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Google will shut down Dropcam and Nest Secure in 2024

101 points by turtlegrids 4y ago

kotaKat 4y ago
"We will be contacting eligible Nest Secure customers on Friday with an exclusive offer for a complimentary next-generation security system from ADT (up to $485 value), or $200 to use on the Google Store." Does anyone willingly want to go ADT? Home of the three year contract, the long-winded-drawn-out cancellation processes, the constant door-knocking and chasing down to sign up for service, the constant glut of fees and charges when things go wrong...
- AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
  I'm definitely among the unwilling. I'm using nest secure now, anyone have any suggestions for a replacement? At least they aren't killing my smoke alarms, though, they still can't automatically dispatch fire/police if there is smoke/fire, though they will dispatch if an alarm is triggered.
  - kotaKat 4y ago
    Personally if I have to go into an 'alarm' ecosystem I'd go with Alarm.com if you're serious about paying for monitoring. My favorite vendor is https://suretyhome.com/ https://suretyhome.com/ - they have reasonable costs to get an alarm panel running with monitoring and all the normal integrations. (I personally use an older Honeywell Vista security system that's been integrated into ADC via a communicator. The sky's the limit!)
    - jonathankoren 4y ago
      Is alarm.com just a vendor for other providers like Brinks?
      - kotaKat 4y ago
        They do, yes. Some equipment Brinks and ADT sells also is part of the ADC ecosystem, but is restricted to only those vendors. Any other alarm.com gear is generally fair game as long as it's been released from any account it's on from any monitoring company.
    - throwaway19423 4y ago
      I am effectively a customer of alarm.com but not sure how. They seem to be a bundler or backend provider (sort of like a service OEM) for various branded alarm systems. Is there any technical material that explains what they do, and provides more visibility into the ecosystem?
  - azinman2 4y ago
    I’m surprised this space isn’t better disrupted. They all aren’t that great, even the new comers. Either they don’t have wide product coverage, only work with certain assistants / apps, are ugly, terrible UX, etc. As much as I don’t think it’s that great, Ring seems to be the best of the bunch now.
    - jonathankoren 4y ago
      It’s a good enough product with recurring subscription revenue. There’s zero reason to innovate. Everything is a cost, and it’s unclear that customers actually want “better”.
    - phpisthebest 4y ago
      Security and more importantly Fire Alarm has ALOT more regulations and liablity than just a simple Automation to turn on the lights... That is why you do not see as much activity in Security or Fire Alarms as you to other Home Automation, and most likely why Google went with ADT instead of rolling their own with Nest... Someone in legal look at that and said "Yea lets let ADT lawyers deal with that"
      - azinman2 4y ago
        Ring offers this, and my understanding was previously Nest did too? I don’t think it’s as big a legal minefield as you suggest. You just need the right integrations in place, and as you said, figure out the regulations (often at a county level). But it’d a solvable problem. My guess is that this business is very sticky so it’s hard to get new people started… plus you’re making a lot of SKUs in hardware that you need to keep in inventory, software up to date, once you buy the hardware you don’t upgrade it, it’s not very sexy, etc.
        phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>I don’t think it’s as big a legal minefield as you suggest. That minefield is a 3 legged stool 1. Actual Legal Liability 2. Perceived Legal Liability 3. PR Liability around the law / legal system #1 is probably not very big, however if you put a smoke alarm in someones home that does not work correctly or perceived to not work correctly and your a name like Google that the media loves to report on... well #2 and #3 become HUGE. law suits will be filled, and even if you "win" in actual court, the court of public opinion will not be favorable
  - zacharyvoase 4y ago
    Fortunately I never had to rely on it, but Simplisafe was super easy to set up, and had a nice app/interface/customer support.
  - WirelessGigabit 4y ago
    I wonder how many false alarms the fire department would get if they get dispatched every time a smoke alarm goes off. And I'm one of the guilty ones. Well, the apartment I live at is. Its range hood is one of those things that even after putting in brand new filters and extensive cleaning barely performs better as one of those fake ones at Ikea. Same with the bathroom fan. When you turn it on it's loud, but it just circulates air. So I open the door. But that sets of the smoke alarm in the hallway...
    - dylan604 4y ago
      What are you doing in the bathroom that sets off a smoke alarm?
      - WirelessGigabit 4y ago
