8 ms·

Toyota plug-in hybrids to offer 124-mile electric-only range

26 points by clouddrover 4y ago

lostmsu 4y ago
Could they have added the list of models? Ugh
t-writescode 4y ago
This sort of range is absolutely incredible; and, if they are pushing the electric motor as the primary motor, maybe the performance of the car, too, will be very good, rather than the terrible 0-60 times of a Prius.
- jacquesm 4y ago
  The terrible 0-60 times of a Prius are a feature, not a bug.
  - t-writescode 4y ago
    If a car has good throttle control options, a torquier or faster car can always operate in a similar way to a slower; but the opposite is not true. A car that 0-60s more slowly is only good at limiting someone with a lead foot.
  - kirykl 4y ago
    The even more sluggish post 60 acceleration can a safety problem on fast moving highways
    - sokoloff 4y ago
      I’ve driven a friend’s (non-plug-in) Prius a few times. It’s uninspiring but totally fine on the highway. Any Prius driver you see being a hazardous rolling roadblock on the highway is a Prius driver problem, not a Prius capability problem.
    - dsfyu404ed 4y ago
      In theory, sure. In practice it seems like if you give people one step forward in acceleration they get two steps picky about what gaps in traffic they need to do their thing (merge, left turn, whatever) resulting in a net decrease in the overall performance of the car + driver system.
    - jacquesm 4y ago
      There is no 'fast moving highway' where the acceleration post 60 of any modern vehicle that has a license plate is a problem. What is a problem is other drivers that make unrealistic assumptions about the capabilities of other vehicles. I've driven >> 1,000,000 million kilometers in 36 years of driving and to date I've never seen a single instance of the speed of acceleration being a safety issue. Even on short on-ramps - which is really the only spot where acceleration in normal traffic matters - almost every car will do just fine, and in case it doesn't you either stop or use the emergency lane (if that's allowed where you live). Above 60 you are already in traffic and the differences required to overtake another car are minimal, you can do it faster to be out of the left lane a bit quicker but you're still limited by the speed limit and traffic that comes up from behind will just have to be patient. What may be the case if this is a situation that you encounter frequently that the problem somehow lies with you and/or your driving style. Most people just want to get from 'A' to 'B' safely and economically, and speed of acceleration considerations don't enter into it at all. Given all the other vehicles that you share the road with, a large number of which are much slower to accelerate than a Prius ever would be the whole idea is to work together to keep everybody safe and get them home in one piece. Not to extract the maximum performance from their vehicles.
      - kirykl 4y ago
        Owned one. Had the issue. You’re wrong. Maybe a result of the CVT or low torque at speed not sure but it was unsafe. When you need power to get out of a situation and you floor it and 3 seconds later still nothing…
        jacquesm 4y ago
        That is simply a defect, not something structurally wrong with the Prius design. Did you have it checked out by a competent garage? Prius is a complex machine and needs proper care or it will break. I had a similar hybrid in Canada and it worked like a charm except for when it was < -20 Celsius, then all kinds of weird stuff would happen. Apparently the manufacturer had not really thought about the range of operating conditions that their product would be exposed to. So in the dead of winter when it was super cold acceleration would be underwhelming, but once you know that it is like that you simply don't put yourself in situations where this can be a problem. I've driven 2CV with an anemic 600 CC engine (there also existed an older one with only 375 CC) and it was perfectly safe in traffic, if you worked within the limitations of the car. In the end it is the driver that matters, not the vehicle and if you put yourself in a position where 'you need power to get out of a situation' you are most likely already at the end of a long string of mistakes. Keep in mind that there isn't a truck on the road that can accelerate as fast as a personal car and yet they are not constantly in danger because of a lack of power.
- dmurko 4y ago
  The new one has 7.1 0-60 which is pretty solid: https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a42229923/2023-toyota-prius-acceleration/ https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a42229923/2023-toyota-priu...
  - nanliu 4y ago
    That’s when both electric and gas motor are running. If you want to restrict to electric only and take advantage of the battery for short daily driving it will be significantly slower.
4pkjai 4y ago
I drove a Toyota Corolla Hybrid a few months ago. Loved the car.
- lostlogin 4y ago
  This as a wagon or a Camry wagon with plug in option. My ultimate. My ICE Corolla was bullet proof. I’d love some of that with a battery.
- asplake 4y ago
  I have one and am very pleased with it. Before that a Rav4 hybrid, one of best cars I have ever owned. I found Toyota’s past resistance to EVs embarrassing. This is a very welcome step.
