5 ms·

> Is software quality in decline? No, you just have a skewed memory of some time when software was "good". Remember Windows ME?

danybittel 4y ago
I somewhat disagree. As an avid Visual Studio user.. it's definitly gotton worse. A lot of little Editor UX things seem to stop working. Example: in C++, writing switch(..) on an enum would automatically default create all switch cases. Then later versions, it only occasionally did it, now it doesn't do it at all. Another example: When my application finishes and VS is activated, sometimes the cursor is in one window, but typing happens in another. Another example: In Windows 11, when resizing a window, the artifacts seem to have gotton worse. Sometimes even the whole window is flickering.
- bsuvc 4y ago
  There are better alternatives UX-wise for both of the examples you gave. Visual Studio -> Jetbrains. Windows 11 -> Linux (or Mac) While VS and Windows have gotten worse in recent years, other software like Jetbrains IDEs and Linux UX have gotten better.
  - danybittel 4y ago
    Well maybe. But these alternatives come with their own set of problems. I guess it's a tradeoff.. how much can a software degrade until you're willing to learn and deal with another set of problems. Unfortunalty, you kind of get used to UX quirks. I have to say though, all in all Win 11 is not as bad as people make it out to be. After turning off a few things, it stops getting in the way. I'm definitly going to have another look at Jetbrains though.
  - fhd2 4y ago
    Not sure why this is downvoted - I also have the experience that Linux on the desktop now vs 10 years ago is a much better experience, both UX wise (at least in general, though it's a bit subjective), but also in terms of stability. From what I've scrolled through so far, most examples people give of software that got worse is by Microsoft, though I wouldn't say it's limited to them. There seems to be a desperation for profit in commercial software right now like nothing I've seen in the past. There's usually alternatives worth a look though!
mustache_kimono 4y ago
OMG this! I grew up on Windows and only around XP did it begin to get okay. Before then it was mostly garbage, and after then it was Vista! I have my issues with modern MacOS, but it's generally pretty amazing. I feel like asking the same of these Jonathan Blow acolytes -- When exactly was this golden age? Are you sure it's not nostalgia? If your poison is Linux, do you remember what the Linux desktop looked like in the early 2000s? On the server, it's ridiculously more resilient and polished. FWIW I have tremendous respect for Jonathan Blow as a software engineer, but I think this has always been mostly a self aggrandizing pitch, from a craftsperson to people who like the idea of crafted things, that is -- if all the software in the world is getting worse, then there must be some priesthood of the worthy. When, in fact, the "bad" software Jonathan Blow sees is software produced simply under different constraints (expectation is software costs nothing, it must run everywhere/on the web, it's part of a distributed system, compatibility with earlier crappy software really matters, it's made by people who simply care less about the it being a perfect experience, because its not their game). Of course, some new software is actually bad, but I'm not certain software is actually getting worse.
d23 4y ago
Perhaps the best counterpoint in the thread. That being said, the exception proves the rule, and I never had issues with 95 or XP. It’s crazy how many basic pieces of OS functionality stop working for me in windows 10.

danybittel 4y ago

I somewhat disagree. As an avid Visual Studio user.. it's definitly gotton worse. A lot of little Editor UX things seem to stop working. Example: in C++, writing switch(..) on an enum would automatically default create all switch cases. Then later versions, it only occasionally did it, now it doesn't do it at all. Another example: When my application finishes and VS is activated, sometimes the cursor is in one window, but typing happens in another. Another example: In Windows 11, when resizing a window, the artifacts seem to have gotton worse. Sometimes even the whole window is flickering.

bsuvc 4y ago
There are better alternatives UX-wise for both of the examples you gave. Visual Studio -> Jetbrains. Windows 11 -> Linux (or Mac) While VS and Windows have gotten worse in recent years, other software like Jetbrains IDEs and Linux UX have gotten better.
- danybittel 4y ago
  Well maybe. But these alternatives come with their own set of problems. I guess it's a tradeoff.. how much can a software degrade until you're willing to learn and deal with another set of problems. Unfortunalty, you kind of get used to UX quirks. I have to say though, all in all Win 11 is not as bad as people make it out to be. After turning off a few things, it stops getting in the way. I'm definitly going to have another look at Jetbrains though.
- fhd2 4y ago
  Not sure why this is downvoted - I also have the experience that Linux on the desktop now vs 10 years ago is a much better experience, both UX wise (at least in general, though it's a bit subjective), but also in terms of stability. From what I've scrolled through so far, most examples people give of software that got worse is by Microsoft, though I wouldn't say it's limited to them. There seems to be a desperation for profit in commercial software right now like nothing I've seen in the past. There's usually alternatives worth a look though!

mustache_kimono 4y ago

OMG this! I grew up on Windows and only around XP did it begin to get okay. Before then it was mostly garbage, and after then it was Vista! I have my issues with modern MacOS, but it's generally pretty amazing. I feel like asking the same of these Jonathan Blow acolytes -- When exactly was this golden age? Are you sure it's not nostalgia? If your poison is Linux, do you remember what the Linux desktop looked like in the early 2000s? On the server, it's ridiculously more resilient and polished. FWIW I have tremendous respect for Jonathan Blow as a software engineer, but I think this has always been mostly a self aggrandizing pitch, from a craftsperson to people who like the idea of crafted things, that is -- if all the software in the world is getting worse, then there must be some priesthood of the worthy. When, in fact, the "bad" software Jonathan Blow sees is software produced simply under different constraints (expectation is software costs nothing, it must run everywhere/on the web, it's part of a distributed system, compatibility with earlier crappy software really matters, it's made by people who simply care less about the it being a perfect experience, because its not their game). Of course, some new software is actually bad, but I'm not certain software is actually getting worse.

d23 4y ago

Perhaps the best counterpoint in the thread. That being said, the exception proves the rule, and I never had issues with 95 or XP. It’s crazy how many basic pieces of OS functionality stop working for me in windows 10.