        Hot shower = steam, which triggers a smoke detector! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuAeaIcAXtg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuAeaIcAXtg
  - phpisthebest 4y ago
    Roll your own Self Hosted Solution, Either Buy DSC Wired Gear yourself[1] and install it (hard) or do a "less secure" wireless system using HomeAssistance and Zigbee or Zwave devices. [1]https://www.level1techs.com/video/better-iot-dsc-alarms-whome-assistant-home-automation https://www.level1techs.com/video/better-iot-dsc-alarms-whom...
    - kotaKat 4y ago
      Don't forget you can add an AlarmDecoder to a DSC (or Honeywell Vista) system! https://www.alarmdecoder.com/ https://www.alarmdecoder.com/ It basically sits on the keypad bus of the system and emulates a normal keypad, so you can integrate it into whatever applications you want like HomeKit, or as my colleagues did, a fully homespun bespoke home automation suite in .NET.
      - thedougd 4y ago
        DSC has a serial port option that accepts all their commands and offers virtual keypad functions. There are also third party option networked options that speak the same protocol.
    - thedougd 4y ago
      I highly recommend Alarm Relay for monitoring a traditional system. $120 a year or so.
- LeoPanthera 4y ago
  It's not just ADT. We finally managed to escape from a contract with Brinks, after Brinks bought our previous provider, Livewatch, a few years ago. It was hell, and in the end they made us sign a bunch of shit via docusign (!), and even then you're forced to pay for 30 days more service while they bombard you with scaremails. Never again.
  - kotaKat 4y ago
    ADT, Brinks, and Vivint are the three shitty horsemen of the home security industry.
    - phpisthebest 4y ago
      Surely there has to be a forth company....
      - louky 4y ago
        Simplysafe. At least their you can't disable their current generation of alarms with a $3 transmitter. Criminally negligent but oh well.
      - LeoPanthera 4y ago
        We have switched to "Abode". Fingers crossed...
- kabdib 4y ago
  ADT is garbage. I canceled ADT service about 15 years ago. For the next few years they were mailing open-air ads to my address asking me to reconnect the alarm system. I managed to reach someone in their C-suite, who told me directly that they were unconcerned about that type of privacy data being made available to anyone who happened to read a literal postcard.
  - vuln 4y ago
    Duh. How else are they going to fear monger you into reconnecting. “Look everyone knows you no longer have an alarm, or alarm service”
- jimbobimbo 4y ago
  The best part of ADT is when the sales guy spends an hour face-to-face with you and you learn about 3-year commitment next day, from the installer guy, who (wisely) asks whether you are aware of 3-year commitment before wiring anything.
  - louky 4y ago
    I installed a Mormon-owned alarm years ago (Pinnacle) and the division of sales/installers was stark. I didn't last long because is was so scummy. I was hired off craigslist and didn't even realize they were all Mormon at first. The Circle meetings, "The Wives" being always there but not working was really bizarre. I just couldn't take the lies the salesmen told regularly. Weirdest gig/contract I ever had. Many customers were shocked when I told them what they actually signed a contract for.
- j45 4y ago
  It's wise to closely review and avoid the marketing of companies selling old infrastructure repackaged as new. Security companies are looking for new lines of revenue. Telcos, and cable companies will often private label existing solutions that are made for enterprise (B2E) and not really meant for B2C as well, let alone B2B (small business) You would be better off finding something like Home Assistant and stumbling through connecting something together.
- ubermonkey 4y ago
  Wow, sounds like they've gotten pretty shitty. I've been using ADT for 26 years, and in my current home for 23. I have had no issues with them, and have found them responsive when alarms happen or equipment needed to be replaced. OTOH, some pals have a Simplisafe setup and it's been a darkly hilarious saga of nonfunctional sensors, false alarms, and ongoing chicanery.
zmk5 4y ago
With the news that they are shutting down the Google assistant smart displays, the best thing you can do now is just not have smart devices like these in your house or just use Home assistant. They're just waiting to go to the landfill.
- minhazm 4y ago
  They're cutting off software updates for third party displays. Their own displays will continue to be supported... for now.
  - rio517 4y ago
    Imagine being one of the companies impacted by this. It becomes a lesson in not partnering with Google.
- tracker1 4y ago
  Yeah... as much as I wouldn't mind doing more "smart home" stuff, I absolutely won't as I don't trust anything to be supported for a decade or more, which is where I consider home stuff should be.
- thatoneguy 4y ago
  Generally speaking, I no longer buy any device that requires a smartphone app or otherwise not built into the device itself.
philprx 4y ago