  - robertlagrant 4y ago
    This is a plug-in hybrid, though? They've been selling a plug-in Prius since 2012.
    - VBprogrammer 4y ago
      I don't even know if this counts as a plug-in when it has an electric only range which betters electric cars of a few years ago. Maybe a whole new category electric cars with optional ability to use petrol.
      - masklinn 4y ago
        Not counting as a plug-in would mean it’s a reclaiming-only hybrid, not that it’s an EV. The entire point of a plug-in hybrid is that you can use it as a straight EV in a non-trivial subset of cases. > Maybe a whole new category electric cars with optional ability to use petrol. That’s usually called a range-extended EV, but that’s reserved for “series” architectures, which is not something Toyota wants to do. The Volt and i3 are probably the most well-known examples. The volt has a pretty short all-electric range (topped out at 50 miles on the second gen), the i3 was designed as an EV first so the range extended models had a more respectable 125mi all-electric, plus ~75 from the range extender (the straight EV model topped out at 150mi range). It was very much a transitional model though, both successors are only available as pure EVs.
delta_p_delta_x 4y ago
Or 200 km. Of course it's a nice, round number in SI.
zinckiwi 4y ago
This seems like the goldilocks zone to me. A day's urban driving comfortably, and fossil fuels for the very occasional long trip.
- ldarby 4y ago
  They haven't published the fuel tank size or non-electric range (at least, I couldn't find this info easily), so I'd expect it to be similar to the BMW i3's tea cup sized fuel tank.
  - ZeroGravitas 4y ago
    The i3 had it's fuel capacity artificially limited in the US due to some rule necessary to get subsidies. But I think the same pressure will apply, if they make it too big then it'll look like a regulation workaround.
    - ldarby 4y ago
      I wasn't even aware of the artificial limit (I'm in the UK), that's absurd... By "tea cup size" I meant the unrestricted 9 L tank.
- nolok 4y ago
  Not familiar with hybrid very much, but doesn't that mean essentially carrying the internals of two different engines, and thus double the maintenance risks just "for the very occasional long trip" ?
  - hytdstd 4y ago
    The prius is one of the most reliable vehicles on the road today. These are just priuses with larger batteries and more powerful electric motors.
  - endisneigh 4y ago
    No, that’s not how it works. Many are a variant of this: http://www.automd.com/news/2011/06/08/hybrid-vehicles/ http://www.automd.com/news/2011/06/08/hybrid-vehicles/
yardie 4y ago
> many BEVs’ batteries aren't used to their full potential very often. This means BEV drivers lug around redundant capacity and weight, And hauling around a whole ass ICE, fuel tank, cooling system, emissions and exhaust is better and also not a waste. Countries are pushing their emission standards down to 0. Where does even a tiny gas engine fit in that scenario?
- egil 4y ago
  Not to mention the required maintenance of said parts.
  - endisneigh 4y ago
    Modern ICE components don’t really require that much maintenance these days
    - yardie 4y ago
      You want to tell that to the Advanced Auto Parts, Pep Boys, Autozones of the world? That their business model in a few years is going to be rotating/changing tires and topping off wiper fluids? ICE cars (including modern ones) require so much maintenance they have entire franchises dedicated to the maintenance of those cars.
      - endisneigh 4y ago
        What percentage of cars on the road are brand new? You think BEV don't need brakes and rotors or have mechanical issues?
        yardie 4y ago
        BEVs almost never need new brakes. Regenerative braking means you rarely use the brake. There are only two times the actual physical brakes are applied: high speed deceleration and parking. And if you're doing the former that frequently you are a menace. Mechanical issues are not maintenance. The drive train on a EV is so simple that manufacturers have to invent new tools and procedures. EV techs are more likely to have an electrician or computer background than a auto mechanic background.
linsomniac 4y ago
People with plug-in hybrids: What do you do about gasoline aging out? Do you add Sta-Bil to most tanks? Do you just stop charging it after a few months to burn through the tank? Just curious.
- theshrike79 4y ago
  I think some PHEV cars forcibly run the engine to prevent that issue specifically.
- syntaxing 4y ago
  I usually let my engine run purposely every 3 months or so. I also try to only keep my gas tank half full.
- dsfyu404ed 4y ago
  Gasoline doesn't go bad that fast in a modern sealed fuel system and engines with modern electronic control systems that have a lot of latitude to adjust in real time are really forgiving. People are mostly projecting their experience with much more finicky lawn equipment to cars.
  - linsomniac 4y ago
    References? Because I'm seeing fairly recent discussions saying things like "gasoline starts to oxidize into varnish surprisingly quickly" and suggesting not letting gasoline sit for 6 months.
endisneigh 4y ago
