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The PSVR2 has persistence problems due to the pancake lenses taking up too much light. Basically the strobing can't be short enough (to not induce smear) becaus

by bullen 4y ago

The PSVR2 has persistence problems due to the pancake lenses taking up too much light. Basically the strobing can't be short enough (to not induce smear) because that would dim the picture too much. It makes everyone sick. The top of the line is still Quest 2, the display (120Hz) and fresnel lenses are better than most more expensive alternatives. And with DAS FrankenQuest you have comfort. Unfortunately Echo VR (the ONLY native game) closes in August! I do not expect the Quest 3 to deliver much benefit over the 2. Maybe the Quest 3 lite they are talking about. Surprisingly the Quest 2 is still DDR4 and has the same GFLOP as a 1030.

tanjtanjtanj 4y ago
The PSVR2 does not have pancake lenses nor persistence problems. It also has fresnel lenses and 120Hz refresh rate. I think there are only a couple headsets with pancake lenses at this point in time. Supposedly the PSVR2 has more advanced fresnel lenses than prior headsets of the same kind as well but I'm not versed enough in the technology to know.
- bullen 4y ago
  You are right, but maybe that was the reason they couldn't use pancake? HDR is the reason for this, they need more brightness, so they sacrifice low persistence. Also all AAA experiences on PSVR2 run at 60 FPS and re-project to 120 FPS. So it's actually worse then my initial comment. Echo VR does 120 FPS without re-projection on a 15W device vs. 60 FPS on PS5 at 350W!!! I have been sucking in too much VR news lately after a 7 year hiatus (not counting 3 HL:A playthroughs) so I confused all the info, thx for setting me straight!
  - tanjtanjtanj 4y ago
    I believe the persistence issues come up with games that use reprojection from 60fps. I don't think its an issue with the screen itself just based on the raw specs from the screen. I don't get motion sickness from the PSVR2 like I would occasionally with the Rift CV1 but again, I'm not super knowledgeable about any of the underlying technology.
tomxor 4y ago
I can attest to quest2 not being motion sickness inducing, although I don't have any comparative experience. There is also the issue of subjective motion sickness sensitivity that seems to conflate comparisons, some seem to get sick in any VR with certain games or environments, and everyone gets sick in some specific VR headsets. If you don't get motion sick easily, quest2 is pretty comfortable, and once you find some decent games it's unique and re-playable, more than a mere novelty. Lots of folks on HN seem to have tried one thing once at some point in time - either got motion sick or got confused why the onboard graphics sucked, and then just relegated the whole category to "still broken". VR works if you can be bothered to do as little research as you do for your next PC. > Unfortunately Echo VR (the ONLY native game) closes in August! I don't get what you mean by native though, there are loads of native quest games.
- bullen 4y ago
  I meant native as in compiled to fast/minimal native machine code, the other games are all Unity/Unreal potato VM games, all 263/266 of them... with GC = sickness. The Climbs are Cryengine which might not have GC but still is bloated to hell. Should have said "custom", but then that could also be misunderstood. In my experience (I made the first VR MMO: http://aeonalpha.com http://aeonalpha.com, with the wrong programming language!) high refresh rates in sensor reading (faked by Oculus/Valve) combined with locomotion that the brain does not immediately associate with human motion are the best solutions after hardware. But I will make my 3D action voxel MMO 3rd person just to make sure, if your head is the camera you wont get sick as easily, specially at 120Hz. 120 FPS at low persistence is the bare minimum if you want to not get ill from any smooth movement during long sessions = Echo VR is the ONLY game that is playable on Quest 2. Non-smooth movement games are more of a slideshow/shooting gallery; (see HL:A :S) akin to the early fixed space 3D games on cd-rom if you remember those, which funnily HL was the first (after quake that I never played) to break: I fondly remember me and my brothers jaws dropping simultaneously when we by mistake moved the mouse during the intro, we both 100% thought it was pre-rendered. The difference is now we have permanently peaked in hardware, so we need to solve things with software. I haven't tried "Tea for God" yet, kinda dreading the adb install since computers can get bricked when you do real work on them these days. Baffling that in 6 years, 1 billion humans (that could have bought a headset and built something) only managed to create 3 custom engines for VR: Source 2, Lone Echo and "Tea for God". Odds are not looking good.