"Google, the finest place where startups and products go to die" ;-)
- geodel 4y ago
  Earth, the finest place where all living things born to die.
- kamray23 4y ago
  Honestly, how many surviving Google products were developed at Google instead of outside it and then got absorbed by it at some point? They keep absorbing working startups and often killing their products to work on new products, only for those products to always be incredibly niche and never survive more than half a decade or so. Basically only the actual business-oriented ones, with anything consumer-facing shutting down fairly quickly. God, G+ was bad though.
  - nvy 4y ago
    G+ had a good idea at its core, though. Facebook lost its appeal for 24-year-old me as soon as all my random aunts and uncles were on there posting boomer memes and commenting on photos of me at a kegger, or whatever dumb stuff I was getting photographed doing back then. The "Circles" feature was a nice way to address that in theory, but the execution was really half-baked and the network effect didn't help them.
    - tracker1 4y ago
      Yeah, I actually really liked G+... it was a nicer experience for technical follows, etc. Twitter is a firehose and you can only effectively sample a little of it. Facebook is just a mess, I think the groups feature is somewhat nice, but other than that, it's chaotic. They're all trying to compete in wierd ways and making them all less useful. Mastadon seems interresting, but frankly I'd rather go back to IRC, and see some useful extensions to /whois details for better interconnectivity and profiles, but not so closed and walled garden as slack. Aside, I do still use irc for programming and bbs related stuff.
cptcobalt 4y ago
Another day, another google death https://killedbygoogle.com/ https://killedbygoogle.com/ With this track record I never plan on using a new google product. Now, I will immediately stop using or sell anything I have that is acquired by google. It seems like they're only capable of leaving a trail of corpses of past good ideas.
- GalenErso 4y ago
  Until the prophecy is fulfilled and Google voluntarily shuts itself down, in the ultimate twist of irony.
- dylan604 4y ago
  >I will immediately stop using or sell anything I have that is acquired by google. This is the crux though. You could be totally satisfied with a non-Googly product, but suddenly become a Googly user when Googs buys the successful company. I feel this way about Amazon buying the Roomba company.
- Takennickname 4y ago
  These aren't even good ideas. They're acquisitions. They could have been totally fine, profitable companies on their own.
  - jeffbee 4y ago
    > They could have been totally fine, profitable companies on their own. Very, very unlikely. The business model was an illusion.
- codemac 4y ago
  They haven't released a Dropcam in 8 years? "Nest Secure" was cancelled in 2020.. and now they're saying "hey, we'll actually turn things off in 2024" I think the reason killedbygoogle.com actually exists is because they try to be professional about notifying folks of things they are EoL, and communicate updates along the way.
  - 4y ago
diogenescynic 4y ago
Well this stinks. Guess I will think twice about ever giving money to Google again. The run has been pulled out from under me by Google enough times to consider them worth avoiding.
kccqzy 4y ago
Considering that Dropcam came out in 2012, (and the Pro version in 2013) I think this is actually good enough. We don't expect IoT devices from other brands to be working forever either. Not even Apple supports their devices for that long. Google just gets a lot of hate on HN but this isn't anything deserving that much hate. The article kind of made the same point: > Google previously committed to supporting Nest products for at least five years, and it did meet that standard. If you’ve been holding onto a Dropcam for more than a decade, it’s hard to argue that you didn’t get your money’s worth
- crooked-v 4y ago
  The objection isn't that they're dropping support for specific older devices... it's that they're dropping support for the entire platform, including Nest cameras that are still on sale right now.
- greycol 4y ago
  The major issue is we know the minimal least effort steps involved to keep these things working aren't hard. Release a firmware update that updates the device to only point to ips/domains in the private range as it's new control/update/whatever server and update any security certs to a new releasable one. Then open source the server software if not still in use, or roll back the firmware the x number of years to the point were the requirements to maintain the device started diverging and release that version of the updated old firmware/old server source. There's no ongoing cost to the company and people can continue to use their devices if they wish to put in the effort to maintain it. I mean I'm not up in arms about this case, but it's such a common story about how device/software is no longer usable because finance wants to turn off a server that it should be SOP in every sunset plan. I'd go so far as saying it should be regulated as the minimum.