I think this is the right strategy. People lamenting the extra gas engine components and their maintenance must not be familiar with the reliability of a modern (ICE) vehicle.
- brk 4y ago
  You're probably right about them not being aware of the reliability of ICE engines. But I don't see anyone mentioning how the ethanol-mix fuel, which is nearly unavoidable, can turn to shit in a few months of sitting and cause all kinds of engine issues. I'd be more worried about fuel issues over the long term if these truly become "a couple times a year" use cases. Ethanol fuel needs to be banned, IMO.
  - endisneigh 4y ago
    There are stabilizing fluids you can add that extends the life to years. If owners can’t be bothered to do that the car could be programmed to use fuel every 6 months to prevent the negative side effects (in the case of cars like the Pacifica PHEV and Prius Prime, this is what happens) The fuel issue is simply FUD. I’d be more concerned about BEV and range anxiety honestly. In Maine, for example, some Tesla owners reported the range being cut in half, during the winter. Simply unacceptable.
    - bsagdiyev 4y ago
      There are also, depending on the state, still gas stations that sell ethanol free fuel. The station up the street from me sells it but it is about 20 to 30 cents per gallon more expensive.
      - kcplate 4y ago
        I tend to get about 5% more mpg when I use ethanol free so for me so it offsets that additional cost a bit.
- jqpabc123 4y ago
  It is a strategy that is subject to being superceded very soon. Reliability is just one part of the problems with hybrids. Efficiency and cost are also less than optimal. A dual power train just costs more --- both initially and in terms of maintenance. There is no way around this. It is also a drag on efficiency --- for both long and short trips. On short trips, the electric power train has to drag around the ICE components. On a long trip, the ICE has to drag around the electric components. This strategy leaves the competition with a clear path to produce a lighter, more efficient, less expensive alternative. Any sort of battery breakthrough will kill this hybrid strategy. Rather than promoting or leading this breakthrough, Toyota is effectively betting against it --- primarily for cultural reasons rather than technological ones in my opinion.
syntaxing 4y ago
I own a PHEV and it’s crazy how much it increases your quality of life. It’s so nice to be able to do local errands on electric and if I use gas, I get over 40 mpg easily which is really good for a SUV so I get about 500 mile range on a single tank. I honestly think this car fits the bill for so many families in the US. It’ll sell really well as long as dealership stops being greedy.
christkv 4y ago
This change will make these models best sellers in Spain (outside of Madrid and Barcelona) as the charging structure is still massively primitive and this cover the commutes on electric during the week and the longer trips on weekends with a combination).
ZeroGravitas 4y ago
I'd rather see Toyota put it's money and engineering talent into making more and better batteries, but PHEVs were a cool stepping stone. Fast and easy electric charging on long trips is their Achilles heel. The better that gets the more pointless they are.
geokon 4y ago
Maybe someone who knows more on the matter could help me understand the efficiency problem. Wouldn't it be more efficient for long trips to run a small generator in the car that charged the batteries? A car engine needs to deal with variable power/torque/etc. It's got transmissions and radiators and all sorts of extra complexities. A generator runs at one speed and is efficiently tuned to that one speed. If you suddenly need more power to accelerate then that would be provided by the batteries. Batteries are like >90% efficient. So going motor->battery->wheels seems like you wouldn't loose much even in the worse case of coasting on the highway at an ICE's optimal speed. Generators are also generally simpler and smaller. You could envision one that you could pop into the frunk when you need extra range. It would continuously recharge your batteries as you drive - even before they're depleted. Even if it didn't recharge as fast as you were using up power - you'd still drastically increase your range. Forthermore you could leave it running overnight to charge your car if you're in some remote place with no charging stations Literally nobody has done this - so there must be some reason I'm overlooking :)
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- endisneigh 4y ago
  > Wouldn't it be more efficient for long trips to run a small generator in the car that charged the batteries? See the Toyota Prius. This is already what is done.
  - geokon 4y ago
    Oh, it is in effect kinda similar. Though it does it through gearing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive Not quite motor->battery->wheels. I guess to have the generator be removeable you need a much smaller engine as well
    - timbit42 4y ago
      I think the Chevy Volt is what you're talking about. You plug it in to charge and when the battery runs out, the engine runs to charge the battery so you can drive until the gasoline runs out. The engine isn't connected to the wheels at all. It only charges the battery as you drive.

