I've read recently. It was a breath of fresh air.
- pentagrama 3y agoI'm in doubt if is ethical journalism reveal the name and LinkedIn profile of an alleged killer, sounds like doxing to me.
- sowbug 3y agoArrests sure better be public record in a free country.
- Waterluvian 3y agoIt’s fundamental to the principles of habeas corpus that the overwhelming power of the government to arrest, prosecute, and imprison someone be wielded in broad daylight.
- anonymouskimmer 3y agoNot everyone needs to know for habeas corpus to work. Narrow lamplight can be just as efficacious.
- bialpio 3y agoThere's also presumption of innocence so publishing personal info of someone not convicted is akin to doxxing to me. Edit: typos.
- AlgorithmicTime 3y ago[dead]
- iudqnolq 3y agoThe UK is a good example of a generally* similarly free country without guaranteed public access to arrest records. This balances the potential benefit to the public from knowing against the definite harm to the accused. (*There are definitely significant ways each is less free than the other and there's no rigorous way to say which is worse)
- jeffbee 3y agoMission Local is great. We are blessed with a wealth of local journalism like Mission Local, Cityside, even SF Standard if I hold my nose about the fact that it is controlled by a reactionary political movement. It is why I never understood the whining about "support your local newspaper". There's no chance of me ever subscribing to the Chronicle. I donate to these other, better news outlets instead.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- biomcgary 3y agoI have not heard of the SF Standard (I'm not in CA). You seem to value SF Standard (at some level) even while disagreeing with underlying political stances. That juxtaposition seem unfortunately rare in the current era, could you expand on what value they create (for you)?
- jeffbee 3y agoSF Standard does not seem to have an overt reporting bias. So far I find their articles informative. But they are 100% funded by a PAC the agenda of which I do not fully embrace.
- shuckles 3y agoSF Standard has some of the city’s best journalists on staff, and you’d be hard pressed to identify how Moritz is influencing their coverage decisions.
- johnea 3y agoYep, just more proof that San Fransisco is overrun with the criminal wealthy...
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- say_it_as_it_is 3y agoJoe Eskenazi shared the identity of the alleged killer, potentially ruining the life/career of someone who may not have killed Bob.
- etc-hosts 3y agoLooks like the SFPD waited a while to verify a possible narrative of what they believe happened before making an arrest. If it's all made up, that would be amazing. Doubtful.
- paulgb 3y agoEh, there’s a reason we have a system where the accused has the right to make their case in court. An arrest is a strong signal but by design has a lower burden of proof than it takes to punish someone within the system. Given that being publicly accused of a heinous crime can do irreparable damage in the age of Google even if ultimately acquitted, I'd rather err on the side of caution here.
- phendrenad2 3y agoI don't think hiding the names of accused suspects is realistic. Instead, we should try to educate the public and remind them that people are still innocent until proven guilty.
- dang 3y agoThat's standard practice isn't it? If you get arrested for a newsworthy crime, the news will say your name while saying "alleged" to make it clear you haven't been convicted yet.
- Aloisius 3y agoThe jail shared it. It's a public record.
- timbob53 3y ago[flagged]
- lazyasciiart 3y agoIf you find it difficult to recognize a solid journalist in someone who uses language in a standard way that you dislike, that would be a problem with your own ability to exercise judgment.
- kcplate 3y ago[flagged]
- roundandround 3y ago> But the city’s violent crime rate is at a near-historic low, and is lower than most mid-to-large-sized cities. Wow, more evidence that this is a city in the US?
- kcplate 3y agoI have walked around my city in the US for decades and can count on one hand the number of times, I have seen crime happen live and in person on our streets. In a recent single trip to SF that was just a few days, I can say I saw perhaps a half dozen active crimes. Also of note, i have seen public urination only once here, but saw it twice in between the airport and my hotel in SF. Live where ya want and how you want, but let’s not pretend SF is no different than other places in the US. It is, and frankly it’s shocking and blows my mind that people pretend it’s normal.
- roundandround 3y agoOf course SF isn't normal it is the archetype for the city as an insane asylum created by Reaganomics. But it seems SF shows that has nothing to do with the epidemic of murder in the US or it is least prevalent in leftist cities that decided to take over federal responsibilities that Reagan stopped honoring in a rather odd way. Trying to make everything you can call one word one horrible new problem doesn't solve something. It makes people think there is some hopeless complex problem instead of many separate cause and effect incidents for unrelated things.
- Pils 3y agoThe current CEO of YCombinator regarding an article in Mission Local a few days ago: Mission Local seems to serve their local bureaucratic masters over the basic public safety needs of the people. [0] This is gaslighting. You should be ashamed. [1] In this case they are “independent” of a sort [2] In all fairness, he did retweet this article a couple hours ago. [0] https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644520924828540929?s=20 https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644520924828540929?s=20 [1] https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644510807060021249?s=20 https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644510807060021249?s=20 [2] https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644535178856124418?s=20 https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644535178856124418?s=20
- rideontime 3y agoIn all fairness, I’ll be impressed when he posts a retraction and apology.
- phone8675309 3y agoDon't hold your breath.
- rideontime 3y agoOf course, I know better. He's too cowardly to come out and say what he's feeling, but just take a look at his likes from today. Apparently he thinks that journalist should be jailed for embarrassing him. https://twitter.com/garrytan/likes https://twitter.com/garrytan/likes
- ipqk 3y agoHoly crap, I went through his likes today, and he's just a fucking awful person. I should probably get off hacker news and stop supporting this guy's company.
- ginger2016 3y agoI concur! He should apologize.
- asdfman123 3y agoIf you like this article, think about subscribing to them. Lots of little papers like this seem healthy and then unceremoniously go out of business because they don't make enough money in ad revenue to pay their journalists like 45k/yr. That's not a typo: that's how much Bay Area reporters make. Support local journalism!
- throwaway894345 3y agoI don’t know anything about Mission Local, but reading of the article prior to reading your comment left me with the impression that the author was really invested in this being a targeted killing. The first part of the article started strong, and then it felt like the author was grinding a political axe, though I’m sure it’s in response to other articles grinding different axes. It was a well-written article to be sure, but I guess I’ve grown weary of motivated journalism.
- not2b 3y agoLooks like the author had very good reason to think that this was a targeted killing, as in, if the suspect did it it was a targeted killing. Jumping to the conclusion that some homeless guy or street thug did it, without any evidence, is also something that people with axes to grind do on a regular basis.
- throwaway894345 3y agoI’m not disputing that the killing was targeted; like I said, the first part of the article (which had already expressed the targeted nature pretty clearly) was solid. It was the subsequent axe grinding that I took issue with.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]