  - thatoneguy 4y ago
    Since you probably haven't worked at Google, this sort of thing is what many googlers have wanted since at least the closure of Google Reader. But executives and engineers won't get promoted doing anything but launching products, so it never happens. Also, normal companies would just sell off the tech to someone else or even just spin off a new company that would manage everything but again, no one would get promoted so it doesn't happen.
rconti 4y ago
> Now that it’s dropping Dropcam and Nest Secure, the Nest Protect smart smoke alarms are the only Nest App-only devices left Wait, what does this mean? Does this mean my Nest thermostat has... another app I can use? I mean, the Nest app is a dumpster fire of deferred features. The only reason I know it's been touched in the past 9 years is because the app was updated to work full-screen on the iPhone X.
- rconti 4y ago
  To reply to myself, this is some fantastic word soup, but it looks like I can use the Google app? Or the Home app? Possibly they're different things? It'll be fascinating to see if I can do fancy modern high tech thermostat things like... override a schedule. >Once you add your Google Nest thermostat to the Home or Nest app, you can easily control it even when you're not at home. > The Nest Thermostat can only be controlled with the Home app. > You can control the Nest Learning Thermostat and Nest Thermostat E with the Home app after you migrate your Nest Account to a Google Account. > The Nest app also offers full control and settings for the Nest Learning Thermostat and Nest Thermostat E.
  - enjo 4y ago
    It's the Google Home app. Hopefully they'll invest in the interface quite a bit over the coming year but it does a good job of managing all of the devices in my home right now. So this isn't a huge issue. The weird problem of having both the Nest app and Google Home has always been really weird.
    - rconti 4y ago
      It looks like you have to migrate your Nest to the Google Home app in order to control schedules in Google Home. (As it is now, I can change the current temp as a one-off, or do voice control, but I can't change schedules). Unfortunately, it sounds like the scheduling is just as simplistic and featureless as the scheduling in the native Nest app. (Eg, manually set up each day, with basic copy+paste functionality (probably), no overrides, no ability to do anything different from week to week). So, I probably won't risk the migration.
bdcravens 4y ago
When I was weighing Ring vs Nest security systems, I'm glad I went with Ring.
gnicholas 4y ago
Does anyone know of the devices will work even locally? That would provide some value, though of course most of the value is in remote notifications and status availability. Separately, is there any chance that folks here might be able to come up with something like Rebble to give these devices life into the future? I have a lot of sensors and hate to think this will go completely to waste! UPDATE: If these will still run locally (like they can now when my wifi is down), then I'd probably buy a HomePod Mini and train it on the Nest's alarm sound for use with the Sound Detection feature. [1] I first heard of this feature at an Apple presentation at the CSUN Assistive Technology conference and thought it sounded really useful. Although it wouldn't let me know what door/window was opened, it would at least send an alert to my phone so that I would know to look into things further. 1: https://www.macrumors.com/2023/01/18/homepod-sound-recognition-software-update/ https://www.macrumors.com/2023/01/18/homepod-sound-recogniti...
tracker1 4y ago
They likely won't... but would really appreciate if, when hardware vendors EOL their products they'd release schema diagrams and protocol documentation. There's no reason you shouldn't get at LEAST a decade out of these. It's the main thing that has kept me from any kind of "smart home" integration at all. I wound up going with a security package from my cable company (kind of crappy cameras, tbh), but I'm not thinking in terms of ownership at this level. In the end, it's just disappointing in general how much churn there is in the tech space. Similarly, I'm not going to buy a fridge, or washing machine with a built in tablet, when they stop receiving updates in under a year usually. It's just really crappy as a race to the bottom. Either start with a rental/subscription model, or be prepared to maintain the product for a decade. Homes and cars aren't churned like phones.
- gnicholas 4y ago
  Yep, Rebble kept my Pebble running for many years after the company was bought. I finally gave up on it because the battery life got so short, and I don't trust myself to repair it decently. I loved that thing, and I'm so glad it was able to live beyond the acquisition of the company! Hopefully someone can figure out a way to do something similar for these devices.
1letterunixname 4y ago
And all of your cloud hardware investments will be worth nothing
squokko 4y ago
At this point, people who buy stuff from Google deserve what comes to them.