26 points by clouddrover 4y ago

Could they have added the list of models? Ugh

This sort of range is absolutely incredible; and, if they are pushing the electric motor as the primary motor, maybe the performance of the car, too, will be very good, rather than the terrible 0-60 times of a Prius.

jacquesm 4y ago
The terrible 0-60 times of a Prius are a feature, not a bug.
- t-writescode 4y ago
  If a car has good throttle control options, a torquier or faster car can always operate in a similar way to a slower; but the opposite is not true. A car that 0-60s more slowly is only good at limiting someone with a lead foot.
- kirykl 4y ago
  The even more sluggish post 60 acceleration can a safety problem on fast moving highways
  - sokoloff 4y ago
    I’ve driven a friend’s (non-plug-in) Prius a few times. It’s uninspiring but totally fine on the highway. Any Prius driver you see being a hazardous rolling roadblock on the highway is a Prius driver problem, not a Prius capability problem.
  - dsfyu404ed 4y ago
    In theory, sure. In practice it seems like if you give people one step forward in acceleration they get two steps picky about what gaps in traffic they need to do their thing (merge, left turn, whatever) resulting in a net decrease in the overall performance of the car + driver system.
  - jacquesm 4y ago
    There is no 'fast moving highway' where the acceleration post 60 of any modern vehicle that has a license plate is a problem. What is a problem is other drivers that make unrealistic assumptions about the capabilities of other vehicles. I've driven >> 1,000,000 million kilometers in 36 years of driving and to date I've never seen a single instance of the speed of acceleration being a safety issue. Even on short on-ramps - which is really the only spot where acceleration in normal traffic matters - almost every car will do just fine, and in case it doesn't you either stop or use the emergency lane (if that's allowed where you live). Above 60 you are already in traffic and the differences required to overtake another car are minimal, you can do it faster to be out of the left lane a bit quicker but you're still limited by the speed limit and traffic that comes up from behind will just have to be patient. What may be the case if this is a situation that you encounter frequently that the problem somehow lies with you and/or your driving style. Most people just want to get from 'A' to 'B' safely and economically, and speed of acceleration considerations don't enter into it at all. Given all the other vehicles that you share the road with, a large number of which are much slower to accelerate than a Prius ever would be the whole idea is to work together to keep everybody safe and get them home in one piece. Not to extract the maximum performance from their vehicles.
    - kirykl 4y ago
      Owned one. Had the issue. You’re wrong. Maybe a result of the CVT or low torque at speed not sure but it was unsafe. When you need power to get out of a situation and you floor it and 3 seconds later still nothing…
      - jacquesm 4y ago
        That is simply a defect, not something structurally wrong with the Prius design. Did you have it checked out by a competent garage? Prius is a complex machine and needs proper care or it will break. I had a similar hybrid in Canada and it worked like a charm except for when it was < -20 Celsius, then all kinds of weird stuff would happen. Apparently the manufacturer had not really thought about the range of operating conditions that their product would be exposed to. So in the dead of winter when it was super cold acceleration would be underwhelming, but once you know that it is like that you simply don't put yourself in situations where this can be a problem. I've driven 2CV with an anemic 600 CC engine (there also existed an older one with only 375 CC) and it was perfectly safe in traffic, if you worked within the limitations of the car. In the end it is the driver that matters, not the vehicle and if you put yourself in a position where 'you need power to get out of a situation' you are most likely already at the end of a long string of mistakes. Keep in mind that there isn't a truck on the road that can accelerate as fast as a personal car and yet they are not constantly in danger because of a lack of power.
dmurko 4y ago
The new one has 7.1 0-60 which is pretty solid: https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a42229923/2023-toyota-prius-acceleration/ https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a42229923/2023-toyota-priu...
- nanliu 4y ago
  That’s when both electric and gas motor are running. If you want to restrict to electric only and take advantage of the battery for short daily driving it will be significantly slower.

