4 ms·

The worst part is the stigma surrounding misfires, with some people even losing their jobs. Danish military is also using this gun in the no-safety version, and

The worst part is the stigma surrounding misfires, with some people even losing their jobs. Danish military is also using this gun in the no-safety version, and have had several misfires. The blame always goes on the users, never the gun.

digitalengineer 4y ago
If I'm not mistaking some Sig P320 models come without a safety switch. However, one could, you know, not keep a round in the chamber, especially if there is no safety switch... So yeah, the users does carry some of the blame.
- dolni 4y ago
  You should probably read up on why carrying a gun without a round in the chamber is silly.
  - giraffe_lady 4y ago
    Are you expecting to get into a quick draw shootout at the walgreens or what.
    - Rebelgecko 4y ago
      Yes. Especially considering that many of the people carrying these are first responders. https://www.kmov.com/2023/03/18/shooting-florissant-walgreens-leaves-1-injured/?outputType=amp https://www.kmov.com/2023/03/18/shooting-florissant-walgreen... https://www.fox13memphis.com/news/teenager-injured-following-shooting-at-walgreens-police-say/article_642051ba-24ac-5e79-940a-7c5fd306f922.html https://www.fox13memphis.com/news/teenager-injured-following... https://www.wdsu.com/article/two-people-dead-in-shooting-near-walgreens-in-gentilly-1674256558/42597641 https://www.wdsu.com/article/two-people-dead-in-shooting-nea... https://www.ksdk.com/amp/article/news/crime/fatal-shooting-lafayette-avenue-saint-louis/63-94756f2e-2cb3-46b2-9e95-ca34d91efb4c https://www.ksdk.com/amp/article/news/crime/fatal-shooting-l... https://www.11alive.com/amp/article/news/crime/person-of-interest-walgreens-peachtree-st-se-shooting/85-c3f30cc1-6692-46b7-a067-b7fc846f4eb2 https://www.11alive.com/amp/article/news/crime/person-of-int... https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/security-guard-walgreens-hollywood-shooting-murder-charge/168761/?amp=1 https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/security-guard-walgreens-...
    - tru3_power 4y ago
      No but in a moment of stress you can easily have a ND/malfunction/not have enough time to aim.
    - more_corn 4y ago
      Police drawing their weapons typically want to be able to fire immediately.
- lemcoe9 4y ago
  In general, handguns with active safety levers are considered less-safe than firearms without active safeties when being carried in proper holsters (ones where the trigger area is completely covered) because of the additional steps required to use the firearm when it is deployed. Having a pistol come out of the holster ready-to-fire is always going to be advantageous to having to remember to manipulate the safety lever, ensure the firearm is loaded, ensure the firearm is in-battery, etc. when the time comes.
  - jstarfish 4y ago
    > Having a pistol come out of the holster ready-to-fire is always going to be advantageous to having to remember to manipulate the safety lever, Just like not wearing seatbelts is safer, since you get thrown clear of the wreck? Officers get in waaaay more physical altercations than quick-draw duels at the OK Corral. Lack of safety switches is only more advantageous to the subjects they inevitably end up grappling with, who have one less step to deal with in removing the officer's service weapon and using it against them.
    - lemcoe9 4y ago
      And that is why police officers use Level 3 holsters. https://safariland.com/collections/level-3-retention-holsters https://safariland.com/collections/level-3-retention-holster...
- slowhand09 4y ago
  Your finger is the safety. Glock pistols have never had a safety. They have no higher rate of negligent or accidental discharges than pistols with safeties. If you are qualified to carry, a round in the chamber is what saves your life. Racking the slide(improperly) to load a round is the number one cause of jams. Nervous people tend to "ride the slide" which is pulling it back, then easing it forward. It should snap forward to strip the round from the magazine and chamber it properly.
AnonMessiah 4y ago
There is no discharge of a round with a misfire, at least US terminology, misfiring is synonymous with failure to fire, it happens when the hammer / firing pin is released but the primer is not ignited. There is a stigma around unintentional discharges for a good reason, because it is almost always a _negligent_ discharge and not an _accidental_ discharge, if someone NDs I do not want them around me and a firearm.
- giraffe_lady 4y ago
  This is minute gun nerd semantics people outside that world don't recognize or care about this difference.
  - AnonMessiah 4y ago
    and?
  - slowhand09 4y ago
    Nah. There are lots of knowledgeable and precise people who speak of things with the amount of specificity required to communicate the important details.
  - omniglottal 4y ago
    Accurate word use is correct. Inaccurate word use is false. People care about true and false statements. Please only refer to your own beliefs, as your statment is patently false.
  - more_corn 4y ago
    Sometimes the specific technical terms for things is important. Especially in the case of a safety hazard.
- jacobgorm 4y ago
  You're right I meant accidental discharges. Not a native English speaker, nor a gun nerd.
  - 4y ago

digitalengineer 4y ago

If I'm not mistaking some Sig P320 models come without a safety switch. However, one could, you know, not keep a round in the chamber, especially if there is no safety switch... So yeah, the users does carry some of the blame.