101 points by turtlegrids 4y ago

"We will be contacting eligible Nest Secure customers on Friday with an exclusive offer for a complimentary next-generation security system from ADT (up to $485 value), or $200 to use on the Google Store." Does anyone willingly want to go ADT? Home of the three year contract, the long-winded-drawn-out cancellation processes, the constant door-knocking and chasing down to sign up for service, the constant glut of fees and charges when things go wrong...

AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
I'm definitely among the unwilling. I'm using nest secure now, anyone have any suggestions for a replacement? At least they aren't killing my smoke alarms, though, they still can't automatically dispatch fire/police if there is smoke/fire, though they will dispatch if an alarm is triggered.
- kotaKat 4y ago
  Personally if I have to go into an 'alarm' ecosystem I'd go with Alarm.com if you're serious about paying for monitoring. My favorite vendor is https://suretyhome.com/ https://suretyhome.com/ - they have reasonable costs to get an alarm panel running with monitoring and all the normal integrations. (I personally use an older Honeywell Vista security system that's been integrated into ADC via a communicator. The sky's the limit!)
  - jonathankoren 4y ago
    Is alarm.com just a vendor for other providers like Brinks?
    - kotaKat 4y ago
      They do, yes. Some equipment Brinks and ADT sells also is part of the ADC ecosystem, but is restricted to only those vendors. Any other alarm.com gear is generally fair game as long as it's been released from any account it's on from any monitoring company.
  - throwaway19423 4y ago
    I am effectively a customer of alarm.com but not sure how. They seem to be a bundler or backend provider (sort of like a service OEM) for various branded alarm systems. Is there any technical material that explains what they do, and provides more visibility into the ecosystem?
- azinman2 4y ago
  I’m surprised this space isn’t better disrupted. They all aren’t that great, even the new comers. Either they don’t have wide product coverage, only work with certain assistants / apps, are ugly, terrible UX, etc. As much as I don’t think it’s that great, Ring seems to be the best of the bunch now.
  - jonathankoren 4y ago
    It’s a good enough product with recurring subscription revenue. There’s zero reason to innovate. Everything is a cost, and it’s unclear that customers actually want “better”.
  - phpisthebest 4y ago
    Security and more importantly Fire Alarm has ALOT more regulations and liablity than just a simple Automation to turn on the lights... That is why you do not see as much activity in Security or Fire Alarms as you to other Home Automation, and most likely why Google went with ADT instead of rolling their own with Nest... Someone in legal look at that and said "Yea lets let ADT lawyers deal with that"
    - azinman2 4y ago
      Ring offers this, and my understanding was previously Nest did too? I don’t think it’s as big a legal minefield as you suggest. You just need the right integrations in place, and as you said, figure out the regulations (often at a county level). But it’d a solvable problem. My guess is that this business is very sticky so it’s hard to get new people started… plus you’re making a lot of SKUs in hardware that you need to keep in inventory, software up to date, once you buy the hardware you don’t upgrade it, it’s not very sexy, etc.
      - phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>I don’t think it’s as big a legal minefield as you suggest. That minefield is a 3 legged stool 1. Actual Legal Liability 2. Perceived Legal Liability 3. PR Liability around the law / legal system #1 is probably not very big, however if you put a smoke alarm in someones home that does not work correctly or perceived to not work correctly and your a name like Google that the media loves to report on... well #2 and #3 become HUGE. law suits will be filled, and even if you "win" in actual court, the court of public opinion will not be favorable
- zacharyvoase 4y ago
  Fortunately I never had to rely on it, but Simplisafe was super easy to set up, and had a nice app/interface/customer support.
- WirelessGigabit 4y ago
  I wonder how many false alarms the fire department would get if they get dispatched every time a smoke alarm goes off. And I'm one of the guilty ones. Well, the apartment I live at is. Its range hood is one of those things that even after putting in brand new filters and extensive cleaning barely performs better as one of those fake ones at Ikea. Same with the bathroom fan. When you turn it on it's loud, but it just circulates air. So I open the door. But that sets of the smoke alarm in the hallway...