4pkjai 4y ago

I drove a Toyota Corolla Hybrid a few months ago. Loved the car.

lostlogin 4y ago
This as a wagon or a Camry wagon with plug in option. My ultimate. My ICE Corolla was bullet proof. I’d love some of that with a battery.
asplake 4y ago
I have one and am very pleased with it. Before that a Rav4 hybrid, one of best cars I have ever owned. I found Toyota’s past resistance to EVs embarrassing. This is a very welcome step.
- robertlagrant 4y ago
  This is a plug-in hybrid, though? They've been selling a plug-in Prius since 2012.
  - VBprogrammer 4y ago
    I don't even know if this counts as a plug-in when it has an electric only range which betters electric cars of a few years ago. Maybe a whole new category electric cars with optional ability to use petrol.
    - masklinn 4y ago
      Not counting as a plug-in would mean it’s a reclaiming-only hybrid, not that it’s an EV. The entire point of a plug-in hybrid is that you can use it as a straight EV in a non-trivial subset of cases. > Maybe a whole new category electric cars with optional ability to use petrol. That’s usually called a range-extended EV, but that’s reserved for “series” architectures, which is not something Toyota wants to do. The Volt and i3 are probably the most well-known examples. The volt has a pretty short all-electric range (topped out at 50 miles on the second gen), the i3 was designed as an EV first so the range extended models had a more respectable 125mi all-electric, plus ~75 from the range extender (the straight EV model topped out at 150mi range). It was very much a transitional model though, both successors are only available as pure EVs.

delta_p_delta_x 4y ago

Or 200 km. Of course it's a nice, round number in SI.

zinckiwi 4y ago

This seems like the goldilocks zone to me. A day's urban driving comfortably, and fossil fuels for the very occasional long trip.

ldarby 4y ago
They haven't published the fuel tank size or non-electric range (at least, I couldn't find this info easily), so I'd expect it to be similar to the BMW i3's tea cup sized fuel tank.
- ZeroGravitas 4y ago
  The i3 had it's fuel capacity artificially limited in the US due to some rule necessary to get subsidies. But I think the same pressure will apply, if they make it too big then it'll look like a regulation workaround.
  - ldarby 4y ago
    I wasn't even aware of the artificial limit (I'm in the UK), that's absurd... By "tea cup size" I meant the unrestricted 9 L tank.
nolok 4y ago
Not familiar with hybrid very much, but doesn't that mean essentially carrying the internals of two different engines, and thus double the maintenance risks just "for the very occasional long trip" ?
- hytdstd 4y ago
  The prius is one of the most reliable vehicles on the road today. These are just priuses with larger batteries and more powerful electric motors.
- endisneigh 4y ago
  No, that’s not how it works. Many are a variant of this: http://www.automd.com/news/2011/06/08/hybrid-vehicles/ http://www.automd.com/news/2011/06/08/hybrid-vehicles/

yardie 4y ago

> many BEVs’ batteries aren't used to their full potential very often. This means BEV drivers lug around redundant capacity and weight, And hauling around a whole ass ICE, fuel tank, cooling system, emissions and exhaust is better and also not a waste. Countries are pushing their emission standards down to 0. Where does even a tiny gas engine fit in that scenario?

egil 4y ago
Not to mention the required maintenance of said parts.
- endisneigh 4y ago
  Modern ICE components don’t really require that much maintenance these days
  - yardie 4y ago
    You want to tell that to the Advanced Auto Parts, Pep Boys, Autozones of the world? That their business model in a few years is going to be rotating/changing tires and topping off wiper fluids? ICE cars (including modern ones) require so much maintenance they have entire franchises dedicated to the maintenance of those cars.
    - endisneigh 4y ago
      What percentage of cars on the road are brand new? You think BEV don't need brakes and rotors or have mechanical issues?
      - yardie 4y ago
        BEVs almost never need new brakes. Regenerative braking means you rarely use the brake. There are only two times the actual physical brakes are applied: high speed deceleration and parking. And if you're doing the former that frequently you are a menace. Mechanical issues are not maintenance. The drive train on a EV is so simple that manufacturers have to invent new tools and procedures. EV techs are more likely to have an electrician or computer background than a auto mechanic background.

linsomniac 4y ago

People with plug-in hybrids: What do you do about gasoline aging out? Do you add Sta-Bil to most tanks? Do you just stop charging it after a few months to burn through the tank? Just curious.

theshrike79 4y ago
I think some PHEV cars forcibly run the engine to prevent that issue specifically.
syntaxing 4y ago
I usually let my engine run purposely every 3 months or so. I also try to only keep my gas tank half full.
dsfyu404ed 4y ago
Gasoline doesn't go bad that fast in a modern sealed fuel system and engines with modern electronic control systems that have a lot of latitude to adjust in real time are really forgiving. People are mostly projecting their experience with much more finicky lawn equipment to cars.
- linsomniac 4y ago
  References? Because I'm seeing fairly recent discussions saying things like "gasoline starts to oxidize into varnish surprisingly quickly" and suggesting not letting gasoline sit for 6 months.

