4 ms·

I'm pretty sure that's not at all what he's saying, he's just saying that the existing bitcoin network would serve as a net settlement layer for L2 systems, whi

by ericd 4y ago

I'm pretty sure that's not at all what he's saying, he's just saying that the existing bitcoin network would serve as a net settlement layer for L2 systems, which handle the much higher volume of everyday transactions. My understanding is that net settlement between banks is much less frequent than the capacity of BTC. Lightning (an L2 system on Bitcoin) is essentially a system of peer to peer exchange of signed BTC transactions, which supersede previous ones, but don't get committed to the main net. In that way, you can keep a running tab between counterparties with effectively no marginal cost until one of you decides to close the tab by committing it.

toast0 4y ago
There were 4,746 FDIC insured banks as of the end of Q3 2022, and 5,099 NCUA insured credit unions as of the end of 2020. If each of those institutions does net settlement with 200 other institutions daily, you've got roughly 1 million settlements a day (each settlement has two parties, so 100 * 10,000). Earlier in the thread, someone said BTC can do 3-7 transactions a second, which doesn't quite make it to 1 million transactions per day. Of course, I just made a wild guess about how many net settlements between banks would happen; maybe banks don't settle up from check clearing daily, but in a world where transactions are difficult to reverse and nobody trusts anyone, you'd want to settle up regularly.
- ericd 4y ago
  Thanks for running the numbers. The amounts in the channels are committed with those signed transactions, there’s no opportunity to double spend, so it’s fine to settle much less than daily, as long as the net flows are well balanced (big if). Transactions hop through the graph, you don’t have to have a running tab with more than a few other nodes.
- incrudible 4y ago
  Again, how many armored trucks are used for settlement each day? Probably not a million. The transaction limit on Bitcoin is artificial, the result of a negotiation between the miners, who provide the security and the users, who implicitly demand that security, by choosing Bitcoin over any other cryptocurrency. Ethereum on the other hand already processes a million transactions per day on L1.

by ericd 4y ago

toast0 4y ago

There were 4,746 FDIC insured banks as of the end of Q3 2022, and 5,099 NCUA insured credit unions as of the end of 2020. If each of those institutions does net settlement with 200 other institutions daily, you've got roughly 1 million settlements a day (each settlement has two parties, so 100 * 10,000). Earlier in the thread, someone said BTC can do 3-7 transactions a second, which doesn't quite make it to 1 million transactions per day. Of course, I just made a wild guess about how many net settlements between banks would happen; maybe banks don't settle up from check clearing daily, but in a world where transactions are difficult to reverse and nobody trusts anyone, you'd want to settle up regularly.

ericd 4y ago
Thanks for running the numbers. The amounts in the channels are committed with those signed transactions, there’s no opportunity to double spend, so it’s fine to settle much less than daily, as long as the net flows are well balanced (big if). Transactions hop through the graph, you don’t have to have a running tab with more than a few other nodes.
incrudible 4y ago
Again, how many armored trucks are used for settlement each day? Probably not a million. The transaction limit on Bitcoin is artificial, the result of a negotiation between the miners, who provide the security and the users, who implicitly demand that security, by choosing Bitcoin over any other cryptocurrency. Ethereum on the other hand already processes a million transactions per day on L1.