  - dylan604 4y ago
    What are you doing in the bathroom that sets off a smoke alarm?
    - WirelessGigabit 4y ago
      Hot shower = steam, which triggers a smoke detector! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuAeaIcAXtg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuAeaIcAXtg
- phpisthebest 4y ago
  Roll your own Self Hosted Solution, Either Buy DSC Wired Gear yourself[1] and install it (hard) or do a "less secure" wireless system using HomeAssistance and Zigbee or Zwave devices. [1]https://www.level1techs.com/video/better-iot-dsc-alarms-whome-assistant-home-automation https://www.level1techs.com/video/better-iot-dsc-alarms-whom...
  - kotaKat 4y ago
    Don't forget you can add an AlarmDecoder to a DSC (or Honeywell Vista) system! https://www.alarmdecoder.com/ https://www.alarmdecoder.com/ It basically sits on the keypad bus of the system and emulates a normal keypad, so you can integrate it into whatever applications you want like HomeKit, or as my colleagues did, a fully homespun bespoke home automation suite in .NET.
    - thedougd 4y ago
      DSC has a serial port option that accepts all their commands and offers virtual keypad functions. There are also third party option networked options that speak the same protocol.
  - thedougd 4y ago
    I highly recommend Alarm Relay for monitoring a traditional system. $120 a year or so.
LeoPanthera 4y ago
It's not just ADT. We finally managed to escape from a contract with Brinks, after Brinks bought our previous provider, Livewatch, a few years ago. It was hell, and in the end they made us sign a bunch of shit via docusign (!), and even then you're forced to pay for 30 days more service while they bombard you with scaremails. Never again.
- kotaKat 4y ago
  ADT, Brinks, and Vivint are the three shitty horsemen of the home security industry.
  - phpisthebest 4y ago
    Surely there has to be a forth company....
    - louky 4y ago
      Simplysafe. At least their you can't disable their current generation of alarms with a $3 transmitter. Criminally negligent but oh well.
    - LeoPanthera 4y ago
      We have switched to "Abode". Fingers crossed...
kabdib 4y ago
ADT is garbage. I canceled ADT service about 15 years ago. For the next few years they were mailing open-air ads to my address asking me to reconnect the alarm system. I managed to reach someone in their C-suite, who told me directly that they were unconcerned about that type of privacy data being made available to anyone who happened to read a literal postcard.
- vuln 4y ago
  Duh. How else are they going to fear monger you into reconnecting. “Look everyone knows you no longer have an alarm, or alarm service”
jimbobimbo 4y ago
The best part of ADT is when the sales guy spends an hour face-to-face with you and you learn about 3-year commitment next day, from the installer guy, who (wisely) asks whether you are aware of 3-year commitment before wiring anything.
- louky 4y ago
  I installed a Mormon-owned alarm years ago (Pinnacle) and the division of sales/installers was stark. I didn't last long because is was so scummy. I was hired off craigslist and didn't even realize they were all Mormon at first. The Circle meetings, "The Wives" being always there but not working was really bizarre. I just couldn't take the lies the salesmen told regularly. Weirdest gig/contract I ever had. Many customers were shocked when I told them what they actually signed a contract for.
j45 4y ago
It's wise to closely review and avoid the marketing of companies selling old infrastructure repackaged as new. Security companies are looking for new lines of revenue. Telcos, and cable companies will often private label existing solutions that are made for enterprise (B2E) and not really meant for B2C as well, let alone B2B (small business) You would be better off finding something like Home Assistant and stumbling through connecting something together.
ubermonkey 4y ago
Wow, sounds like they've gotten pretty shitty. I've been using ADT for 26 years, and in my current home for 23. I have had no issues with them, and have found them responsive when alarms happen or equipment needed to be replaced. OTOH, some pals have a Simplisafe setup and it's been a darkly hilarious saga of nonfunctional sensors, false alarms, and ongoing chicanery.