dolni 4y ago
You should probably read up on why carrying a gun without a round in the chamber is silly.
- giraffe_lady 4y ago
  Are you expecting to get into a quick draw shootout at the walgreens or what.
  - Rebelgecko 4y ago
    Yes. Especially considering that many of the people carrying these are first responders. https://www.kmov.com/2023/03/18/shooting-florissant-walgreens-leaves-1-injured/?outputType=amp https://www.kmov.com/2023/03/18/shooting-florissant-walgreen... https://www.fox13memphis.com/news/teenager-injured-following-shooting-at-walgreens-police-say/article_642051ba-24ac-5e79-940a-7c5fd306f922.html https://www.fox13memphis.com/news/teenager-injured-following... https://www.wdsu.com/article/two-people-dead-in-shooting-near-walgreens-in-gentilly-1674256558/42597641 https://www.wdsu.com/article/two-people-dead-in-shooting-nea... https://www.ksdk.com/amp/article/news/crime/fatal-shooting-lafayette-avenue-saint-louis/63-94756f2e-2cb3-46b2-9e95-ca34d91efb4c https://www.ksdk.com/amp/article/news/crime/fatal-shooting-l... https://www.11alive.com/amp/article/news/crime/person-of-interest-walgreens-peachtree-st-se-shooting/85-c3f30cc1-6692-46b7-a067-b7fc846f4eb2 https://www.11alive.com/amp/article/news/crime/person-of-int... https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/security-guard-walgreens-hollywood-shooting-murder-charge/168761/?amp=1 https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/security-guard-walgreens-...
  - tru3_power 4y ago
    No but in a moment of stress you can easily have a ND/malfunction/not have enough time to aim.
  - more_corn 4y ago
    Police drawing their weapons typically want to be able to fire immediately.
lemcoe9 4y ago
In general, handguns with active safety levers are considered less-safe than firearms without active safeties when being carried in proper holsters (ones where the trigger area is completely covered) because of the additional steps required to use the firearm when it is deployed. Having a pistol come out of the holster ready-to-fire is always going to be advantageous to having to remember to manipulate the safety lever, ensure the firearm is loaded, ensure the firearm is in-battery, etc. when the time comes.
- jstarfish 4y ago
  > Having a pistol come out of the holster ready-to-fire is always going to be advantageous to having to remember to manipulate the safety lever, Just like not wearing seatbelts is safer, since you get thrown clear of the wreck? Officers get in waaaay more physical altercations than quick-draw duels at the OK Corral. Lack of safety switches is only more advantageous to the subjects they inevitably end up grappling with, who have one less step to deal with in removing the officer's service weapon and using it against them.
  - lemcoe9 4y ago
    And that is why police officers use Level 3 holsters. https://safariland.com/collections/level-3-retention-holsters https://safariland.com/collections/level-3-retention-holster...
slowhand09 4y ago
Your finger is the safety. Glock pistols have never had a safety. They have no higher rate of negligent or accidental discharges than pistols with safeties. If you are qualified to carry, a round in the chamber is what saves your life. Racking the slide(improperly) to load a round is the number one cause of jams. Nervous people tend to "ride the slide" which is pulling it back, then easing it forward. It should snap forward to strip the round from the magazine and chamber it properly.

AnonMessiah 4y ago

There is no discharge of a round with a misfire, at least US terminology, misfiring is synonymous with failure to fire, it happens when the hammer / firing pin is released but the primer is not ignited. There is a stigma around unintentional discharges for a good reason, because it is almost always a _negligent_ discharge and not an _accidental_ discharge, if someone NDs I do not want them around me and a firearm.

giraffe_lady 4y ago
This is minute gun nerd semantics people outside that world don't recognize or care about this difference.
- AnonMessiah 4y ago
  and?
- slowhand09 4y ago
  Nah. There are lots of knowledgeable and precise people who speak of things with the amount of specificity required to communicate the important details.
- omniglottal 4y ago
  Accurate word use is correct. Inaccurate word use is false. People care about true and false statements. Please only refer to your own beliefs, as your statment is patently false.
- more_corn 4y ago
  Sometimes the specific technical terms for things is important. Especially in the case of a safety hazard.
jacobgorm 4y ago
You're right I meant accidental discharges. Not a native English speaker, nor a gun nerd.
- 4y ago