by bullen 4y ago

tanjtanjtanj 4y ago

The PSVR2 does not have pancake lenses nor persistence problems. It also has fresnel lenses and 120Hz refresh rate. I think there are only a couple headsets with pancake lenses at this point in time. Supposedly the PSVR2 has more advanced fresnel lenses than prior headsets of the same kind as well but I'm not versed enough in the technology to know.

bullen 4y ago
You are right, but maybe that was the reason they couldn't use pancake? HDR is the reason for this, they need more brightness, so they sacrifice low persistence. Also all AAA experiences on PSVR2 run at 60 FPS and re-project to 120 FPS. So it's actually worse then my initial comment. Echo VR does 120 FPS without re-projection on a 15W device vs. 60 FPS on PS5 at 350W!!! I have been sucking in too much VR news lately after a 7 year hiatus (not counting 3 HL:A playthroughs) so I confused all the info, thx for setting me straight!
- tanjtanjtanj 4y ago
  I believe the persistence issues come up with games that use reprojection from 60fps. I don't think its an issue with the screen itself just based on the raw specs from the screen. I don't get motion sickness from the PSVR2 like I would occasionally with the Rift CV1 but again, I'm not super knowledgeable about any of the underlying technology.

tomxor 4y ago

I can attest to quest2 not being motion sickness inducing, although I don't have any comparative experience. There is also the issue of subjective motion sickness sensitivity that seems to conflate comparisons, some seem to get sick in any VR with certain games or environments, and everyone gets sick in some specific VR headsets. If you don't get motion sick easily, quest2 is pretty comfortable, and once you find some decent games it's unique and re-playable, more than a mere novelty. Lots of folks on HN seem to have tried one thing once at some point in time - either got motion sick or got confused why the onboard graphics sucked, and then just relegated the whole category to "still broken". VR works if you can be bothered to do as little research as you do for your next PC. > Unfortunately Echo VR (the ONLY native game) closes in August! I don't get what you mean by native though, there are loads of native quest games.

bullen 4y ago
I meant native as in compiled to fast/minimal native machine code, the other games are all Unity/Unreal potato VM games, all 263/266 of them... with GC = sickness. The Climbs are Cryengine which might not have GC but still is bloated to hell. Should have said "custom", but then that could also be misunderstood. In my experience (I made the first VR MMO: http://aeonalpha.com http://aeonalpha.com, with the wrong programming language!) high refresh rates in sensor reading (faked by Oculus/Valve) combined with locomotion that the brain does not immediately associate with human motion are the best solutions after hardware. But I will make my 3D action voxel MMO 3rd person just to make sure, if your head is the camera you wont get sick as easily, specially at 120Hz. 120 FPS at low persistence is the bare minimum if you want to not get ill from any smooth movement during long sessions = Echo VR is the ONLY game that is playable on Quest 2. Non-smooth movement games are more of a slideshow/shooting gallery; (see HL:A :S) akin to the early fixed space 3D games on cd-rom if you remember those, which funnily HL was the first (after quake that I never played) to break: I fondly remember me and my brothers jaws dropping simultaneously when we by mistake moved the mouse during the intro, we both 100% thought it was pre-rendered. The difference is now we have permanently peaked in hardware, so we need to solve things with software. I haven't tried "Tea for God" yet, kinda dreading the adb install since computers can get bricked when you do real work on them these days. Baffling that in 6 years, 1 billion humans (that could have bought a headset and built something) only managed to create 3 custom engines for VR: Source 2, Lone Echo and "Tea for God". Odds are not looking good.