zmk5 4y ago

With the news that they are shutting down the Google assistant smart displays, the best thing you can do now is just not have smart devices like these in your house or just use Home assistant. They're just waiting to go to the landfill.

minhazm 4y ago
They're cutting off software updates for third party displays. Their own displays will continue to be supported... for now.
- rio517 4y ago
  Imagine being one of the companies impacted by this. It becomes a lesson in not partnering with Google.
tracker1 4y ago
Yeah... as much as I wouldn't mind doing more "smart home" stuff, I absolutely won't as I don't trust anything to be supported for a decade or more, which is where I consider home stuff should be.
thatoneguy 4y ago
Generally speaking, I no longer buy any device that requires a smartphone app or otherwise not built into the device itself.

philprx 4y ago

"Google, the finest place where startups and products go to die" ;-)

geodel 4y ago
Earth, the finest place where all living things born to die.
kamray23 4y ago
Honestly, how many surviving Google products were developed at Google instead of outside it and then got absorbed by it at some point? They keep absorbing working startups and often killing their products to work on new products, only for those products to always be incredibly niche and never survive more than half a decade or so. Basically only the actual business-oriented ones, with anything consumer-facing shutting down fairly quickly. God, G+ was bad though.
- nvy 4y ago
  G+ had a good idea at its core, though. Facebook lost its appeal for 24-year-old me as soon as all my random aunts and uncles were on there posting boomer memes and commenting on photos of me at a kegger, or whatever dumb stuff I was getting photographed doing back then. The "Circles" feature was a nice way to address that in theory, but the execution was really half-baked and the network effect didn't help them.
  - tracker1 4y ago
    Yeah, I actually really liked G+... it was a nicer experience for technical follows, etc. Twitter is a firehose and you can only effectively sample a little of it. Facebook is just a mess, I think the groups feature is somewhat nice, but other than that, it's chaotic. They're all trying to compete in wierd ways and making them all less useful. Mastadon seems interresting, but frankly I'd rather go back to IRC, and see some useful extensions to /whois details for better interconnectivity and profiles, but not so closed and walled garden as slack. Aside, I do still use irc for programming and bbs related stuff.

cptcobalt 4y ago

Another day, another google death https://killedbygoogle.com/ https://killedbygoogle.com/ With this track record I never plan on using a new google product. Now, I will immediately stop using or sell anything I have that is acquired by google. It seems like they're only capable of leaving a trail of corpses of past good ideas.

GalenErso 4y ago
Until the prophecy is fulfilled and Google voluntarily shuts itself down, in the ultimate twist of irony.
dylan604 4y ago
>I will immediately stop using or sell anything I have that is acquired by google. This is the crux though. You could be totally satisfied with a non-Googly product, but suddenly become a Googly user when Googs buys the successful company. I feel this way about Amazon buying the Roomba company.
Takennickname 4y ago
These aren't even good ideas. They're acquisitions. They could have been totally fine, profitable companies on their own.
- jeffbee 4y ago
  > They could have been totally fine, profitable companies on their own. Very, very unlikely. The business model was an illusion.
codemac 4y ago
They haven't released a Dropcam in 8 years? "Nest Secure" was cancelled in 2020.. and now they're saying "hey, we'll actually turn things off in 2024" I think the reason killedbygoogle.com actually exists is because they try to be professional about notifying folks of things they are EoL, and communicate updates along the way.
- 4y ago

diogenescynic 4y ago

Well this stinks. Guess I will think twice about ever giving money to Google again. The run has been pulled out from under me by Google enough times to consider them worth avoiding.

kccqzy 4y ago

Considering that Dropcam came out in 2012, (and the Pro version in 2013) I think this is actually good enough. We don't expect IoT devices from other brands to be working forever either. Not even Apple supports their devices for that long. Google just gets a lot of hate on HN but this isn't anything deserving that much hate. The article kind of made the same point: > Google previously committed to supporting Nest products for at least five years, and it did meet that standard. If you’ve been holding onto a Dropcam for more than a decade, it’s hard to argue that you didn’t get your money’s worth

crooked-v 4y ago
The objection isn't that they're dropping support for specific older devices... it's that they're dropping support for the entire platform, including Nest cameras that are still on sale right now.
greycol 4y ago
The major issue is we know the minimal least effort steps involved to keep these things working aren't hard. Release a firmware update that updates the device to only point to ips/domains in the private range as it's new control/update/whatever server and update any security certs to a new releasable one. Then open source the server software if not still in use, or roll back the firmware the x number of years to the point were the requirements to maintain the device started diverging and release that version of the updated old firmware/old server source. There's no ongoing cost to the company and people can continue to use their devices if they wish to put in the effort to maintain it. I mean I'm not up in arms about this case, but it's such a common story about how device/software is no longer usable because finance wants to turn off a server that it should be SOP in every sunset plan. I'd go so far as saying it should be regulated as the minimum.
- thatoneguy 4y ago
  Since you probably haven't worked at Google, this sort of thing is what many googlers have wanted since at least the closure of Google Reader. But executives and engineers won't get promoted doing anything but launching products, so it never happens. Also, normal companies would just sell off the tech to someone else or even just spin off a new company that would manage everything but again, no one would get promoted so it doesn't happen.