endisneigh 4y ago

I think this is the right strategy. People lamenting the extra gas engine components and their maintenance must not be familiar with the reliability of a modern (ICE) vehicle.

brk 4y ago
You're probably right about them not being aware of the reliability of ICE engines. But I don't see anyone mentioning how the ethanol-mix fuel, which is nearly unavoidable, can turn to shit in a few months of sitting and cause all kinds of engine issues. I'd be more worried about fuel issues over the long term if these truly become "a couple times a year" use cases. Ethanol fuel needs to be banned, IMO.
- endisneigh 4y ago
  There are stabilizing fluids you can add that extends the life to years. If owners can’t be bothered to do that the car could be programmed to use fuel every 6 months to prevent the negative side effects (in the case of cars like the Pacifica PHEV and Prius Prime, this is what happens) The fuel issue is simply FUD. I’d be more concerned about BEV and range anxiety honestly. In Maine, for example, some Tesla owners reported the range being cut in half, during the winter. Simply unacceptable.
  - bsagdiyev 4y ago
    There are also, depending on the state, still gas stations that sell ethanol free fuel. The station up the street from me sells it but it is about 20 to 30 cents per gallon more expensive.
    - kcplate 4y ago
      I tend to get about 5% more mpg when I use ethanol free so for me so it offsets that additional cost a bit.
jqpabc123 4y ago
It is a strategy that is subject to being superceded very soon. Reliability is just one part of the problems with hybrids. Efficiency and cost are also less than optimal. A dual power train just costs more --- both initially and in terms of maintenance. There is no way around this. It is also a drag on efficiency --- for both long and short trips. On short trips, the electric power train has to drag around the ICE components. On a long trip, the ICE has to drag around the electric components. This strategy leaves the competition with a clear path to produce a lighter, more efficient, less expensive alternative. Any sort of battery breakthrough will kill this hybrid strategy. Rather than promoting or leading this breakthrough, Toyota is effectively betting against it --- primarily for cultural reasons rather than technological ones in my opinion.

syntaxing 4y ago

I own a PHEV and it’s crazy how much it increases your quality of life. It’s so nice to be able to do local errands on electric and if I use gas, I get over 40 mpg easily which is really good for a SUV so I get about 500 mile range on a single tank. I honestly think this car fits the bill for so many families in the US. It’ll sell really well as long as dealership stops being greedy.

christkv 4y ago

This change will make these models best sellers in Spain (outside of Madrid and Barcelona) as the charging structure is still massively primitive and this cover the commutes on electric during the week and the longer trips on weekends with a combination).

ZeroGravitas 4y ago

I'd rather see Toyota put it's money and engineering talent into making more and better batteries, but PHEVs were a cool stepping stone. Fast and easy electric charging on long trips is their Achilles heel. The better that gets the more pointless they are.

geokon 4y ago

Maybe someone who knows more on the matter could help me understand the efficiency problem. Wouldn't it be more efficient for long trips to run a small generator in the car that charged the batteries? A car engine needs to deal with variable power/torque/etc. It's got transmissions and radiators and all sorts of extra complexities. A generator runs at one speed and is efficiently tuned to that one speed. If you suddenly need more power to accelerate then that would be provided by the batteries. Batteries are like >90% efficient. So going motor->battery->wheels seems like you wouldn't loose much even in the worse case of coasting on the highway at an ICE's optimal speed. Generators are also generally simpler and smaller. You could envision one that you could pop into the frunk when you need extra range. It would continuously recharge your batteries as you drive - even before they're depleted. Even if it didn't recharge as fast as you were using up power - you'd still drastically increase your range. Forthermore you could leave it running overnight to charge your car if you're in some remote place with no charging stations Literally nobody has done this - so there must be some reason I'm overlooking :)

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
endisneigh 4y ago
> Wouldn't it be more efficient for long trips to run a small generator in the car that charged the batteries? See the Toyota Prius. This is already what is done.
- geokon 4y ago
  Oh, it is in effect kinda similar. Though it does it through gearing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive Not quite motor->battery->wheels. I guess to have the generator be removeable you need a much smaller engine as well
  - timbit42 4y ago
    I think the Chevy Volt is what you're talking about. You plug it in to charge and when the battery runs out, the engine runs to charge the battery so you can drive until the gasoline runs out. The engine isn't connected to the wheels at all. It only charges the battery as you drive.