rconti 4y ago

> Now that it’s dropping Dropcam and Nest Secure, the Nest Protect smart smoke alarms are the only Nest App-only devices left Wait, what does this mean? Does this mean my Nest thermostat has... another app I can use? I mean, the Nest app is a dumpster fire of deferred features. The only reason I know it's been touched in the past 9 years is because the app was updated to work full-screen on the iPhone X.

rconti 4y ago
To reply to myself, this is some fantastic word soup, but it looks like I can use the Google app? Or the Home app? Possibly they're different things? It'll be fascinating to see if I can do fancy modern high tech thermostat things like... override a schedule. >Once you add your Google Nest thermostat to the Home or Nest app, you can easily control it even when you're not at home. > The Nest Thermostat can only be controlled with the Home app. > You can control the Nest Learning Thermostat and Nest Thermostat E with the Home app after you migrate your Nest Account to a Google Account. > The Nest app also offers full control and settings for the Nest Learning Thermostat and Nest Thermostat E.
- enjo 4y ago
  It's the Google Home app. Hopefully they'll invest in the interface quite a bit over the coming year but it does a good job of managing all of the devices in my home right now. So this isn't a huge issue. The weird problem of having both the Nest app and Google Home has always been really weird.
  - rconti 4y ago
    It looks like you have to migrate your Nest to the Google Home app in order to control schedules in Google Home. (As it is now, I can change the current temp as a one-off, or do voice control, but I can't change schedules). Unfortunately, it sounds like the scheduling is just as simplistic and featureless as the scheduling in the native Nest app. (Eg, manually set up each day, with basic copy+paste functionality (probably), no overrides, no ability to do anything different from week to week). So, I probably won't risk the migration.

bdcravens 4y ago

When I was weighing Ring vs Nest security systems, I'm glad I went with Ring.

gnicholas 4y ago

Does anyone know of the devices will work even locally? That would provide some value, though of course most of the value is in remote notifications and status availability. Separately, is there any chance that folks here might be able to come up with something like Rebble to give these devices life into the future? I have a lot of sensors and hate to think this will go completely to waste! UPDATE: If these will still run locally (like they can now when my wifi is down), then I'd probably buy a HomePod Mini and train it on the Nest's alarm sound for use with the Sound Detection feature. [1] I first heard of this feature at an Apple presentation at the CSUN Assistive Technology conference and thought it sounded really useful. Although it wouldn't let me know what door/window was opened, it would at least send an alert to my phone so that I would know to look into things further. 1: https://www.macrumors.com/2023/01/18/homepod-sound-recognition-software-update/ https://www.macrumors.com/2023/01/18/homepod-sound-recogniti...

tracker1 4y ago

They likely won't... but would really appreciate if, when hardware vendors EOL their products they'd release schema diagrams and protocol documentation. There's no reason you shouldn't get at LEAST a decade out of these. It's the main thing that has kept me from any kind of "smart home" integration at all. I wound up going with a security package from my cable company (kind of crappy cameras, tbh), but I'm not thinking in terms of ownership at this level. In the end, it's just disappointing in general how much churn there is in the tech space. Similarly, I'm not going to buy a fridge, or washing machine with a built in tablet, when they stop receiving updates in under a year usually. It's just really crappy as a race to the bottom. Either start with a rental/subscription model, or be prepared to maintain the product for a decade. Homes and cars aren't churned like phones.

gnicholas 4y ago
Yep, Rebble kept my Pebble running for many years after the company was bought. I finally gave up on it because the battery life got so short, and I don't trust myself to repair it decently. I loved that thing, and I'm so glad it was able to live beyond the acquisition of the company! Hopefully someone can figure out a way to do something similar for these devices.

1letterunixname 4y ago

And all of your cloud hardware investments will be worth nothing

squokko 4y ago

At this point, people who buy stuff from Google deserve what comes to them.